REHawksFan

I'm gonna say something that may be a little controversial, but I've never liked a player playing an entire quarter even when he's scorching hot.

I get it. Ride with him while he's hot.  But then you have to sit him for the majority of the next quarter and more often than not, they are out of rhythm when they come back in. Just dont like it.

Just now, AHF said:

He is doing really well off the bench lately and getting plenty of total minutes.  I’d keep him in the same role in which he has been improving for the time being.  

Don't get the hangups on starting. As long as he's getting top minutes who cares? 

Simmons tryin to prove a point about that all star starting snub. Trae gonna go off tonight. 

I'm willing to give it a chance. Wonder if the teams will rotate much or let one group play most of the quarter and then rest the next quarter. 

7 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

I honestly don't understand why there is a diagonal line on these.  i guess i could figure it out but i'm lazy.  If the line divides good vs bad then what the heck are the actual x,y axis' for?

The diagonal line should provide a rough indication of the net effect of combining Good Offense and Bad Defense (Bottom Right) or Good Defense and Bad Offense  (Top Left). So on the chart, Philly has such a good defense that - even though their offense is considered a negative - the defensive efficiency outweighs the offensive shortcomings and the overall net effect is positive (above the diagonal line). By contrast, the Nets are also Good Defense and Bad Offense but their Bad Offense outweighs the Good Defense and they have a net negative as a team (below the line). 

You can do the same analysis for the Mavs (excellent offense and bad defense but net positive overall) vs the Wiz (good offense but terrible defense and overall net negative) as the Mavs are above the diagonal but the Wiz are below. 

4 hours ago, Atlantaholic said:

There aren't 12 hawks on the team with 560 minutes though. Only 10 players have played >560 mins.  Are you sure you didn't use 520 mins? because that would give us 12 Hawks which coincides with the points on your graph.

The list of the 12 hawks with >520 mins would be

Trae, Hunter, Reddish, Cam, Heurter, Bembry, Parker, Len, Jones, JC, VC, Bruno, and Crabbe. 

Nope. 560 min used. Did not include Crabbe or Bruno but did include Teague and Graham as both are currently on team and meet minute criteria for season.

26 minutes ago, AHF said:

@KB21

Here is my bet proposal. 

Stake:  One month avatar bet.

Condition:  If the Hawks make a significant trade that you acknowledge is a major move, then the bet is off.  This applies only if they do not make a trade that you deem major.  You can make that call unilaterally once the trade deadline passes.

Bet Terms:  If the condition above doesn't void the bet, you win if the Hawks finish with one of the 5 worst records in the league in the 2020-21 season.  I win if they finish better than that.

12 minutes ago, KB21 said:

OK.  I’ll take that bet.  

4 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

Bembry.

Collins hasn't played enough mins

Bembry is a plus defender but the chart shows JC as I used 560 minutes as the cutoff and JC has played 665 minutes so far. 

2 minutes ago, enrique said:

Love, love, love the RAPTOR graph comparing them. What leaps out to me is that we really don’t have any positive defensive players outside of Cam and ?

crazy to see it laid out that way. 
Thanks! 

So just to further identify the Hawks:

Cam is the positive defender with the biggest negative offensive number (top left in green)

JC is the other positive defender but he's also negative offensively (slight net positive). He's the top green dot that is right on the line.

Huerter and Hunter are the two negative negative green dots with Huerter having the higher offensive rating and Hunter the higher defensive

Trae is obviously the only CLEARLY net positive player. He's ELITE offensively (as in top 4 in the NBA) by this metric but is really bad defensively. 

Finally, not shown on the chart because he hasn't played enough minutes, Bruno is a positive defender but negative offensive player and is also net negative.

15 minutes ago, turnermx said:

The 2019 draft was the first top 5 pick that came as a result of rebuilding, the 2018 draft was a top 5 pick that came as a result of tearing down the absolute mess that was left behind by the Bud as GM debacle

I don't get why the distinction matters. Who cares whether Trae came as a result of the tear down or the 1st rebuilding year? It's all semantics at this point. The only real tangibly important fact is they now have 3 lottery picks with at least one more on the way that will hopefully be the foundational pieces of a title team in the years to come. 

12 minutes ago, KB21 said:

The thing with Dedmon is that he meshed well and fit well with the players in Atlanta.  He’s not the fit for Sacramento that he was in Atlanta.  

This is kinda what I was thinking as well. The fit in Atl seemed really good and it sure seemed like he had more value in the Hawks organization than the Kings. He has sucked this year though. No question about that. 

10 minutes ago, NBASupes said:

TS made this situation extremely hard and that's because he wanted to maximize the growth for Hunter and Reddish. I don't know how losing a center even a swing one like Dedmon helps our development.

Yeah....I've been a big time defender and believer in TS, but he really screwed up with this roster construction. It makes me mad every time I watch a game. He REALLY overvalued Len and Jones, imo, while also undervaluing Dedmon.   

7 hours ago, NBASupes said:

 

This implies they were trying to do something defensively which - based on previous results all season - is........amusing. 

I'm not sure this team has any concept of defense. Sure, there are some individual defenders, but when has anyone seen this team put forth a unified, coordinated defensive effort??

This whole argument is ridiculous. It ignores the fact that Bruno had no business getting more than a few minutes a game to start the season. He literally had no idea what he was doing. Or dont yall remember Trae yelling at him on the court for being out of position and generally in the way early on. 

One can say, "well how he gonna learn if not by playing in actual NBA games?" But that question ignores the reality that there were 4 other guys on the court - all further along than Bruno - that were trying to win games early on. LP couldn't just throw Bruno out for 25 min a game to the detriment of the other 4 guys. Bruno has to be at least competent on the court or it isn't productive for him or the other guys to get starter minutes.

Despite what some on this board think, LP knows what he's doing in developing players. And that includes knowing when to increase their PT and when to pull it back. 

26 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

I just do not understand the love affair with Bembry or Jones. They are both in contract years and still playing like crap.

I dont get it. One min you say "we can't play Cam and Hunter 48 min" but then you complain about Jones getting 16 min a game? 

Bruno will be getting more now that he's more ready to play higher minutes.

5 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

will he go back to his tried and untrue rotation of Jones, Len, Parker, and Vince getting most of the minutes. This month has seen Fernando getting his most minutes per game so far. He is also showing signs of growth. I really want this trend to continue and hope Fernando continues to get around 20 minutes or more a game.

Problem is, I don't trust LP and his wild reliance on veterans, no matter how bad we play with them. For the month of January Fernando's stats are tending up and his plus minus for this short period of nine games is a very solid +7. If you want to fudge the numbers and base it off his last 10 games using the December 30th game, he is +20 for those 10 games. I think Fernando has a real shot at being a quality big; but experience with the 1st unit against high quality players is key. I think this takes a lot of pressure off Collins as well. I hope like hell when Parker and Len get back full strength, Bruno still gets those minutes.

A little over two months left. Does LP continue to trust Fernando or does he fall back into his old habits?

Bruno wasn't ready to get heavy minutes earlier in the season. Hard to hold that against LP. If he was hell bent on vets vs rookies why were Hunter and Cam getting more min than Bembry, Turner, Crabbe, etc...? 

1 hour ago, txsting said:

We have to stay in the bottom 4, period.  Whatever it takes.  Next year we are going to be better, guaranteed, very possibly a playoff team.  We have to keep these highly valuable assets, either for our own use or potentially in a big trade package down the road.

We absolutely cannot pass Brooklyn or allow them to miss the playoffs.  We should try to crush the Bulls, Wizards, Pistons, and Hornets, and "competitively" lose to everyone else, especially to Brooklyn.

Cannot sign off on this way of thinking at all. Competitive losing? No thanks. I've seen enough losing and I don't want our young guys getting used to it or it becoming a habit for them. Play hard, try to win every game, and let the chips fall where they may. 

Also, I disagree wholeheartedly that there's any reason to try to protect the lottery picks. By all accounts, this will be an historically bad top of the draft with more "value" toward the middle. So I can't agree with losing intentionally to try to get a Top 4 pick. No one worth that to me. 

45 minutes ago, macdaddy said:

This is the part of the OP criticism I don't understand (and honestly i don't understand it.  not just disagreeing).  Trae's only good at creating points for himself and others?  I mean what else is there really on the offensive side of the ball.

Agreed. It's like the criticism that Trae is just hunting assists. What? I mean is it really a complaint that Trae is looking to get his teammates involved? 

23 minutes ago, AHF said:

Throwing Bruno into a deal to get Moose would rank among the dumbest deals we’ve ever made.  We saw Moose at his peak but he has fallen off since he was playing under Bud and is entirely disposable.  He would be a bit of filler we might prefer over other filler but not a reason to deal anything of value.

I'd welcome Adams on this team but I fail to see the logic in trading away Bruno. He's clearly the C of the future. He just isn't ready right now to get starter minutes. If you are trading away Bruno, it had better be a part of a larger deal for an established, YOUNG veteran C that can be the player for the future run. Adams - while a nice piece short-term - may or may not be a long term answer. I'm not trading Bruno away for a "might be" longterm answer. 

1 minute ago, JayBirdHawk said:

I can't wrap my head around this one.

I want the team to show improvement for the rest of the season but not at the expense of the years to come. Seems shortsighted.

Honestly, I would be more in favor of the outcome IF it was a product of the young core getting better to end out the season. I just want to see the team grow and get better. I'll let the chips fall where they may at that point. I don't see any need to artificially inflate the win total by adding players that won't be here long term. BUT if the growth and success this year comes from the young guys and / or players that the organization plans to keep long term, then I'm fine with it. 

1 minute ago, bleachkit said:

Best offensive game of the year. First time it really felt like everyone was clicking.

It helps when the opponent is playing all star game defense. But yeah, seeing multiple guys play well in the same game was nice to see on an otherwise sucky day. 

Andre with the BRUTAL post game interview with Trae. Ugh. I know he's got a job to do but it's just awkward asking Trae about the game in DC and about the historic 2nd qtr tonight. It was obvious Trae had no interest talking about that stuff.