TheNorthCydeRises

That's a good assessment Doc. I definitely agree with what you said about our defense. With Bibby, the points are going to come, so now they feel that they don't have to grind every possession out on the defensive end.

Quote: Before the season Boston HAD NO BENCH. They added Cassell but it's still not the bench that I'm afraid of. It's the defense. Bibby makes ours worse and conspicuously there is no mention of a defensive statistic in your starting 5 comparison. Boston has the NBA's 2nd best scoring defense and the best team defensive FG%. In fact, their team defensive FG% is the best in the past 5 years! If we don't run or get easy buckets somehow, we are doomed to get blown out and swept. W Right on point Walter. There's no way you can just look at individual stats and determine that our starting 5 is better. And Boston is all about defense. Rondo vs Bibby is a wash. Bibby is better offensively, but he's streaky. Rondo might be 1st or 2nd team all-NBA defense this year. JJ vs Allen - slight edge to JJ, but Ray can definitely get it done. On some nights, Ray is better than JJ. Marvin vs Pierce - Pierce by a long shot. Smoove vs KG - KG by a long shot Horford vs Perkins - Horford, but Perkins is solid for what they ask him to do. In actuality, our starting 5 is nowhere near what Boston can put on the floor. The only shot we have of making this interesting, is if our backcourt plays as well as they possibly can, with everybody else just doing what they're supposed to do.

Quote: Sadly I have to ask but what is the format for the playoffs? Does the higher seed get 2 or 3 home games to start the series? I ask because I jsut tried to order tickets and it said Game 4... ? The format is 2 in Boston - 2 in Atlanta - Boston - Atlanta - Boston If you're ordering online, be careful to not misread what games you want. On the Ticketmaster site yesterday, it has listed Game 1 Home Game 1 @ Philips. That's really Game 3 of the series, but Game 1 for the Hawks at home . People should be careful not to order tickets to Game 3 Home Game 3, thinking that is the actual Game 3 of the series. If it goes that far, that would actually be Game 6 of the series in ATL.

Quote: Cue Dolfan or northcyde for saying some of the following: 1) Man, and you call yourselves fans? We are in the playoffs! 2) It's all the players' fault 3) We didnt want to lose 3 games in a row. That's why the bench didnt get more PT 4. Acie Law, Solo, and J Rich dont deserve more than 2:45 mins of PT right now. 2:45 should be enough. 5. Now is not the time to be developing players Oh wait, and my fave... 6. Everyone just needs to CALM DOWN! In 3...2...1... 1) nope 2) Partially, but I can see why they really weren't into this game. JJ only took 6 shots. That wouldn't happen in a regular game. 3) The bench didn't get more PT, because Woody knows that he's not going to use those guys. To me, these last 2 games looked like an audition for Salim to crack the rotation and to see if Marvin can be a primary scorer with the 2nd unit with Bibby and JJ out of the game. That's why he's logged heavy minutes the past 2 games. One of the things I've always said about Salim, is that he has the mentality of a go-to scorer, not a role-playing or spot-up shooter. He was pretty much the main offensive option when he was in the game, and shot the ball pretty well in that role. He's more of an old Earl Boykins "let me score by creating my own shot" type of player, than a Steve Kerr "let me catch and shoot when wide open" type of player. LOL . . Woody is a lot smarter than some of you realize. If he is indeed seeing if Salim can be a primary scorer off the bench, it might change the dynamic a little vs Boston. We really couldn't experiment with him like that, when we were making the playoff push, because he's too streaky. But if he plays 10 - 12 minutes in a game, and we can get 8 - 12 points out of him, it'll give Boston just a little something else to think about. 4) Acie deserved more time, but Solo and J-Rich don't. Barring an emergency, J-Rich and Solo shouldn't play at all. And if Woody is planning on going with Salim over Acie, Acie won't play much either. 5) That's right. No developing should be taking place right now. Players who can make an impact on the game should be the only ones playing. Salim's two game totals of 30 points in 47 minutes is the type of production that can possibly impact a game. But he has to come into a game and immeadiately make shots. He can't start games 1 - 4 FG. He has to start them 3 - 4 FG, to justify him getting more PT. 6) Yep . . calm down. And I was right when I said that last week, because I knew Indy wouldn't be able to get it done. And there's no reason to stress even a little about last night's game, because we could've easily beat that team if guys played their usual roles. JJ could've easily hung 30 on the Heat, instead of opting to take 6 shots. But there's obviously nothing I can type that can reduce the hysteria that some of you fans have. That's just what some of you do . . worry. The goal was to make the playoffs. We did that. Now we just have to view this series on a game by game basis. I don't think there is anybody that thinks we can beat Boston in this series, so people just need to sit back and see what happens. People shouldn't be stressing about possible coaches to replace Woody, players who may or may not be leaving, or any other issue that has been discussed TO DEATH on this board. Just sit back and enjoy the fact that we're in the playoffs, and that you'll be able to see your favorite team on national TV. No one thought the Nashville Predators could make their series vs Detroit interesting. The mighty Red Wings pretty much handled them the first 2 games of the series in Detroit. But when Nashville played them at home, they looked like a totally different team, and played their 2 best games of the year to tie that series at 2 - 2. Now they play a PIVITOL Game 5 in Detroit. If Nashville can pull a miracle and steal that game, they'll have a chance to close the series at home. That would be the absolute best case scenario for that team. At the very least, they'll have a chance to extend the series to 7 games. When Golden St stole that early game vs Dallas in the playoffs last year, it changed the dynamic of that series. I know you can't stop worrying, so I'll address this to the others: Let's just see how this plays out. Because the one thing we do have going for us, is that JJ and Bibby haven't shot well vs Boston this year. If that trend continues, we'll probably get swept. If they're able to get it going, the series will get VERY interesting.

Quote: We cannot compare the SAR, Big Dogg, Ratliff, and JT team to this one. The current squad only has two veterens, a rookie PF playing center, and guys who haven't been in the league more than 4 years. SAR, Big Dogg, and Ratliff were in their prime. Our guys are still learning how to play the game. I agree. I guess now, people will start complaining more about us not being a legit contender, seeing that can't complain about us making the playoffs. Then it will go to us not being a championship caliber team. We had to crawl before we can run a marathon. Ish, we just started to walk..

Man please. That 02 - 03 team was projected by most of the media to be a top 6 team in the East that year. Some even had us top 4. That team underachieved big time. Big Dog didn't make the all-star team while in ATL, but he made it 2 years earlier, when Milwaukee went to the ECF. And he was still one of the top shooters in the league in that first year with us. That team should've won 50 games. These Hawks, at the most, would win 43 - 45 games. That 02 team won only 9 road games.

Quote: You make interesting points, but you are crazy as hell if you think running a 7 man rotation is the norm in the NBA during ANY stretch of the season--especially the regular season. That's what causes fatigue and players being gassed late in the season and in 4th quarters. Y Phoenix, before they got Grant Hill last year, used to only go 7 deep, with the other guys playing spot minutes for people in foul trouble. A lot of teams only go 8 deep. Before the Bibby trade, the Hawks routinely went 8 - 9 deep. He only went to the 7-man + filler rotation after we fell more than 10 games under .500. The fact is that for the vast majority of the year, when JJ went out of a game, the offense suffered mightily. If guys like Salim and Acie could consistently play like they did last night, this wouldn't even be an issue. They'd be playing. You can say the same thing about our defense, when Smoove goes out of a game. IF Zaza or Solo could consistently defend and rebound, they'd play a lot more too. But every one of those guys, with the exception of Chill, can't be trusted to play regular minutes every night because they're so inconsistent. And deep down, you guys know that. People have been bytching about Salim's shot selection, Acie's passiveness, and Zaza's turnovers and non-existant defense all year. In Salim's case, those complaints have been going on for 3 years. There might come a time in this series where we'll definitely need a Salim, an Acie, or a Zaza to come up big for us. But I want JJ, Bibby, and Smoove to be on the floor 75% - 90% of the time, with Horford, Chill, and Marvin on the floor around 75% of the time as well. You don't cut the minutes of those guys, just to give Salim, Solo, or Jeremy Richardson more PT. Zaza plays because Woody basically has no other choice but to play him. If Lorenzen Wright were still on this squad, he may very well opt to play him over Zaza. It was so funny to see some of you whine and cry about Woody opting to keep Bibby and Smoove out the game in the 2nd qtr of that Boston game. Woody goes with Salim and Solo, and they virtually do nothing. Then people get all over Woody for keeping Bibby out of the game. Well . . if you want Salim to play, he has to play AND contribute when Bibby is on the bench. You can't have it both ways. When those bench guys get in the game, they have to do the job they're supposed to do, no matter if they play 4 minutes or 14 minutes. We don't have 28 minutes ( or even 18 minutes ) to give Salim on a nightly basis. If he can't make a contribution in 3 - 4 minute spurts, then he basically become useless to us.

Quote: its easy i dont see why woody havent gotten it yet. u put salim n for joe at the begining of the 2nd un til the 7:00(maybe earlier if it gets out of hand) and put acie in for bibby at the 3:00 of the first until the 8:00 of 2nd im a genious He was doing that with Acie after he came back from the 2nd injury. Acie needs to be surrounded by shooters and finishers to truly be effective right now. The only way that happens, is if Woody plays him exactly like he used to do Royal Ivey . . at the first 5 minutes of each half. Acie didn't play well, so Woody went away from him. It's simple as that. No conspiracy theories. Nothing like that. The crazy thing about all of this, is that we're 13 - 8 in our last 21 games . . yet . . the fan base finds major fault in the fact that Woody shortened the rotaton. We have to be the ONLY fan base in the NBA, that want our 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th, AND 12th man on the roster to get nightly playing time. It's incredible the whining that goes on here for scrub players. Like I always say . . .Everybody Can't Play. . . . and everyone won't play. . . . nor should they play. Woody will go with his set 7-man rotation. Any other guys that play, will probably play only spot minutes, unless people get in foul trouble. I could see Salim or Acie playing 10+ minutes in a particular game, depending on the matchup. But both should never play more than 10+ minutes in the same game. It'll be either/or. West, will get his 20 seconds of PT to spell JJ at the end of the 1st half. Solo and J-Rich should never play. I'm not in favor of taking any minutes from our main 6 guys, just to play those inconsistent bench players. No way in hell.

Quote: Of course, Bibby and Joe back in and the Hawks start losing again! LMAOOOOO !!!!! Right on (( bleepin )) cue. He just couldn't help himsef.

Quote: [ What a novel idea, keeping your players fresh during a long season by playing your bench! Joe Johnson and Mike Bibby sat the entire 2nd quarter and the Hawks came from 8 down to take a 4 point lead. I guess Woodson has been saving this secret weapon for the playoffs. You are so Dumb Woody! LOL @ this dude. The same one that was on a one-man campaign to rip JJ every chance he got. I hope Salim and Acie don't have bad 2nd halves. You might rip them like you did JJ.

Thank you for saying that. Very few of those cats played defense back then. You didn't have the defensive schemes you have now back then either. But the major reason why guys like Chamberlain and Russell completely dominated back then, was because they were far and away athletically superior than the vast majority of the guys they played against. It would be like putting Amare or KG as they are right now, and have them play against current Ivy league competition. People have to remember that the best basketball players didn't play against each other back then, like they do now. Not even close.

They gotta keep that defensiv effort up though. Charlotte up 5 with 5 minutes to go

Intreresting that he opted to go with Salim instead of Acie.

Dolfan, it is a shame, isn't it? I bet people don't even realize that they do it sometimes because they've been used to this team losing for so long and complaining about everything. And absolutely everything Woody says and does, is spun into some negative comment. Damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. He gets no credit for this team playing well of late, but all the blame for the 4 losses. Gotta love that. As for Woody running his starters into the ground, that's a moot point these days. He may be content to do like Mike D'Antoni in Phoenix does, and just go with a 7-man rotation. If you have a weak bench, you might as well roll with the guys who far and away play the best. Bibby's ability to man the point for 35 - 40 minutes a night ( whenv healthy ) has really enabled us to interchange all of our versatile SFs, and play them more in their natural positions. - Smoove @ PF and C - Marvin @ SF and PF - JJ @ SG and SF - Chill @ SF and SG When Bibby sits for about 3 minutes, he's opting to let Chill or JJ initiate the offense from the point, instead of letting Acie or Salim do it. Some of you may not like that. I don't like it for Acie's sake. But it may be what is best for the team. Right now, development must take a backseat to winning.

Quote: Well Doc Rivers DID go on record saying that they will play this like it was a playoff game... At least that's what I remember reading. It would make NO sense for them not to really... Seeing as how we are the most likely opponent for them in the first round. I'm not surprised he'd coach the game seriously. It's like I was saying yesterday. Boton should use tomorrow night's game as a statement to us that we have NO SHOT at even competing in the series. The Hawks, on the other hand, will be sky high for the game because they want to do the opposite, and prove to Boston that the series will not be a cakewalk. It's easy to forget that we had the lead against team up in Boston at halftime. Also remember that JJ shot like 25% from the field that game as well. He and Bibby didn't have good shooting games. I'm already on record of saying, before tonight's game, that we'll beat Botson tomorrow.

Quote: Indiana might get within a half game of us after tomarrow. we got boston they got charlotte. How about having some confidence in your favorite team for once. If it's any game on the schedule that they'll be sky high for, it'll be the game tomorrow night. Some of you fans kill me with your pessimism all the time. That's 11 out of 15 folks . . . the best stretch of ball since December, and the best stretch in about 9 years Just one time have faith in your team to get it done. Just one (( bleepin )) time !!

Quote: http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives...for_nba_to_act/ Everyone think just because the East is down right now. All of the sudden the entire playoff system should be overhaul just like that. I didn't see anyone calling for this before. Right now the East is weak as hell. It will eventually get itself going in the right direction. If his team would play some damn defense, he wouldn't have to worry about the playoff seeding. That team can't stop anybody, because they have no concept of defense, other than playing the passing lanes.

If people would trade Smoove for Gasol, they should definitely be more than willing to trade him for Brand.

Quote: Bottom line is we don't automatically clinched a playoff spot if the Hawks win 2 out of 4. Woody said the Hawks will automatically clinched a playoff spot if the Hawks win 2 out of 4. Woody is wrong. End of Discussion. Woody is always wrong, until he proves people right. So when the Hawks win 2, and we get in, he'll say . . . "see . . . nothing to worry about". Here's a prediction. We'll have 2 wins by Monday, and be in the playoffs.

Quote: Answer 1: Indy could very easily win out their last 4 games. They have owned Philly the whole year, you know they will kill NY and Charlotte and they can beat Washington. So my answer is yes they could very easily win out but it will be tough. Indy is 4 - 1 vs both Philly and Washington. They're 1 - 2 vs Charlotte. They are perfect vs the Knicks. So I can see where you're coming from, a little. But . . . . . . they haven't beaten a team over .500 since the end of February ( Toronto ). They've only beaten 2 teams over .500 in 2008 at the time they played them ( Toronto and Golden St ) and they haven't played Philly since they've gone on their hot streak. Philly was 10 games under .500 the last time Indy played them. And they've played all of those Washington games without Arenas on the roster. They're two totally different teams these days. Quote: Answer 2: Honestly i don't know at this point. The only game i'm sure we should win is against Miami but we could easily lose @ NY and at home against Boston and Orlando. I just can't trust this team after that AWFUL loss against Indiana tuesday where all this would be a moot point if we just came out and handled our business. But no we have to choke! I'm sorry, but that's terrible. The same argument of "ownage" that you use to justify Indy beating both Philly and Washington, is "unsure" when it comes to New York, Orlando, and Miami? We're a combined 8 - 1 vs those teams. And the one game Orlando did beat us in, they had to his 15 threes to do it and score 74 points in the 1st half. Yet, "you don't know" if we can get it done? People . . . please have confidence in your Atlanta Hawks. The 4 games they've lost in the past 4 weeks, were all against teams in desperation mode. And all of them were on the road. Just show more faith in your Hawks.

Quote: What you are saying is that being up by 4 with 10 seconds to go gives you the same odds of losing as the odds of Indiana winning 4 in a row or Atlanta losing more than 2 of 4 games. Yeah, pretty close. When you look at who we have to play and the place and situation we have to play them in, compared to Indy's. Yeah, those are pretty much long shot odds. Quote: I don't buy that for a couple reasons. First, as other have said, "clinch" means eliminating any mathematical possibility of failing to reach the playoffs. Maybe Woodson misused the term. If so, he was just saying that we will clinch for all practical purposes with 2 wins. I think he missused the term, like you said. Our magic number to "clinch" is indeed 3. Than can happen 4 ways - Hawks win 3 - Hawks win 2, Indy loses 1 - Hawks win 1, Indy loses 2 - Hawks go winless, Indy wins 1 The scenario of the Hawks winning 2, while Indy loses at least 1, is by far and away the most likely scenario to happen. That's why I believe that Woody believes that two wins basically "clinches" the spot for us, even if it doesn't technically do it until Indy loses ( which will probably be tonight ). Quote: I don't like hearing my head coach say that, though because: Second, the odds are extremely low of losing a game while up by 4 with 10 seconds to go. You can probably only find a handful of examples of this happening in all of college basketball this year. True Quote: In contrast, the odds of Indiana winning 4 in a row aren't so bad. They have already done it 3 times this season and they have a good schedule down the stretch to do it. The odds of are not comparable to Indy running the table. False. Indy has only won 4 in a row one time this season, from March 17 - 22 when they beat NY, Charlotte, Minnesota at home, and Chicago on the road. If they win tonight, it will be the 2nd time they've done it. If they win out, they'd have won 7 in a row, and 9 out of 10 to close the season. http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/teams/schedule?team=ind Quote: Likewise, the Hawks have lost 3 of 4 numerous times this year (at least ten times without double using any losses). The schedule is hardly open and shut either given that we have lost to loser teams like Seattle, Milwaukee, etc. Ehhh . . yes and no. While we have lost 3 of 4 numerous times, we're a perfect 6 - 0 vs Miami and New York, and 2 - 1 vs Orlando. That's an 8 - 1 record vs those 3 teams. It's not an open and shut case . . but it's damn near one. And we've done something that Indy hasn't done, and that's win 5 in a row. Matter of fact, we've done it twice. I'll say it again. If we can't beat the Knicks and the Heat, we don't deserve to be in the playoffs anyway. Having said that, I'd be shocked to see the Knicks just lay down and die for us. We'll have to fight to win. But we should win. Quote: In short, Woodson should not be taking anything for granted and should be acutely aware of what his team needs to ensure itself a playoff spot this year. The situation isn't dire but as the coach of the team you better have your finger right on the spot. I agree. I just think that people are way too dramatic about everything that Woody does, so I like to mess with them a little about it. If Woody only washed his hands for 15 seconds, people would be all over him, telling him that he needs to wash his hands for 20 seconds, to kill all of the germs. People don't realize that we're playing some of our best ball in 9 years recently. They act like we're in the midst of a 7-game losing streak. I'm just trying to get people to enjoy the fact that this team is about to make the playoffs, and they won't find a way to blow it. But it's hard to shake the loser mentality, when you've lost for so long.

Quote: You are a fukcing retard. According to you if he believes Indy won't win out and he believes that we will win 2 games, he should just go ahead and declare that we've clinched a playoff spot. I'm not wasting any more time on you. Clinching has a defined meaning no matter how you try to spin his mistake. I'll disregard the insults, and ask you again: Do you believe that Indy will win out? Do you believe that the Hawks will NOT win 2 games? Simple questions Lascar.

LMAO . . that's hilarious. Watch ZaZa go for 14 points and 11 rebounds tonight. He'll be a man possessed. And no way Solo beats up ZaZa. Solo might hack him to death with one of his karate chop fouls, but ZaZa would win the fight. Solo probably started it, but is trying to play innocent. Hilarious though.

Quote: You are being such an tool. Clinching a playoff spot is not a vague term. Our magic number is 3 because with 3 wins we clinch. Or 3 Indy losses. That is why 3 is the magic number. It is a fact that right now we need 3 to clinch. If Indy loses, we only need 2. Do you know what clinching means? it means that you are 100% guaranteed to make the playoffs. Did you even hear the interview, or do you just make whatever assumptions are necessary for you to keep defending Woody? He clearly either didn't know the situation or was mis-speaking, and thought that we needed 2 wins to clinch. He did not say 2 wins should get us in the playoffs. He said we need 2 to clinch. Two entirely different statements. Go HERE. Do you see the X/Y/Z's that stand for "clinched playoff berth"? If Indy runs the table we will not get one of those with 2 wins. Or maybe he believes that there's no way Indy will win out, and all we have to do is win 2. You guys are absolutely convinced that the guy is clueless in every aspect of coaching and about this team, that you'll tend to blow every little thing he says or does out of proportion. Question 1: Do you believe that Indy will win out? Question 2: Do you believe the Hawks won't win 2 games? Simple yes or no to each question.

Quote: That is just dumb. The Hawks do not clinch by winning two games. Period. Whatever the odds may be do not excuse Woody's stupidity. Hollinger currently has us at 90.2% to make the playoffs. I guess because Woody doesn't count the vague 9.8%, then he's an idiot. If the weatherman told me there was a 90% chance of rain, I'm making sure I have my raincoat on.