thecampster

I thing to consider in this OO vs JJ vs AJ conversation is how well the 3 of them played together on the floor in the second unit. They mesh really well together.

The floated deal is CC, Hunter, 1st, Matthews. There was a grade the trade the other day showing this with Dallas as the 3rd team and Javale McGee also coming our way. I suspect that was publicly floated to gauged interest to all 3 fanbases. Found it: https://soaringdownsouth.com/2023/07/18/atlanta-hawks-grade-trade-pascal-siakam-3-team/

OMG this is too fun. JJ playing Point PF on his high school team on senior night.

Again, I can't separate it out by last 15 games. His numbers get some fudging due to garbage time early in the season. But he handles the ball much better than Dre....I'd never trust Dre to lead the break....you want the ball in Jalen's hands going down hill.

and just for poops and snickers

Now remember, the above takes the full season into account and is not isolating it down to the last 15 games where he was much better. Ya'll are sleeping hard on JJ. His value on the floor shows greater than Hunter in statistical matchups. Numbers rarely lie.

WTF...I was accepting what you were saying (not agreeing but accepting) until you said this. JJ is far better with the basketball in his hands than Dre. Its not even close. What the Frog man...WTF!!! https://3stepsbasket.com/player/deandre-hunter/vs/jalen-johnson?season=nba23

I may need a bigger receipt drawer.

A whole lot of "mark the tape" moments in these conversations. I will be keeping receipts on folks who were all in on trading folks and publicly admonishing them when those folks blow up.

I didn't expect he'd have a shot of sticking on the roster but I think that one game in summer league helped his chances greatly.

Naming other. It wouldn't happen and it would probably be a disaster, but I'd love to see Trae paired with Embiid. I feel like both are players willing their team in the playoffs but unable to do it alone. They'd either kill each other or start a dynasty.

Shakes magic 8 ball....

I mean I posted on it multiple times but he outplayed JC post Nate with Quin.

So I just keep going back to the 15 game sample after the all-star break. His Per36 during that time equates to 15.5p/9.9r/4.7a/1.9s/1.9b on 52.9% shooting/30.4% 3pt shooting. If that is really what we'd be looking at with him, I can't imagine trading that away.

Yes but with a caveat. Talk of Capela to Dallas has heated up in the last few days (social media, nothing I've been told). This feels like a fanbase temp check to me. Might mean Dallas is checking if it moves the needle with their fanbase. Dallas is one of the teams rumored to be a facilitator in either trade with Tor/Minny. So I find that suspect. For the uninitiated, teams thinking of trading for a player or of up'ing their offer will sometimes leak the potential acquisition on social or traditional media to see if it resonates with their fan base. This activity around Clint smells like that to me.

Let me try it this way. Siakam - year 2 - age 23 PER36 numbers. 12.6PP36 on 50.8% FG%, efg%.537, 22 3pt%, 7.8 rp36, 3.4 ap36, 1.3 sp36, 0.9 bp36. JJ - year 2 - age 20 PER36 numbers 13.6PP36 on 49.1% FG%, efg%.537, 28.8 3pt%, 9.7 rp36, 2.9 ap36, 1.3 sp36, 1.2 bp36. I've bolded where each player "won" the matchup. Comparing 21 year old JJ to 29 year old Siakam is not a fair comparison. But JJ has every a solid chance to end up just as good based on their year 2 numbers.

our patients have no patience

I think you really have to pull it out, look at it. Jalen is a similar type player, started his career 2 years earlier and looked very solid the 2nd half last season.

Jalen is currently 21 years old. Below are Siakam's career stats. Years 1 and 2 he was 22/23. His first 2 years in the league, Siakam was 4.2/7.3 ppg and shot 14/22% from 3. Year Team GP Min Pts FG% 3pt% Reb Ast Stl 2022-23 Raptors 71 37.4 24.2 48.0 32.4 7.8 5.8 0.9 2021-22 Raptors 68 37.9 22.8 49.4 34.4 8.5 5.3 1.2 2020-21 Raptors 56 35.8 21.4 45.5 29.7 7.2 4.5 1.1 2019-20 Raptors 60 35.2 22.9 45.3 35.9 7.3 3.5 1.0 2018-19 Raptors 80 31.9 16.9 54.9 36.9 6.9 3.1 0.9 2017-18 Raptors 81 20.7 7.3 50.8 22.0 4.5 2.0 0.8 2016-17 Raptors 55 15.6 4.2 50.2 14.3 3.4 0.3 0.5 Career 471 30.6 17.0 48.7 32.7 6.5 3.5 0.9 Jalen's first 2 years, He averaged similar ppm, FG% while shooting 28.2% from 3

I'm not a fan of trading away assets for overpriced vets (see James Harden drama). Siakam is a very good player. If he becomes a Hawk, I'll root for him. If we give up too much for him, I'll be honest about it. If we give up JJ to get him, I'll be furious. In order to win a championship, the number one thing you need is value pieces throughout your roster to go with your high priced players. We're a smidge iffy in this arena right now, especially if we give up 2 or 3 developing bench guys in order to get him.

From Bleacher Report - Winners/Losers Summer League Loser: Atlanta Hawks 2 OF 5 https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10082690-biggest-winners-and-losers-from-nba-las-vegas-summer-league "For a Hawks team showcasing some of its best young talent, the overall performances from AJ Griffin and rookie Kobe Bufkin were underwhelming. While Bufkin hit a game-winning shot against the Philadelphia 76ers and had some of the best passes of summer league, the 19-year-old guard looked out of control at times, averaging 4.6 turnovers and 3.4 fouls per game. "Kobe (Bufkin) needs to settle down a little," one Hawks personnel member told Spotrac.com's Keith Smith. It'll come for him. We're deep, but not in ball-handlers. Kobe could find a rotation role this year." Overall, Bufkin shot only 33.3 percent from the field and a miserable 13.8 percent from three. The No. 15 overall pick from this year's draft will need to cut down on his turnovers and start hitting more shots for an Atlanta team that's in danger of suffering a first-round playoff exit yet again. Griffin, the No. 16 pick in 2022, was supposed to be the alpha of the group given his strong rookie season for the Hawks. Instead, he ended up as the team's sixth-leading scorer in summer league, averaging only 9.0 points on 27.3 percent shooting overall. If the Hawks want to take another big swing in the trade market for someone like Pascal Siakam, young players such as Bufkin and Griffin are some of their best trade assets. Getting some big performances from both could have helped convince executives in Toronto to part with Siakam. Instead, there's likely more hesitancy for a deal, which could force the Hawks to include even more picks and players in trade talks"

They're only groupies if I don't let them sleep over!!!!

You know..this is also fair. I was bought in on the package 15 + player for an upgrade and that could be coloring my view. When it became obvious we were picking, Lively was off the board, Whitmore fell, I thought for sure this was the same kind of pick we made with JC, Kevin, JJ, AJ....player falls, we are willing to take the risk.

That's fair...I'll reform. The stats back up what my eye test saw.