SalvorMallow

1 minute ago, JayBirdHawk said:

It just doesn't make good financial sense to me...nothing worse than bad cap management, then you end up giving up picks to move those contracts.

Not only cap management...Harris is worse than JC in basically every statistical category and is also 5 years older. He would be a substantial downgrade.

6 minutes ago, marco102 said:

Then good riddance.  I understand him wanting a bigger role, but what has he accomplished in the NBA not to give all out effort? 

To me, this was obvious. You don't have such a substantial drop-off in defense at his age by happenstance. He still has all of the physical tools. On offense, he generally looked like he was playing street ball out there.

4 minutes ago, aali34 said:

Yeah if Cam is gone, than I'm eyeing Gallo and Bogi since they have been iffy all year. Clint as well, but he can't be traded yet.

Here is the order of guys remaining in my opinion from lowest impact to highest. Dre. not included cause he was out.

• Lou - Unplayable and a ball stopper
• Dieng - Smart player with a variety of skills, but doesn't fit. Inconsistent.
• TLC - Ugh garbage. I hate him.
• Gallo - Unable to contribute on offense like last season and putrid on defense.
• Delon - Good defense and plays well when aggressive, but doesn't provide what is needed of him. Unfit for his role.
• Bogi - Inconsistent and tasked to do too much than he can handle.
• Kevin - Inconsistent and not aggressive enough. 
• Clint - Regressed from DPOY level last season. Touch is doodoo, but still an impact player. No longer superhuman
• OO - I love him. High impact with room to grow.
• JC - Great all around and floor raiser. Still has holes in areas, but usually reliable. 
• Trae - Superstar, has weaknesses but usually reliable.

Clint, Bogi, Gallo are probably all gone next season.

JC and Kev gotta watch their backs. Both guys' intangibles and character are their saving grace. They impact winning but have a limited ceiling compared to others.

Dre and OO are impact players who have high potential on both sides of the court. The highest value players outside Trae. Possible All-NBA defense. They're gone only for a superstar.

When you look at the team, a shakeup might be inevitable. Not enough impact play from key vets who you would expect it from.

The problem with unloading Clint is our wing rebounding is practically non-existant. Clint is a top3 rebounder in the league and we desperately need that when most nights our wings are lucky to have 5 rebounds between the entire rotation. This was front and center in the Miami game where we were out-rebounded 54-37 by the likes of Yurtseven, Herro, and Caleb Martin. 

5 minutes ago, Atlantaholic said:

Steve Nash, Jermain O'neal, Stephen Jackson off the top of my head.

Wow I just looked up Steve Nash and you are absolutely right. He was AWFUL for his first three seasons. He saw a big jump in production in his 5th season. Hopefully, like Nash, he comes back after he gets some seasoning and (unlike Nash) leads us to the promised land 

5 minutes ago, gurpilo said:

This trade is going to be remembered for years, Cam will be a star

Has there ever been a player that had such an awful first three seasons of their career which turned into a star? I can't think of any, but that doesn't mean they don't exist.

Just now, Atlantaholic said:

I agree he hasn't been good, but he's still 57% TS this season, and he's always been streaky so he can get hot at any time. He was playing very well before his COVID absence. Point is he's still a player. 

He's honestly the only player on the bench that can create his own offense besides K'von (1/5 games). Lou is completely done and the rest of the bench can hardly take more than a couple dribbles without getting stripped or fumbling away the ball.

4 minutes ago, AHF said:

I agree with bleach that Bogi/Gallo is so far from value for Simmons that the deal can't be centered on them.  They would have to be the throw ins with picks and other players providing the meat.

Do you do that deal if we have to throw in 3 FRPs? I think I still would, especially if one of them is the Charlotte pick.

3 minutes ago, TheNorthCydeRises said:

 

Then again, this may be Gallo knowing that Schlenk has him in his sights.  So he can talk a little free before he gets the boot.

Travis is going to be like . . . YOU'RE NEXT!!

 

You could definitely tell he feels that way. Did you see how hard he was playing against Miami? I even saw him drive coast to coast on one play (right into traffic...thankfully he got a bail-out foul call).

4 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

My big fear is that Simmons deal will see the exit of a wing they covet and Collins then Atlanta will add Harris too. That's a lot of money

Harris has one of the worst contracts in the league. If we take on that salary just to get Ben Simmons, we will be in a world of hurt for the foreseeable future. I'm praying for a three team deal.

D is about right. The protections are pretty bad, but I think the team gets better in his absence. Interested to see how he progresses over the next few years, but unless he is significantly better next year, we should have no regrets for this deal because we would trade him anyways and get way less for an RFA SNT or letting him walk.

1 minute ago, AHF said:

Literally just speak your mind and share your opinion on the trade and don't @ him or quote him is all Sothron suggested.  You can address him as long as you aren't trolling like we saw earlier but I think the suggestion is sensible here just as a matter of common courtesy towards a fellow squawker.

Nobody has said this is Supessquawk and nobody is trying to stop you from giving your opinion on Cam or the trade.

"Don't quote him but he can quote you" in a discussion forum is definitely a tough pill to swallow.

I think this move is helping to address the concern Gallo raised. Cam is the prototypical "When I get the ball I get mine" player, which could definitely disrupt the hierarchy.

Just now, nathan2331 said:

Too bad our "tough decisisions" don't bring us back a player who could help us win games.

Totally agree with this, but we can only get what is available.

3 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

LMAO! To the list you go

I still think Cam has a chance to be good, but he doesn't match our timeline. We made it to the ECF last year and we are now about to miss the playoffs. We have to make some tough decisions NOW.

Just now, nathan2331 said:

Is Knox a better player than Reddish?

Cam off of this team is addition by subtraction for winning at least over the next few years. He has a -14 net rating.

1 minute ago, nathan2331 said:

That's a good point about those previous deals, but Cam and 1.5 years on his contract is worth more than fodder to me. Unless he wanted out and Schlenk accomodated him before more drama ensued, this trade is just unnecesary. This puts more pressure on us to do another deal or else we just got worse for nothing.

There is no stat you can show me that justifies this sentiment.

4 minutes ago, RedDawg#8 said:

Literally, WTF did I walk in to today. I was so pissed after the game last night that I shut down all my basketball news until just now out of sheer boredom.

I tried to keep up with this thread and everyone's takes. Here is mine:

Cam was expendable to me. But not for nothing. I felt like he was the best bargaining chip that we had available based on upside and ability. I thought he was worth way more in a package deal for a big time player than what we got for him straight up (and Solo)

I am not particularly worried about him going to NY and killing it, mainly because he has always shrunk in the presence of RJ. RJ makes Cam turn in to a Beta dating back to their Duke days. I do not expect this to change now.

My money is on Cam going off against us every time we play him for the rest of his career, but that's about it. Until he gets a shot to be the main guy, he won't ever reach his full potential. Doesn't look like that will be he case in NY either. Thibs will totally unleash him defensively though. That much is for certain.

If I'm wrong I'm wrong. And good for him if so.

Either way, I'm not happy about this at all. All this chatter about teams calling for Cam over the last year or so, and this is what materialized.... yikes.

 

 

I keep wondering how people see Cam as a "1st option". Dude doesn't pass the ball and shoots ~40% from 2.

He takes about 25% of his shots from 10ft to the 3pt line and is hitting a whopping 25% on those shots.

Cam is 388/588 players in VORP.

156 in BPM

172/184 qualifying players in WS/48

161/184 AST%

162/184 TRB%

118/247 Ftr

127/187 TS%

129/184 PER

61 in USG%

He has been awful at nearly every aspect of the game but needs the ball in his hands to even be engaged. Sorry, but it was time to move on.

4 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Don't trade him, keep him and develop him and when he's a FA, either do a SnT or let him go like NO did Lonzo Ball

Its a catch-22. We complain about this team losing, and when we trade the worst (current) player on the roster for what he's (currently) worth, people get pissed. This is a win-now move with the hope that the FRP can be flipped for a win-now player like Simmons. 

If Cam stays on this roster, he continues to get minutes with a net rating of -14, dragging us deeper into the lottery and diminishing his own value.

1 minute ago, aali34 said:

Cam's presence is what afforded this team alot of patience and excuses in the name of a "young team developing".

My assessments are gonna be more critical now that the guy needing of patience and development is now gone.

Trae is 23

JC is 24

Huerter is 23

Hunter is 24

How are we not still a developing young team?

3 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Cam haters like Jeff will post a thousand times on some bullshit but avoid the fact that this was a garbage ass trash ass trade

This feels like when the Arizona Cardinals traded a 2nd round and a washed up RB for Nuk Hopkins. 

Travis got raped. 

What do you think we could have gotten instead?

Look at these On/Off stats for Cam. He has single-handedly been losing us games. He drops the team's eFG% by 7 and increases the opponents by 2!!!

Of course you have to consider who he is sharing the court with as he has mostly came off the bench, but he has been ghastly on both ends, especially from a team perspective. A black hole on O and a turnstile on D.

3 minutes ago, aali34 said:

The reality is that Cam has huge potential, but hasn't had positive on court impact to the level of Kevin, Dre, John, or OO. I wish it wasn't the case and still think he's gonna be a star.

It's gonna be an interesting season.

 

Or frankly, even compared to Lou, Gallo, or TLC.

12 minutes ago, nathan2331 said:

So just keep him then. He can still help us win games. If Hunter goes down, we're stuck playing TLC like a starter.

When has Cam helped us win games? He has the worst advanced stats of any player on the team including washed up Lou.