TheNorthCydeRises

It happens when the goal of some teams are to rebuild. That team then unloads stars and good players, and the Lakers say "thank you berry, berry, much". Hell, it's the same formula that the Nets are using. They saw an opportunity to get a good player, and they sent all of their scraps to Atlanta. And the Hawks couldn't wait to unload Joe Johnson. Meanwhile, they're thinking and talking big in Brooklyn, while the Hawks have now lost out on their #1 free agent target for next summer, and probably don't know if they want to keep rebuilding, or tear it completely down. The Lakers have always been predators. They know superstars want to play in LA, and especially for the Lakers. The prestige of being a Laker is maybe only 2nd to the prestige of being a Celtic. They aren't scared away by Luxury Tax penalties, because they know they can always make boatloads of money to cover that expense. Most teams are scared to death of the Luxury Tax. The new CBA will do nothing to stop this from happening.

More than anything, Denver needed a perimeter defender to go up against all of those high quality SGs and SFs in the West. Iggy gives them that, plus an extra playmaker . . and an elite finisher on the fastbreak.PG - LawsonG - IguodalaF - GallanariPF - FariedC - McGeeNot a championship squad, but a dang good lineup that will keep them competitive.

Laker fans are estaticSixer fans are smiling from ear to earDenver fans are mostly happyOrlando fans are like WTF?And Hawk fans . . some are sad, some are like ol well.Just glad all of this is over.NOW Mr. Ferry . . . what is the game plan?

Please pay attention to history Sir. These are the Lakers we're talking about. A franchise that has only missed the playoffs 5 times in their ENTIRE HISTORY. That is a franchise that free agents gravitate toward. Dwight will sign an extension, Kobe and Nash will get old, and the Lakers will simply do what they've always done . . . RELOAD. And it'll always be some superstar free agent that will be longing to play for that franchise. Hell, it could easily be Kevin Love that is a Laker 5 years from now. Or a guy like Rajon Rondo. Or a Rudy Gay. Or even an Al Horford. As long as they're the Lakers, and have a superstar on their team, they'll have no problem reloading and still playing at a championship level.

If Ferry can get Jerry Sloan here, that would be a BIG TIME culture change type of move. He'd turn either Josh Smith or Al Horford into a better basketball player.

Seriously . . . why would you believe this? When has Dwight even remotely said that he MIGHT play in Atlanta at any point in his career? On the flip side, he's flat out said that he DOESN'T want to play in Atlanta. If that dude wanted to play here, he ( or his agent ) would've said or leaked it, and the Hawks would've been breaking their necks to try to get it done. ( I guess they would've ) It is not Josh Smith's duty to "recruit" Dwight. It is the job of the GM to put together an attractive enough package to entice the Magic to trade him to us. I mean, it is OK to "dream" . . . but don't have hallucinations.

In other words, the Hawks need a superstar to bring the fans out . . . period. Because if we really have to win or contend for an NBA championship for the fans to finally get behind the team, the next 6 years may be a failure as well. Having a very good, All-Star caliber, but boring and non-athletic Joe Johnson wasn't good enough to bring them out Having a slam dunk champion, who is also a dynamic in-game dunker and shot blocker in Josh Smith wasn't enough Having a guy who many consider to be a top 5 Center in the league in Al Horford wasn't enough Winning 34 home games in a season in 2009 - 10 ( 2nd most in franchise history ), wasn't enough So while the Hawks were trying to develop a "culture" around those 3, the real thing they should've been doing was trying to shop ALL OF THEM for a superstar. Because if the Hawks actually have to play in an NBA Finals for the fans to come out, I don't know if they'll ever come without that superstar. It's a shame what excuses we'll make for the fans ( die hard or casual ) not coming out, when non-playoff, non-superstar teams like the Raptors and Warriors routinely outdraw us on a yearly basis. Even a horrible Wizards and Cavaliers team outdrew us last year. But I guess they have more "hope" and star power than we do I guess. If that's the case, trade Josh Smith or Al Horford for Kyrie Irving or John Wall.

he = be? I've been saying that ( and gotten ripped for that ) . . for years. The fans want to wait on us acquiring that superstar player, for them to unconditionally support the team. That's all well and good. The fact is that sometimes, that just doesn't happen. So what then? Do you continue to sit home and complain about a good but not great team? Do you continue to complain about what the franchise is or isn't doing, while you spend nothing to support the product? Fans gotta understand that this is a 2-way street. As Gray Mule pointed out, the Hawks are absolutely TERRIBLE with the way they market the team and it's players. Johnson, Smith, nor Horford have ever been promoted the way they should've. From a marketing standpoint, they've been more concerned about getting fans to come to see OTHER stars around the league, than to promote their OWN STARS as players that people should come to watch. Even our presence on Youtube is miniscule, compared to what other teams are showcasing and doing for their players. I've never seen anything like this done for ANY Hawks player But the fans do have to start supporting the HAWKS more . . not just show up to Hawks games because they're playing another team's superstar. Maybe Ferry's "small ball" team can bring more fans out. But they'll only come out if the team is winning. And even at that point, the Hawks must market the team in the right way, and the fans must support that team.

The trick for the Bengals is to now get to that next level. That elite level of play. With 2 playoff appearances in the last 3 years, but with no playoff victories, the goal is to get to that next level of play. The Falcons are at that same point.And it's ironic how some of you talk about the Falcons . . like they are light years ahead of the Hawks. In reality, they're in a worse place than the Hawks, because they've actually had a team that people thought were "championship material", only to crash and burn against a team that barely made the playoffs ( but went on to win the Super Bowl ).A 43 - 21 record the last 4 years for the Falcons. 3 playoff appearances. 1 division title. But 0 - 3 in the playoffs, being outscored 47 to 102 in those games ( 23 to 72 in the last 2 playoff games ). But because people LOVE the NFL and give the Falcons a pass, those FACTS are somewhat glossed over, and the Hawks were made out to be worse ( when they actually weren't ).Matt Ryan is essentially Joe JohnsonMichael Turner is essentially Al Horfordand John Abraham is essentially Josh SmithGood but not great players who have been unable to get the Falcons to the next level.Right now, who knows what Ferry brings to the table. What we HOPE, is that he brings the type of winning culture that we see in San Antonio. But even THAT culture didn't begin, until Tim Duncan arrived. They also needed that superstar ( combined with the one they already had ) to get to "championship level".If Ferry doesn't build this "house" right, the Hawks may be worse off in the long run. We'll get a good idea after next summer if we're headed in the right direction.

The culture change is what took place with the Cincinnati Bengals, when they hired Marvin Lewis.That franchise was about 10 years behind the times with the way they did things, from scouting, to the facilities the players worked out in. One of the stipulations in Lewis taking the job, was for him to bring the Bengals into the 21st century of doing things. He came from a championship organization ( Baltimore Ravens ), and wanted to do things more like how the Ravens did it.From 1991 - 2002 . . . ( 12 seasons )- the Bengals were 55 - 137. That's an average yearly record of around 4 - 12 ... 5 - 11. - No winning seasons during that stretch, with 11 of those seasons being sub-500 ( best season was 8 - 8 ).- No payoff appearances. - No free agents wanted to go there.- Constantly missed on draft picks, with some becoming horrific busts ( QBs David Klingler and Akili Smith being the worst of the bunch ). - The players that they did draft that became Pro Bowl caliber players, didn't want to stay there.- And the fan base was basically reduced to rooting for small victories vs rival teams, than rooting for a team that could possibly make the playoffs.Once Lewis arrived, all of that begin to get better. In 9 seasons . . .- 69 - 74 record ( with two 4 win seasons . . one because of a rash of injuries, the other because of locker room drama )- Three winning seasons ( with only 3 sub-.500 seasons and three 8 - 8 seasons )- 3 playoff appearances in the last 7 years ( and 2 division titles )- Now has the ability to attract high quality free agents to come there- Now able to properly scout collegiate talent and bring in high quality players- Expectation of fan base has now risen to expect to compete yearly with Pittsburgh and Baltimore for division title- NOT a championship caliber team . . . yetThe fact is that culture change doesn't happen overnight . . . unless you DO get that superstar type player. If you don't, the change occurs slowly, with the foundation of the "house" being built slowly. But when it is built slowly, it also has to be built with the right materials. If you don't build it right, the house may not look like you want it to looks.As much as people complain about the "mediocre team" the Hawks had for the past 5 years, most of you will look back on this time as a good period for the Hawks. It was a period in time that provided some of the most exciting Hawks basketball you've seen since the late 80s Dominique era. No, the team could never get past the East's elite, but they were a "good" team . . . not a "mediocre one".

Birdman does not represent a need on this team. We're actually quite deep at PF with Smith, Horford, and possibly Ivan and Scott being able to play the position.Would I be against bringing the guy in if he's found innocent of the charges? Probably not. He's a good energy type player to bring off the bench.But he's not what this team needs right now. They need an "under the radar" type SF than can contribute, than another PF. Now if they choose not to re-sign Ivan, then Birdman does become a more attractive option to bring in.

They forgot this one from JJ

Did Birdman turn into a SF?If not . . . no thanks

I would feel better about the Dwight Howard scenario if at any time in his career Dwight had said . . ."yeah, one day I MIGHT consider playing for the Hawks." Instead, we've gotten the opposite. He has flat out said that he doesn't want to play in Atlanta, nor have his agent said that Atlanta was one of his desired destinations. I don't think he wants anything to do with the pressure of playing for his hometown team. which is why we should've put together a package good enough for Orlando to take . . to FORCE him to play here for a year. Maybe if he were forced to play here, he would grow to appreciate and possibly even like playing here. If the Magic doesn't trade him between now and the trade deadline, we've left it up to his discretion for he and his agent to choose us. And I think that's a losing scenario for us.

Woody was actually the one that encouraged his forwards ( then at the time Smith, Marvin, and especially Childress ) to push the ball up the floor. But there was a reason for that. Our PGs were guys like Tyronn Lue, Salim Stoudamire and Royal Ivey. But it has always been a bad idea. I'm a subscriber to SynergySports. And you can actually SEE each and every play that a player makes. This is Josh Smith in transition: - Josh had a 70.5 FG% on his shots in transition . . . which is OUTSTANDING. This illustrates how good of a finisher Josh Smith can be when he gets to the rim on a fast break. For a comparison, Lebron James is at 75.1% FG. And he's probably the premier finisher on a fast break in the league. - Hawks scored points on 56.9% of the plays that Josh is involved in transition. That's still a pretty high scoring rate, but it's significantly less than his 70% FG rate. It shouldn't dip THAT low. So you know there is a reason for the percentage drop. - Josh turned it over 22.3% of the time in transition And here is the problem. That 22.3% equaled 44 turnovers in transition, by FAR the leader on the Hawks last year. And Synergy gives you the ability to watch those turnovers in transition. Most were absolutely horrific, with him handling the ball and bringing it up the court, and just throwing errant passes. Some consisted of him just flat out losing the ball while he was dribbling. Some of the turnovers are so ridiculous, that you have to chuckle at them. Bottom line is that the dude needs to start giving the ball up, so that he can continue to FINISH fast breaks, not be the playmaker on them.

My guy was his teammate . . Jeffrey Taylor . . who is a SF. I liked Taylor over Jenkins because he was a better athlete and a better defender, while still being able to give you shooting from the outside. He's not as good of a shooter as Jenkins, but he is an above average shooter.But yeah. If I knew we were going to trade JJ AND Marvin within 48 hours of each other, and bring in nothing but guards and spot-up shooters, I'd rather have Taylor here than Jenkins.

If the Heat happened to play a team with a very skilled C and PF that can PUNISH them on the inside, they do not beat that team. OKC was one of the weaker defensive teams in the playoffs, despite all the hype that Ibaka gets as a shot blocker.Had a great defensive team like the Celtics had a center that they could throw in the game to put more muscle in the paint, they beat the Heat. That's why they drafted Fab Melo and Jared Sullinger. Jared potentially gives them a skilled low post player to bring off the bench, while Melo potentially gives them a big body that can clog up the paint. This will continue to preserve a vet like KG to continue to play at a high level.The Celtics may be even STRONGER this year. And that's a scary thought.

Like I said . . . when it comes to Joe Johnson, the goal is to discredit the dude at every turn. It doesn't matter whether he had the numbers in some years, or when he's played on good teams in other years. It doesn't matter if he even had the talent to be mentioned with the top 20 guys in the league. The goal by you and others is to completely downplay what he was about as a player. In your eyes, he's simply not as good as some of the coaches and the commish thought he is/was. In my eyes, the dude was one of the top all-around guards in the league, and has been for many years now. That's why he gets the props that he gets from the coaches. JJ's legacy is that of a guy who was NOT a superstar, but an All-Star caliber player who helped lead the Hawks to one of their best 5 year stretches in franchise history. It's just sad that the franchise never built a team to maximize his abilities to help get him and the team to the next level. It's all good. At the end of the day, I'm an UNCONDITIONAL Hawks fan, so there will be no rooting for Joe Johnson when he plays us. But when he comes back to Philips, and if I happen to be in the building for that first game he plays when he returns to ATL, I'll definitely give that dude a standing ovation when he is announced. At that point, we'll see how "classy" or "appreciative" the ATL fan base will be toward JJ. My guess that some will boo him . . . like he CHOSE to leave the Hawks.

I don't know. Which of THESE years were shoo-ins for an All-Star selection? 19.4 / 5.2 / 4.5 . . . Pierce ( 2012 ) 17.4 / 3.7 / 4.9 . . . Ginobli ( 2011 ) 12.4 / 6.1 / 5.5 . . . Iguodala ( 2012 ) The bottom line is that it really doesn't matter what you or I think about Joe Johnson. The coaches OBVIOUSLY thought very high of the dude for the past 6 years. They knew the type of all around game that he brought to the table. And for the record, I've said since the end of the year that someone on the Core had to go . . . either Joe Johnson or Josh Smith. But I'd never condone giving up either dude for nothing. We've played this "cap space" game before, only to have every star to superstar free agent overlook us. Then we had to pull a desperation move just to bring in a young guy like Joe to the mix. When the "big guns" bypass us next year, we'll have to do it again.

LOL @ "stolen from Pat Summitt" I'm University of Tennessee Alumni . . . and that's been my sig for about 4 years now. Pat was absolutely right when she said that. What Pat teaches is that no matter how bad you're playing offensively, you can not only still be in the game, but even WIN the game . . if you play DEFENSE and REBOUND the basketball. Because defense and rebounding can lead to quick offense going the other way, or give you 2nd chance opportunities to score the basketball. It can also create quick runs that can blow a game open, or get you back into a game.

Of course you don't. Because your post will go completely the opposite way of my post, and try to tear JJ down at every point. It's all good. I mean, because I know the teams in the Western Conference had no idea who Joe Johnson was before he came to ATL, because of the limited number of games he played against Western Conference competition ( 182 games + 15 playoff games in 4 years vs the West before coming to ATL ). They had no idea who he was or what his game was about. Not only that. JJ, because of the limited amount of games he played vs the West before coming to ATL ( 182 reg. season games + 15 playoff games ), couldn't possibly play the fast paced style of play out West. He just couldn't do it. And he couldn't even put up even better numbers as a Hawk vs the West, because he is/was incapable of improving as a player ( averaged 20+ ppg vs the West in 6 of his 7 years in ATL ). Of course. Because JJ was only mediocre that season ( 9th in the NBA in scoring that year and 4th in scoring in the West. ). It doesn't matter that he was one of 7 players who averaged at least 25 pts - 4 rebs - 4 assists that year. It doesn't matter that every single one of those guys ( whether they played on a bad team or not ), made the All-Star team that year. Nope. Because he's Joe Johnson, we're going to leave him off of that list, in favor of either for Josh Howard or Jason Terry, because they just HAVE to have 2 players from the Mavs on the team. A Mavs team that was supposed to be the 3rd greatest team in NBA history . . . but get bounced by a 42 - 40 team that hadn't made the playoffs in 12 years . . . in the First Round. Of course. Because the goal of this exercise is to keep Joe Johnson OUT of the All-Star game at ALL COSTS. When he has the stats to get in the game, let's raise the bar and say that his team isn't winning enough. When he's performed at a high level for now the 3rd year in a row and has made a name for himself, that doesn't matter either. We are going to continue to throw every road block in the way, so that JJ doesn't get in. 22 - 6 - and 4 that year? The 3rd year in a row that you've been at least a 20 - 4 and 4 player? Nope. Sorry JJ. You get no consideration whatsoever. Oh, and you don't play defense better than those guys either. Don't forget that. And let's put the final bar to put in front of Joe Johnson's quest to be an All-Star. The INJURY BAR Let's cite the fact that there are people supposedly better than JJ are hurt, to down whatever chance or shot he would have had at an All-Star berth. Because we all know that injuries are NOT part of the game. Injuries are NOT supposed to happen to star players. And because of that, any player that benefits from that star being out, is a SCRUB. 53 team wins ( and possibly could've been higher if the Hawks played in the West and not the East ( .700 winning percentage vs West teams that year . . 21 - 9 . . . .615 winning percentage vs the East . . 32 - 20 ) The consistency to be a 20 pt - 4 reb and 4 ast player for 5 years straight ( 2005 - 10 ), with only 3 other players in the league who could claim to do that in that 5 year span ( Lebron, Kobe, Wade ). NO JOE JOHNSON . . . ( talking in my Maury Voice ) . . you are NOT an All-Star. (( Doing the "JJ you are NOT an All-Star dance" )) http-~~-//www.youtube.com/watch?v=vt2i0ts-uck

Josh had the best statistical season of his career. Josh also had the worst offensive efficiency of his career. So it depends on which side of the Josh Smith debate you're on, as to how you look at his offense last year.

And this is exactly the type of thing that I was talking about in my last post. Now he's a so-so player? Haha. News flash: NO HAWK since Bob Pettit has made it past the 2nd round. So I guess we can't talk about any Hawk, since all of them have been failures, from Nique to Smitty to Johnson.

JJ is not a superstar. He was/is a good player worth more than Al and Smith because neither guy has had a gameplan up to this point to try to limit or shut down their production. The focus was ALWAYS to try to make life as difficult as possible for JJ. He was always the "head of the snake" for the Hawks. Cut off the head, and the body dies. And that almost always happened to the Hawks, when teams effectively forced JJ into a non-efficient performance on the court. Had Horford or Smith been good enough to consistently take up the slack when JJ played poorly, the team would've had a little more success. Smith showed that he could do it on occasion last season. Horford did it in two of the playoff games. We'll see if each can consistently do it with the "head" now gone. But to say he was "lucky" to make 6 All-Star teams, is just borderline on "hating". He definitely deserved the previous 5 selections, with only last year's selection to be questionable. The REAL problem with the Joe Johnson debate is the fact that those that don't like the dude ( as a person or as a player ), try to knock him down a few notches and reduce him to a complimentary player on the Hawks, instead of the dude that every coach in the league tried to stop. And that's why that dude got so much respect from the coaches, and got their votes come time to select the All-Star reserves.

Right. Because with the hard nosed defense they played in the "elite" Western Conference, JJ's numbers were always lower vs the West, than they were vs the East and there's no way possible he could perform at the level he did vs the "poor" Eastern Conference competition. Oh wait . . . . no they weren't 2007 West Guards: Kobe, T-Mac, Allen, Parker This was JJ's highest scoring year in which he averaged 25 ppg ( 26.4 ppg vs Wastern Conference competition ). Instead of the West taking 4 guards, they'd take 5 guards, and leave Josh Howard ( the 5th forward on the team ) off the squad. 2008 West All-Star Guards: Kobe, Iverson, Nash, Paul, Roy The first 4 make it in easily. The last guard spot would be down to Brandon Roy or Joe Johnson Roy 19.1 ppg . . . 5.8 asst . . . 4.7 rebs . . . 45% FG . . . 34% 3FG . . . 75% FT Johnson 21.7 ppg . . . 5.8 asst . . . 4.5 rebs . . . 43% FG . . . 38% 3FG . . . 83% FT With that being Roy's 2nd year, and JJ being an established player in the league by then ( and having better overall production ), JJ gets the nod. 2009 West All-Star Guards: Kobe, Paul, Roy, Parker, Billups Roy would not be denied a spot on this team. As the 2nd PG, Parker wouldn't either. So the final spot would come down to Billups or Joe Johnson. By this time, Billups is already a household name, and is helping Carmelo get Denver a top 4 playoff spot. But once again, JJ is getting it done. Billups 17.9 ppg . . . 6.4 asst . . . 3.0 rebs . . . 42% FG . . . 41% 3FG . . . 91% FT Johnson 21.4 ppg . . . 5.8 asst . . . 4.4 rebs . . . 44% FG . . . 36% 3FG . . . 83% FT It would be a hard decision for the coaches, but they probably go with Billups 2010 West All-Star Guards: Nash, Deron, Billups, Kidd Kobe is hurt, so he doesn't play. The league replaces Kobe with Jason Kidd. But JJ EASILY makes this team even if Kobe wasn't hurt. He had a very good all-around year in 2010 and would get in over Kidd. 2011 West All-Star Guards: Kobe, Paul, Ginobli, Deron, Westbrook This would be the first season in which JJ definitely doesn't make it in. JJ struggled most of 2010 - 11 season, and only made the All-Star team in the East because of the monster January he had. Despite his numbers being better vs Western Conference competition that year, it still wouldn't have been enough to get him in had he played most of his games vs the West. 2012 West All-Star Guards: Bryant, Paul, Westbrook, Parker, Nash Can't argue too much with those selections, especially seeing that JJ didn't start the 1st half of the year playing at an All-Star level. His game picked up considerably after the All-Star break. So instead of 6-time All-Star Joe Johnson, we're talking about a 3 or 4 time All-Star Joe Johnson if he played in the West. His skill + durability enabled him to be in the running for an All-Star spot in 6 of the 7 years he played with the Hawks. But JJ's production is right there to be considered with those West guards, save for the last 2 years under Drew in which his role and shot attempts were reduced