Packfill

I agree. Marbury is super talented but he just can't seem to raise the level of play of his teammates. Granted, he has an awful collection of players to work with in NY, but he has had chances before.

What leverage? Lets assume that the Hawks do pick Marvin. Utah is trading up to get a point guard, they do not need a forward (Kirilenko, Boozer, Harpring). NO needs a point guard also and will select either Paul or Deron depending on who Utah selected. At that point Charlotte does not have anything the Hawks would want at 5. So the only trading partner is NO, and there is nothing from their team the Hawks would want other then Magloire and possibly JR. They are not unloading JR to move up two spots. That leaves Magloire, but they want two first rounders this year, the Hawks have one. Point is, the Hawks have no leverage. Trading to get back into the first round is not a guarantee, the only assets the Hawks have are Harrington, 31 and a future pick. If you trade Harrington the team will way way too young.

I am not sure but wonder how some of you guys would rank them. Here is my list. Note, I am purposefully leaving off guys like Dwayne Wade and Allen Iverson, as I don't consider them point guards. I question whether to include guys like Heinrich and Francis as well, as both did not finish the year as their teams primary ballhandlers. I was tempted to put Tony Parker and Brevin Knight in their places. My list: 1. Jason Kidd 2. Steve Nash 3. Stephon Marbury 4. Gilbert Arenas 5. Baron Davis 6. Mike Bibby 7. Chancey Billups 8. Andre Miller 9. Steve Francis 10. Kurt Heinrich

I'd make that trade but I don't think New Orleans does.

Quote: Take the best player regardless of position. I don't care what sport it is you always have to take the player with the most upside. I understand the need for a point guard and center but this is a slow building process. The point is to build a championship calibre ball club and if it means ignoring point and center for now so be it." PG's and Centers don't grow on trees.... Small and Power Forwards do. I agree completely. This is at least the third post in the past two days I have agreed with Hotlanta on. I find this unusual as I never tend to agree with his negative postings.

I would not do that trade. Williams and Swift are both wildly inconsistent and have huge shortcoming to their games (Williams - wild and no defense; Swift = no heart and no basketball IQ). Would that team have good athletes yes. Would it win games, definitely not. And if it did it would be because of Childress, Smith and Marvin Williams. J-Will and Swift are really bench players.

You have to wonder if Marvin could name one player on the Hawks roster other then Josh Smith, shom he knows from playing in high school.

Well if a first round point guard is not in the cards then I would strongly consider Will Conroy in the second round. He can't shoot but he appears to be a good distributer and solid defender.

I imagine they would take Bogut, as he fills as much of a need as a point guard.

We aren't going to contend next year? You're kidding right? I am fully aware that the team will not be in position to compete for a championship for at least 3 years. But, you need an experienced floor general to lead you and Paul/Williams would have the experience they need by the time the rest of the team is ready to contend.

1. Chris Paul 2. Deron Williams 3. Andrew Bogut 4. Marvin Williams It is real close between 1 and 4. I think for me the determining factor and the reason I favor acquiring a point guard is because having a good point guard will immeasurably improve the teams play on the court - proper spacing, ball movement, creative passing have been missing from the Hawks for at least a decade. I really enjoy good team basketball and crave some creativity on the court that only a good point guard can bring.

Quote: I see Marvin Williams though, and I see a guy who has all the tools to be a great player. I see a 6'9" guy with a sweet shooting stroke and elite athleticism. Long, athletic, can play multiple positions, has a great work ethic, and has great character. If Marvin has "elite athleticism" then so does Luke Jackson, since he is stronger, can jump higher and run faster. The point is, those test mean nothing. Marvin is the safe pick at 2, I just can't help but think that a quality point guard is more important in terms of building a championship contender then an all-star forward. It just seems that lots of uber talented forwards never led their teams to a championship: Dominique Wilkins, Tracy McGrady, Charles Barkley, Karl Malone, Grant Hill, Alex English, Kevin Garnett, Chris Webber, etc. In the playoffs it always comes down to guard play and interior defense.

Isn't Portland in exactly the same position as the Hawks? Either they take a player who duplicates something they already have (i.e. a point guard) or take a player that fills a need but may not be ranked as highly. At least for the Hawks they are deciding between guys who are consistently considered the the top 4 picks in the draft, whereas Portland is all over the place. Should Portland just take a point guard and deal with the consequences later?

I think Yogi Berra said it best, "we won't know until we know."

The latest from ESPN's insider: Hawks: After weeks of saying they would take Marvin Williams if Andrew Bogut wasn't on the board at No. 2, the Hawks' front office is having second thoughts. The team doesn't have a strong need for Williams and wasn't particularly blown away with his workout and visit last week. However, the staff loved both Chris Paul and Deron Williams. Sources say that the front office and coaching staff are split between Paul, Deron Williams and Marvin Williams at this point.

Quote: There has never been a player with the combination of skills he has that plays the position he plays. When you are going to take my words, take the entire context of my words. I challenge anyone to find a small forward/power forward that has the combination of athleticism, strength, shooting skills, passing ability, and feel for the game that Marvin has. That is an absolutely assinine comment. There have been many prospects over the years that are the same size as Marvin or bigger that possess the complete package of skills. Some have turned into great players, others turned into average players, and still others busted. A partial list of talented 3/4 tweeners who entered the league with multifacted skills: Danny Manning Kevin Garnett Jamal Mashburn Antonine Walker Tim Thomas Andrei Kirilenko Larry Bird Jonathan Bender Rashard Lewis Donyell Marshall Skita Dirk Nowitzki Shareef Abdur-Rahim

That has to be the greatest draft ever. Amongst the first 14 picks were superstars Hakeem Olajuwon, Michael Jordon and Charles Barkley, plus very good players like Kevin Willis, Sam Perkins, Alvin Robertson, Michael Cage and Otis Thorpe.

Quote: Quote: Could happen, but then again let me remind you of other former top prospects taken 1 or 2 in the draft and ask yourself if you really would be kicking yourself now if you passed on them: Kwame Brown, Glenn Robinson, Darko Milicic, Pervis Ellison, Sam Bowie, Michael Olowakandi, Stromile Swift, etc. With the exception of Glen Robinson, who by the way was no where near the bust the rest of these characters where (he did make a all star team or two did'nt he?), all these guys are bigs. Judged not on just skills and talent but also on strenghth and size. SF/SG/PG have to have the talent more than the size to be considered the best player in the draft. Marvin Williams could very well be the best talent (not prospect) since LeBron. And yes I am saying a better talent than Howard and Okefor. No way he is a better talent then Howard, absolutely no way be cracks the top two in last years draft if he had decided to come out. Glenn Robinson was not an outright bust, but he is not a guy you build a championship team around either - even during his best years. Remember, a team with Glenn, Ray Allen and Cassell could get no traction in the playoffs. Other examples of "non-bigs" who have been top picks but failed to materialize into franchise players include: Jay Williams, Keith Van Horn, Kenny Anderson, Mike Dunleavey, Darius Miles, Jerry Stackhouse, Billy Owens, Shawn Elliott, Dennis Hopson, etc. The fact of the matter is that there is not an extensive history of small forwards being drafted in the top two picks of the draft. Outside of Larry Bird and Michael Jordan there are no teams in the past 25 years that won a championship where their featured player was a small forward or shooting guard. Every other championship team was led by a dominate big man (Duncan, Wallacex2, Shaq, Hakeem) or point guard (Issiah, Magic).

Quote: We are a 13 win team, arguabley the worst and least talented team in the league with only Billy Knight's draft picks and Al Harrington to look at as possible building blocks. We have the opportunity to take the guy who has the most potential of any player in this draft....a guy who has the elite ability to be a true superstar player in the NBA.....a guy that several teams are willing to move up to get. And some of you want to pass on that player? I really wonder what some of you will be saying three years from now when Marvin Williams is putting up numbers like 23 ppg, 10 rpg, and 5 apg while shooting 50% from the field. Could happen, but then again let me remind you of other former top prospects taken 1 or 2 in the draft and ask yourself if you really would be kicking yourself now if you passed on them: Kwame Brown, Glenn Robinson, Darko Milicic, Pervis Ellison, Sam Bowie, Michael Olowakandi, Stromile Swift, etc. Point is, plenty of players that are deemed uber prospects turnout to be nothing more then average, and certainly have not led their teams to a championship. The Hawks could just as easily be kicking themselves for passing on Danny Granger or Gerald Green. Impossible to predict.

Agreed, I would to the 5/13 trade if Deron or Paul is available at 5.

I think he would make a better reserve then a starter because he does not have the skills of a true point guard. Excellent athlete and good defender though.

I think Will Conroy is the closest to a pure point guard that is available in round 2. He has been compared to Eric Snow. Decent size, good distributer but not much of a shooter at this point. Gilchrist may be worth a look in round 2 based on ability but he does not seem like the type of person you want on a developing team - i.e., he is not reliable at this point. I think Luther Head is a real option - good size for the point, excellent athlete and defender, good shooter. Negatives are he has never really been a shooting guard but he does have Gilbert Arenas/Chauncey Billups type potential.

That would be a horrendous trade for Charlotte if true.

Actually, I think Diesel is correct here. Walker was an excellent passer coming out of college as well as being known as an outstanding ballhandler. He definitely exhibited much more talent in these areas in his two years at UK then Marvin did in his one year at UNC. Argueably Marvin is a similar prospect. Also consider Glenn Robinson, Billy Owens, Jamal Masburn, etc. All those guys were stars, well except for Owens, but none were ultimately guys you would want to build a franchise around or a championship contender. Again Marvin may be great, but there have been legions of multi talented forwards before him who were supposed to be great but disappointed in the end.

Excellent post. I think people are getting carried away by labeling Marvin as a potential superstar. He clearly is not a can't miss prospect in the LeBron James, Carmelo Anthony sense. The guy is a good athlete (not as good as Smoove) with some good skills, but he could just as easily become Billy Owens (for those that don't remember, he was an extremely talented, multi-skilled player for Syracuse that never lived up to his billing) instead of James Worthy. Quite frankly, if he were drafted, there is no guarantee he becomes as good a player as Smoove or Harrington - both of whom will improve upon last season (Harrington because of the experience of starting for a year and Smoove because of experience). The Hawks desperately need a center and a point guard. They are in position to address one of those needss. Both Deron and Paul have demonstrated the ability to be potential superstar point guards.