Packfill

Well, I think Both JJ and Chill have the ability to be good perimeter defenders, but I still think a good quick guard will give them fits. As for the interior, Smooth may be a good help defender (he may be already in fact), but he has not shown any evidence of being a true low post defender. Same goes for Zaza and any other big on the roster. Most likely, the interior defense will come from someone not currently on the roster. Again though, this is where Woodson has to earn his pay check - implementing a strong team defense, through good coaching and attitude development. The team has the athletes right now to at least be a middle of the pack defensive team, but they are young so I won't expect much until the second half of the season and more importantly next year.

Neither. The player with the most pressure to have a good season is JJ.

Agreed, defense will absolutely be key to the improvement of this team. There has not been an NBA champion in the past 25 years that lacked interior defense, so obviously that will have to be addressed before the Hawks can make any noise. Obviously the Hawks aren't close to a championship squad yet, but they need to build a foundation of playing solid team defense.

An interesting comparison is Worthy and Dominique. Worthy is considered one of the 50 greatest of all time but Dominique was left off the list. What is interesting is that Dominique was the main guy on a pretty good team while Worthy, while undoubtedly talented, did unquestionably benefit from playing alongside Magic (kind of how JJ, Stoudamire and company benefited from playing alongside Nash last year; or Kenyon and RJ playing with Kidd). Was Worthy better then Dominique? I say no.

Quote: Buzzard, I'm picking up what you're putting down. The desperate pleas for a big man and a point guard overshadowed the fact that the team needs starter quality players at every position. In my opinion, only Joe Johnson has proven he's worthy of a starting position on a true contending NBA team. The rest is completely unearned, even if you put up good numbers for a half a season, that doesn't mean more than "promise" unless you generate some wins. People expect our #2 pick to be a savior and change the franchise immediately. When was the last time a team went from 13 wins to being a truly competitive team in the NBA with one draft and a couple free agent moves? The road ahead is a long one. San Antonio the year after they drafted Duncan.

So does this mean that all the people yesterday who were ready to throw Harrington to the curb are now officially on his bandwagon? Lets give this team some time.

Quote: There's a reason I won't try that comparison. I will compare them based on their projected positions, not Diesel's projected positions. And this is no slight on you. I've told you before I appreciate your posts a ton and respect your opinion a whole heap. Unfortunately you can say "mark my words" and "you can write it down" but that doesn't change the fact that JJ is currently slated to play the point. My comparison is based on their currently projected positions. Had we drafted Deron, our point need would be filled. Like you, I agree he is probably the best of the point guard group. The extra money under the cap would have most probably gone for a center, not JJ. Childress is already at the 2. You scenerio of Deron/JJ doesn't work because it pushes one of the Josh's out of the starting lineup which isn't in the plans. To Compare your scenario is fictional. The only real comparison is Deron as the point, josh and josh at the 2/3, Al Harrington at the 4 and whatever 4 we could throw money at that would sign. Now here's the problem with this. Al Harrington is no longer trade bait. Without the extra Swing man in Marvin being brought along slowly, there is no way/need to trade Harrington for a need later. I say get over it. Live in the now. For better or worse JJ is the point - period. Until the coaching staff says otherwise quit posting that he's the 2. Childress is the 2. Smith the 3 Harrington the 4 and most probably Pachulia the 5. Every time you post that Marvin is a mistake and JJ can't play the 1 you set yourself up to eat serious crow. There is no undoing this path. They are on it. Get on board and for better or worse cheer your fool head off every time Joe Johnson brings the ball up court for the Hawks. I disagree. Under Diesels plan, Harrington is still tradeable at the deadline if Smoove develops into a power forward. Depth would be provided in next years draft - where the Hawks would potentially have multiple picks.

I voted for option 2. Interior defense wins championships (unless you have the greatest player of all time). Dalembert or Chandler represent the potential for interior defense - I acknowledge that neither is a finished product at this point.

Quote: if lue ends up being our starting pg, then we are in trouble and bk made a mistake Agreed. We already know Lue is not starting material. I have my doubts about JJ as a starting point in the NBA, but he will have to play very badly to not still be better then any of the "point guards" on the Hawks roster. I kind of expect JJ to be similar to JT, but hopefully with better defense and a slightly higher FG%.

Quote: we will still only have I very good perimeter shooter in the starting lineup. I just don't think teams will fear Smoove or Chillz from the perimeter and that means teams will simply double Al in the post and put their best perimeter defender on JJ. The problem is that despite their perimeter shooting, Loe and Delk are terrible players. Marvin and Salim are rookie unknowns - one a very raw forward and the other a second round rookie. You don't start those types of players over more proven, better all around talents like Childress and Smoove.

Quote: I wouldn't trade Al just to trade him but I WOULD trade him for the right price (a quality young big man). I don't think he'll quite avergae 20 ppg but I think he will match his ppg production from last year and maybe even slightly exceeed it. I'd pencil him in for 18.5 ppg. I don't expect 12/9 from Zaza. If he gets that, he could merit All Star consideration in the EC. If he gets 9/7.5, I'll consider his signing a big success. I wouldn't look to trade Chillz either unless it was for a young, established star. I think he could be our starting SG (or maybe SF) for the next 10 years. I wouldn't give Curry a long term contract either unless he could get insurance and even then, I would have a team option after year 3. I think you have to pencil JJ in as the starter at PG until it is determined that he can't handle the job or that the team is better with him at SG (or SF). Before the season is over, I think our depth chart will be as follows: ZaZa/Collier/Edwards Al/Batista Marvin/SmooveDonta Chillz/Salim/Delk JJ/Lue/Ivey I think that we will need Marvin's shooting ability in the starting lineup to spread the floor and allow JJ to get some open looks from the perimeter on occasion. starting Smoove instead of Marvin makes us a pretty weak perimter shooting team unless Chillz or Smoove improves their long range shots significantly. I think Lue will be the first guard off the bench and JJ will slide to SG. I think Smoove will be the first forward off the bench at SF or PF. I agree with everything here except Marvin surpassing Smoove on the depth chart and needing another shooter. Just having JJ on the floor means the Hawks will have at least one more shooter then last year. The only way Marvin makes it into the starting line-up is if he plays well enough in the first half to justify a trade deadline deal of Al Harrington. Otherwise, I think smoove just has too much of a head start on Marvin.

I would not count on either Smoove or Marvin growing any. Almost everyone I know, including myself, was full grown by the time they turned 19. They can definitely pack on some pounds, but as far as height goes I doubt they grow an inch.

Wasn't there a short period where we actually had something like that. You got points for posting.

My understanding is that Blount is soft as a twinkie too, so I doubt he would provide anything in the way of a defensive presence. I think alot of people over-value blocked shots and assume that if someone can block shots that they are a good interior defender. Theo is a good example, great weak side shot blocker but did not offer much in the way of man-up post defense. Deke on the other hand, could block shots, but he was also a very good post defender, which made him much more valuable - and is why he can continue to play in the NBA even though he is 67.

Blount's contract is too large for his level of production, so I would pass as he is not really an upgrade over Zaza. I have to admit I was wrong about Blount - I wanted the Hawks to sign him last off-season. Good thing I am not GM.

Quote: I was thinking that maybe having Salim Stoudamire in the starting lineup with JJ would be better than having Josh Childress in the lineup mainly because of his speed. I can see the Hawks running a lineup like last year's Illinois team where Salim Stoudamire(who has good speed & decent handles) brings the ball up the court and then in the halfcourt set gives up the ball to Joe Johnson to set up the Offense. This is the same scheme that Illinois ran alot of times with Dee Brown & Deron Williams. Stoudamire plays the role of Dee Brown and Joe Johnson plays the role of Deron Williams. I just don't think that neither Childress or Joe Johnson have the speed and handles to handle a trap in the backcourt should the other team play full court defense. I think Tyronn Lue would be better coming off the bench because at least have someone capable of running the offense when Joe is not in there. I think Joe can do a decent job in running the set plays but I think he will struggle when they send traps at him to get the ball out of his hands. As evidenced by his college career and summer league Salim does not have the handles either, so I rather stick with the more talented duo of Chill and JJ. If the Hawks are having a problem bringing the ball up the court versus a press then they would need to bring a true ballhandler into the game. The closest thing on the Hawks roster is Lue.

I agree, the Marvin bashing has to stop. At the same time, people have to stop calling him the greatest of all time before he even suits up. You all should know that scouts and media/fan hype are far from perfect in terms of predicting future success. He is an athletic, young forward with lots of potential. That is all we know. Whether he becomes great, a colassal bust or just average is up to him.

Is it me or is that article unintelligible? How does it makes sense for the author to say that Marvin's bust potential has declined (which is surprising because no games have been played yet); while at the same time say that his mental make-up suggests he doesn't have the drive to be a number one option?

Quote: I see us starting a traditional lineup but often finishing with what is going best, and if it's a close game I see Salim on the floor. Starters: JJ Chillz Smoove Al ZaZa Closers: JJ Salim Smoove Marvin Al By midseason I hope to see that lineup out there alot. Childress is easily the teams third best player yet he is not good enough to finish a game? You are putting an awful lot of faith in a second round rookie.

I think the thing with Darko is that no one knows what he will become as a player. He has some impressive measurables and skills but he has not yet demonstrated the ability to translate those into game situations. He is a project, a projectible one, but a question mark. Same could be said for Marvin, we don't know how he will turn out.

Quote: Quote: But the truth is that Al is our other scoring option and for JJ to be effective, he will need that. Diesel....Diesel....Diesel What you need is understand is that things are going to change from this past season. You give Josh Smith/Al Harrington the same amount of minutes/touches, and Josh Smith would end the night with more points. Josh Smith will take the role as the number 2 option, and I'm expecting that to happen this season. Al Harrington's not a good scorer, lack of low post moves, and he's not a player we need to expect to keep around. Dude. Josh Smith has great potential, particularly as a weakside shot-blocker and rebounder. But, he has absolutely no offensive moves at this point. He gets points on put-backs and dunks, with an occassional jump shot. Al Harrington, even if you think he lacks defensively, is a talented low post scorer. No he is not Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, but he is definitely a guy who can make a move around the basket and create his own shot. so, to say that he lacks low-post moves is a untrue statement. Dominigue Wilkins - the actual player, has even stated that Al is a good low-post scorer.

30. Despite living in the northeast most of my life, I have been a hawks fan since grade school. Never been to a hawks game in Atlanta, but have been to many games over the years in Boston, Hartford (the Celtics used to play a few games there), DC and obviously NY (both MSG and the Meadowlands).

He isn't even a "great young big man." Amare Stoudamire is a "great young big man," Dwight Howard is a "great young big man," Emeka Okafor is a "great young big man." Nene is a "great talent."

Quote: this is nowhere NEAR the worst trade on the board at least this trade gives us a good pg and a great young big man dre/jj/smoove/nene/zaza with marvin/salim off the bench would be a good young team however, not at the expense of chill! but seeing as how this trade actually brings us back 2 good guys, one whom we'd LOVE to have...it's better than the average trade on this board...just NO to trading chill When did Nene become a "great" big man? He is a "talented young big man" but has done nothing yet that suggests he is great or will be great. That said, it is an interesting trade, especially if you think JJ cannot run the point.

The same guy said the acquisition of JJ was one of the ten worst moves of the offseason, so take what he says with a grain of salt.