TheNorthCydeRises

So you were satisfied with Smoove's play last night?

Ex . . . if our starting PF, and the guy who people say is our best or 2nd best player, only scores 7 points in a game . . then that's a bad game. If JJ shot 5 - 11 FG and had 12 pts - 5 asst - and 4 rebs for us . . . in the playoffs . . . that would be a bad game in my eyes for him, despite the low amount of shots. The team needs him to score, so he has to do a better job getting his shots. This is the playoffs. Guys have to impact the game during the playoffs. Even if Smoove hAs to do the little things to get his points ~ ( i.e. - put offensive rebounds back in the basket, or get to the FT line ) ~ that's what he has to do. Our MVP or 2nd best player can't be mediocre or non-impactful.

Smoove's numbers were astronomical after Game 2. That's why all of the comparisons to Lebron and all of that love from the national media came from. After Game 2, Smoove was averaging 16 pts - 12 rebs - 6 asst and shooting 71% FG. Now it's unfair to expect him to play at that high of a level. But the great stats he accumulated in those first 2 games have been diminished significantly. So while it's unfair to call him out for the entire playoffs, he hasn't had an impactful playoffs either. And when people consider you the best or 2nd best player on the team, you have to make that impact every game. Yeah, you can say that about other guys as well, but a lot is expected of Smoove. So like with JJ, Smoove has to be good on a nighlty basis during the playoffs. Having a bad 2 or 3 games in a series, can and has led to disaster.

Crawford has been bad both offensively and defensively . . more than just about every other player on this team, with the exception of Bibby. But even Bibby has been more effective offensively. Crawford has been on the back of a milk carton the entire series.

While I agree with you that "true fans" wouldn't turn their backs on this team right now, I also can see why they have given up. This team has shown no guts during these last 3 games. We didn't even show up in Game 3 . . Didn't execute well on defense in Game 4 . . and flat out melted down in Game 5. So with the way this team plays on the road, what belief is there that they'll pull off a victory in Game 6 . . against a Milwaukee team that isn't scared of us one bit? The strength of our team has been our 2 shot creating guards, combined with our athletic forwards rebounding and running the floor. That's what we need, in order to win Game 6. If that doesn't happen, the lack of heart this tea has shown, could lead to an ugly and embarrassing blowout. Personally, I thought if we won Game 5, Milwaukee would play with the same sort of desperation as we did in Game 6 vs Boston, and beat us in Game 6 Friday night. Now . . . I have no idea how what to expect. Do they go on the road and lay down and die . . . like they did in Game 7 of the Boston series? Or do they battle and claw and refuse to die . . . like they did in Game 4 of the Miami series? Somebody needs to step up, be a leader, and right this ship before it crashes into the iceberg. And I don't care who it is . . from JJ . . to Smoove . . to Horford . . to Zaza . . or even Jeff Teague. If it won't or can't come from the coach, what player will step up?

But what does Horford and Marvin have to do with Smoove still being a "work in progress"? Keep in mind that a lot of fans were saying that Smoove was the MVP of this team. So when the MVP doesn't perform up to standards, then what? That's the exact reason why I didn't like the way JJ played the 4th quarter of that game last night. I think JJ is the MVP, but he played like the LVP, with all of the mistakes he made. Bottom line is that ever since Smoove got all of that attention last week, he's had a sub-par series. Even in Game 4, he was having a bad game up until the 4th qarter, in which he started to play ball. He cannot play sub par, or even average basketball, if people says that he'ms the MVP of the team. Much is expected of Smoove, just like it is for JJ.

Johnson: B . . . . Game 5 was the game in which we needed him the most, and he straight up wilted. After scoring grades of A - A - B - A in those 1st four games, he gets a D for last night. Horford: B- . . . . I can't overlook that 3 rebound debacle in Game 3 in which he and Smoove were lifeless. Horford has been up and down all series. Last night he was pretty damn good though. Smoove: C+ . . . He went from our owner comparing him to Lebron . . to disappearing like Lamar Odom. The energy he usually brings just hasn't been there the past 3 games. Marvin: C . . . Marvin is Marvin. He's had 2 Marvin-esque games, 2 bad games, and 1 great game. Zaza: C . . . I'll give him partial credit for balling in the blowout in Game 3. Otherwise, he hasn't been effective this series either. But he hasn't been flat out horrible ( for Zaza standards ) Bibby: C- . . . We knew the defense was going t be terrible, but not to this extent. If it wasn't for his blazing hot shooting in Game 4, this could easily be a low D. Mo Evans: D . . . As much as people may want to see him start over Marvin, he's not better than Marvin. His shooting has been non-existant in the playoffs. Crawford: D . . . for what we ask him to do, he's been the biggest disappointment. He hasn't stepped up at all during this series, other than a 2nd quarter stretch in Games 1 and 4. Woody: D . . . His inability to not "figure out" what is wrong in this series, is an indictment on him. Skiles has definitely outcoached him. The grade would be an F, if not for the fact that the players as a whole are playing their most uninspired basketball all season.

NJHAWK . . . I think you're another person by another name, who is also a Cincinnati Bengals fan. LOL . . . don't the Hawks remind you of the Bengals? JJ is Carson Palmer Josh Smith is Ocho Cinco Woody is Marvin Lewis And look what happened to us this past NFL season. Like the Hawks, we come through with a couple of breakthrough wins vs the Steelers ( like the Hawks did with Boston ), We even do enough to win the division. But come playoff time, we run into an underdog NY Jets team that had far less talent, but a defense that scrapped and clawed every chance they got. So we play them in the playoffs, being a heavy favorite . . and we lay a complete egg. Carson couldn't hit the broad side of a barn. Ocho was rendered useless by Derrell Rivas. Marvin and his staff couldn't solve the Jets defense. Even our automatic kicker missed critical FGs. And Sanchez made 2 plays in that game . . . which led to TDs . . . straight up defensive breakdowns from a team that had been solid defensively all year. As a sports fan, this is pretty much the nightmare scenario for me . . . watching my favorite NFL and NBA team melt down like this. And I know with both teams, simply changing out a coach or a player may not solve the issue. Meanwhile . . . the Baltimore Ravens did what they always do . . . MAN UP and got the job done vs the Patriots. Just the nightmare scenario man.

Other than the first game, Orlando has pretty much handled Milwaukee. That Magic team will probably destroy the Bucks, unless they go ice cold from the perimeter. If Skiles was that good of a coach, he would've been able to get the Baby Bulls over the hump. He did a great job there, but they could only get to a certain level, because of personnel. The same will happen if they face the Magic. Coaching is great . . but it can only get you so far. You DO need talent in this league.

I'm not comparing them talent-wise. I'm comparing them according to what their role is on their respective teams. So when I say = . . . the = means that their roles are strikingly similar. Not the talent.

No doubt. Up until this year, JJ hasn't been able to get it done on the road. I'll give you that.

I do agree that you change coaches, before you blow up the squad. But we know where the problems with this team lies. - point guard - defense at the point guard position - defensive rebounding - offensive execution - an out of balance roster Change coaches . . . but those other issues better be addressed as well. As you know, this is not as simple as changing a coach. The Hawks are not that talented as to assume that a mere coaching change will vault us to "elite" status.

NJHAWK . . it's no use man. Josh Smith is untouchable. Last 3 games: 12 - 31 FG ( 38% FG . . . from a PF, not a guard ) Honestly . . . take away the 4th quarter of Game 4, and he HAS been MIA since he made those comments in Milwaukee. But he's untouchable around here. And I understand that. For most Hawk fans, he's their favorite player. He's my 2nd favorite player on this team. But sometimes, you have to call a spade a spade. JJ was a spade in Game 5. Josh has been a spade pretty much since last Wednesday. Crawford has been a spade for about 3 weeks now.

I definitely haven't given up on the team. This is their first 3 game losing streak since January. Just sad to see the team melt down like this and players not stepping up when they need to. Milwaukee and it's fans fully expect to close us out on Friday night. Let's see what the Hawks are made of now. I want to see them play their best road game of the year on Friday night.

WHAT???? Up until last night . . . Joe Johnson has been PHENOMENAL in these playoffs . . . even on the road. It's the other guys that didn't show up on the road. Horford was the whipping boy up until last night. The only reason I went off on JJ last night, is because he HAS to get up those shots. If we're running ISO, he can't turn the ball over like that. He has to at least give the team a chance of him making a tough shot, or getting an offensive rebound. But JJ has bee FABULOUS in these playoffs. Last night, even though he was struggling, he has to trust his jumper or make crisper passes so that people can get open shots. The decisions he made on both ends of the floor, especially with the fouling, was mind-boggling last night. Having said that, this team is DEAD IN THE FRIGGIN WATER without JJ, no matter what coach you bring in here, unless you can replace him with a guy who can consistently score the basketball from the perimeter. Like I pointed out to you in that other thread, the main problem with this team, is that it is out of balance. And it's out of balance because we have 2 PFs playing on our frontline. And if those 2 guys don't play with desire and toughness every night, we're going to have problems. And the PG situation doesn't help things one bit either. Unlike the other JJ bashers, I fully expect this dude to atone for that performance in Milwaukee. I just hope the other guys are mentally ready for what they're about to encounter on Friday night. If they survive the initial wave, they should win the game. If not, they might get blown out the building. And that will be sad to see. People are so in love with Josh Smith around here, that they can't see that he represents everything GREAT and BAD about the Hawks at the same time. I'll be SHOCKED if JJ doesn't step it up big time in Milwaukee.

I'm not going to defend him . . . but I SURE IN THE HELL won't root against my favorite team, just to guarantee that the coach will be fired. That's straight BS in my eyes. And it still won't solve the problems with this team as a whole. A lot of you think a simple coaching move will solve the problem. Please. We have a roster/personnel issues that needs to be addressed, before this team moves to the next level. - Decide if you want JJ to come back . . if no, who do you replace him with ( and don't say D-Wade, because we can't afford him ) - Decide who to keep between Horford and Smoove . . . because we need a decent center, so that one of these guys can flourish at PF - Decide what to do with Marvin Williams . . trade him for scraps? trade him for a pure shooter or pure defender? keep him? what do you do? - Decide what to do with Jamal Crawford . . . let him take over JJ's spot as lead shot creator, or keep him in a 6th man role, or trade him - Decide on who to bring in to upgrade this horrible bench You bring Phil Jackson to coach the Hawks as is, and we may look a little better offensively . . . but we're still going to have MAJOR ISSUES that keep us from reaching that elite level. Personnel issues. Even in Phil's case, he couldn't coach up the Lakers after Shaq left. But once they acquired Pau Gasol . . . that team hasn't looked back since. They had to balance the team out, mainly because they couldn't rely on Lamar Odom to consistently play at a star level ( and still can't )

I've always compared the Hawks to Denver. Remember . . . Denver's coach is George Karl, and the same issues Woody has had with this team, he's had with the Nuggets. Carmelo = JJ . . . ISO players who takes the game into their own hands . . then the team stands and watches while they try to go to work. Smoove = Kenyon Martin . . . the emotional barometer of the team that plays great at times . . and disappears at times . . and are unpredictable Nene = Horford . . . the center who does the dirty work for the team . . and is sometimes neglected offensively by the star players JR Smith = Crawford . . . the instant offense guy off the bench, who can shoot you to a win, or shoot you right out of a game Birdman = Zaza . . . the scrapper/hustler off the bench that can sometimes provide a jolt of energy . . but isn't good enough to start Affalo = Marvin . . . the starter who is usually subbed out by the gunner ( JR Smith/Crawford ) . . but can have a good game every blue moon I'm not going to insult Billups by comparing him to Bibby . . even though Bibby was kind of brought in to provide the same type of leadership at the PG position. Mental-wise . . . Denver is our schizophrenic twin brother.

I said "maybe". JJ and Crawford have some redeeming to do. What you might see in Game 6, is the Bucks come out completely overconfident, and actually play erratic basketball at the beginning of the game. If the Hawks have any type of pride to them, they'll come out focused and ready to play. No joking around. None of that ish. They'll be all business come Friday night. JJ has been excellent throughout the series, so he needs to make up for his Game 5 debacle. Josh Smith seems to be sulking a little. If so, he needs to get over that. I like the way Horford tried to step up tonight. He's trying to emerge as the emotional leader of this team.

You guys are incredible!! If I can break down and place blame on JJ for this Game 5 loss, surely you dudes can admit that Crawford has played like ABSOLUTE CRAP in these playoffs. Seriously . . . how can ANYONE defend that dude? His defensive effort? We didn't bring him here to play no dang defense. We brought him here to SCORE THE BASKETBALL. And he can't even do that? ' The dude is shooting 21 - 64 in the series. 32.8% FG 21 for freakin 64 Really? The other dude that people hate so much, is shooting 19 - 37. You know . . . THE DUCK . . that everybody hates? The DUCK has made 2 less shots than Crawford . . . but Crawford has taken 27 more shots than him. Please don't act like Jamal Crawford isn't a BIG REASON why we're in the situation we're in right now. Even more so than other people . . . including THE DUCK.

Yeah . . people may want to blame Woody. And yeah, Crawford missed a point blank lay up and shot 4 - 17. And Smoove took his most ill-advised 3 pointer of all time. BUT THIS LOSS IS ON THE CAPTAIN !! I'm sorry JJ . . you're my favorite player . . but there is NO WAY IN HELL you can melt down like that. No way. You've been running ISO for 5 damn years, and I've never seen you make so many bad plays in the 4th quarter . . both offensively and defensively . . than you did tonight. UN (( bleepin )) ACCEPTABLE man !! smh . . that was the collaspes of all collaspes. No "we" ish tonight. That was all on you, and Crawford. But mainly YOU. LOL . . now . . we're going to see how good you REALLY ARE, and how much heart you have. You better completely atone for this debacle. Don't let that performance possibly be your last game in ATL. REDEEM YOURSELF ON FRIDAY NIGHT !!!

So in other words, trade the guy we can potentially get the most for, but keep the guy that will still keep our lineup out of balance, no matter who we acquire? Because the problem will be still that Horford is an undersized ( but good 5 ) in this league . . . and Smoove is a hybrid PF. 1) Trade for a Caron Butler type: Lineup: Bibby/Teague - Crawford - Butler - Smoove - Horford . . . . Marvin 6th man 2) Draft picks .. . ( say we trade JJ for the rights of a true center, Demarcus Cousins and a few other picks? ) Lineup: Bibby/Teague - Crawford - Smoove ( at SF ) - Horford - Cousins 3) Young players . . ( shrugging shoulders . . . JJ wouldn't agree to it unless truly desperate, but a sign and trade to Minnesota, for Al Jefferson and Johnny Flynn? ) Lineup: Flynn - Crawford - Smoove ( at SF ) - Jefferson ( since he's most comfortable at the 4 ) - Horford 4) Financial flexibility . . ( dampier's contract ) Lineup: Bibby/Teague - Crawford - Marvin - Smoove - Horford . . . Dampier 3rd C on depth chart ) 5) salary dump . . ( trade Marvin and Bibby for expiring contracts ) Lineup: Teague - Crawford - Smoove ( at SF ) - Horford - Zaza If this is what the near future will look like . . . please re-sign JJ.

Not quite that easy. What will happen then, is that Skiles will spread the floor, putting as many people away from the basket as he can, enabling Jennings to go one on one vs Bibby and Crawford or JJ or whomever. That's exactly what Mike D'Antoni did with Nate Robinson, when he went off. He pretty much put everyone out by the 3 point line, and just let Nate go to work. Help did come in the form of Smoove or Horford, but never in time enough to stop Nate's floater. And when the man guarding Nate backed off of him, preventing the dribble-drive, Nate shot the long uncontested jumper. Whatever defense we play, we just have to stop leaving these shooters wide open. No way should Carlod Delfino have 6 three point makes in a game.

Tried my best to make that 4 hour drive down there tonight. Hopefully it doesn't go 7 games. If it does, I'll definitely beat Game 7 on Sunday.

All I know . . . is that when Miami and Chicago and New York "show JJ the money", these same people who didn't want him re-signed for big money bet not cry about how the Hawks aren't doing anything to improve the team . . if they let JJ walk. You don't challenge for titles in this league with a collection of "good" players. You need star caliber players.

Congrats to Jamal. He definitely deserved the award.