An exiled fans perspective...

[Buzzard]

Most of the regulars here know me and they also know I had to relocate to Cincinnati several years ago after living in the Atl for over 30 years. So 1st off let me make this clear, I am and always will be a ATL sports fan. So here is some of my outsiders perspective.

Living in Cincinnati I get a lot of flack from Indy, Chicago and Cleveland fans. While its all good natured, it also gives me, I think, a little different perspective on our team.

Our Hawks were the worst team in the league last year and what confuses me when reading the post from some fans inside the ATL is that a lot of you seem to think we only need to fill 2 or 3 positions. A lot of NBA fans up here believe we need a whole new starting five. I think the truth is somewhere in between.

I don't believe any one player on our team should be penciled in and not questioned or not made to prove himself. I do think we have some good (JJ and Al) and potentially (draft picks) good players though; but at the same time we are seriously hurting when you look at the basics of basketball.

A: We do not have a player on our roster who has ever averaged 6 or more assist a game for a season.

B: We do not have a player on our roster who has ever averaged more than 8 boards a game.

C: We do not have a player on our roster who has ever averaged 20 pts a game. Two have come close in JJ and Al but both for only one season.

I really do not understand why anyone would or should feel safe on our team. Nor do I quite understand how some fans on this board think anyone is set and we do not need to improve at a position.

Fans of other teams understand completely how weak we were (before the draft)and still are (after the draft and free agency) at almost every position. And though I do believe we have some good players and potentially good players, I also believe that if we can get someone that can supply one or more of those basics then there is no reason not to do so.

Nor do I think there is any reason for any player we have not to be benched in favor of one that is supplying some or all of those basics.

To read some of the comments concerning JJ, Marvin, Smoove, Chillz, Salim, Al etc...you would think all we need is a center and a pg and all of a sudden we are going to be playing for championships!

Until we get players who can pass, rebound, and score in bunches, we need it all. BK showed a lot of guts taking Smoove over Jameer Nelson two years ago and he also showed a lot of commitment to the local fans of atl.

He did the same type thing taking Marvin over those PG's this year. And while we all want to believe Smoove, Chillz, Mwill etc are future stars, the reality is, we have no stars and we still need it all....

I don't care if Smoove plays so well he keeps Marvin on the bench or visa versa, I don't care if Smoove and Marin play so well they put Al on the bench. It would not bother me in the least bit if Salim took over at pg because of his outstanding play and we had to move JJ to SG and bench Chillz.

I got a whole nother perspective here in Cinci, we were a horrible team last year, we had no stars at all last year, we did not take care of the basics and therefore we should always draft and sign (free agents) the best player available until we actually get some or our acquisitions show us they are at least able to do that.

So here is my perspective, BK, go ahead and draft another SF, go ahead and sign another SG, go ahead and do what ever it takes until we are at least taking care of those three basics. Until then there will be no playoffs and no respect given from other teams and their fans.

I am excited about our re-building, youth, and potential but in know way, shape, or form am I content with it at any position.

[Diesel]

When you build a team from the bottom up (which we have done) you expect to have some losing times (which we have gone through)...

I would disagree with you about some players penciled in... For instance:

1. JJ is penciled in. - 70 million dollars makes you a starter.

2. Al is penciled in. - Being the most veteran player we have right now and having been a part of a championship calibre team makes him a player that must be on the floor.

The play that we saw from JC and JS last season (even in the loses) were good. At the end of last season with NO Walker and NO Al, we still were very competitive. I can't call up the numbers, but both Chillz and Smoove stepped up their games while recieving a bulk of the minutes.

Lastly... When you look at our team, we are missing Big men. We do need rebounders, we do need shot blockers, we do need intimidators... I would almost say the same thing about PG, but I will give the JJ experiment some time.

[Buzzard]

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I would disagree with you about some players penciled in... For instance:

1. JJ is penciled in. - 70 million dollars makes you a starter.

2. Al is penciled in. - Being the most veteran player we have right now and having been a part of a championship calibre team makes him a player that must be on the floor.

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I agree here. They are right now our two best players and that is all the reason the coaching staff needs to make them starters. It is also the best reason. JJ is our best assist man and a top two scorer, AL is our best rebounder and also a top two scorer.

Chillz and Smoove did show a lot of potential last year but as far as I am concerned potential only gets you a pay check in the NBA, it should not pencil you in as a starter.

They have to earn their starts and prove their worth every night just like any other player. And they should not feel like it is a given on a team that had the worst record in the NBA last year.

I think where the perspective is different it is in the feed back from other fans. They ask me why in the world would you not want someone who is a better player (at any position) when your team is the worst in the NBA?

[Gray Mule]

Why not have Smith and Childress as starters already?

You say that they should earn their positions. They did.

Last season.

So did Harrington. Does that make them safe and secure

on our 13 win team? No. But it does mean that, until

someone better comes along and takes the position away

from them, it's their position as the starter.

Collier was our starting center. Zaza has signed in and

apparently took the position away from him. Marvin

Williams started last night. Josh Smith was out with

an injury {Not a bad one} but that doesn't mean that

MW has won the position.

Joe Johnson was signed to big $$$$$ contract to be our

starting P.G. He has no guarantee he will keep the

position. If he doesn't, players at other positions

will be shuffled and someone will be out of a starting

position because, unless JJ is a complete flop as a

player, which we don't expect, he WILL start somewhere

on this team.

Starting lineup:

JJ, JOSH & JOSH, HARRINGTON & ZAZA.

If anyone else wants to start, all they have to do is

prove that they are better than one of these five.

We expect to be better this season for a couple of

reasons {or more} because we have a stronger bench

this year, we have more experience, both on the floor

and in the coaching. Last but not least, we expect to

be better on the free throw line. We lost games last

season because of our poor foul shooting %.

No, Hawks aren't there, but the're gaining on it.

GO HAWKS !!!!!!

[Buzzard]

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Why not have Smith and Childress as starters already?

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I believe they are our starters right now and quite frankly for our 13 win team it is by default....we don't have anyone better.

And also as a fan, I do hope they get better....hope with all my heart that they get a lot better.

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JJ, JOSH & JOSH, HARRINGTON & ZAZA.

If anyone else wants to start, all they have to do is

prove that they are better than one of these five.

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Exactly That is part of my point and the other is we may/can/will go get someone who is better and not take it from a fans perspective as an afront or an attack....

This is all about rebuilding and until we are competing in the playoffs no fan or player should think or feel like any of our players are set...

[thesheedera]

Buzzard, I'm picking up what you're putting down. The desperate pleas for a big man and a point guard overshadowed the fact that the team needs starter quality players at every position. In my opinion, only Joe Johnson has proven he's worthy of a starting position on a true contending NBA team.

The rest is completely unearned, even if you put up good numbers for a half a season, that doesn't mean more than "promise" unless you generate some wins.

People expect our #2 pick to be a savior and change the franchise immediately. When was the last time a team went from 13 wins to being a truly competitive team in the NBA with one draft and a couple free agent moves?

The road ahead is a long one.

[Blunt91]

Those people and you included Buzzard are forgetting the most important factor in that we are a very young team. I think that was one of the main reasons we were so bad and not that we don't have enough good players. Give the Kids a chance to grow.

[Packfill]

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Buzzard, I'm picking up what you're putting down. The desperate pleas for a big man and a point guard overshadowed the fact that the team needs starter quality players at every position. In my opinion, only Joe Johnson has proven he's worthy of a starting position on a true contending NBA team.

The rest is completely unearned, even if you put up good numbers for a half a season, that doesn't mean more than "promise" unless you generate some wins.

People expect our #2 pick to be a savior and change the franchise immediately. When was the last time a team went from 13 wins to being a truly competitive team in the NBA with one draft and a couple free agent moves?

The road ahead is a long one.

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San Antonio the year after they drafted Duncan.

[gsuteke]

San Antonio is a poor example. the Admiral had been injured the year before. they had a playoff caliber team in place before Duncan came aboard. Also, Duncan is a big. Bigs will make a more immediate impact, especially one that stayed in school like Duncan did a lot faster than a 6 foot 7 19 yr old phenom that is still developing his game.

[Nicholasp27]

u make good points, but the fact of the matter is that we may already have 90% of the pieces in place for our future...we just gotta let them grow

6apg: jj may hit this as pg

20ppg: jj/al...chill/smoove/marvin/salim have this potential in the future as well

8rpg: chill/smoove/marvin all have this potential, as do zaza and batman...smoove is more likely than chill since he'll play closer to the basket

be patient...this is just year 2 of rebuilding...

[dbracy]

JJ could be a 2 million dollar player and he would still be a starter, because of his talent.

Based on most of your post you have a strong affinity for Chillz, and thats cool.

I think you are more concerned with his development and playing time and you see JJ as a threat (assumming JJ doesn't work out at PG), but JJ will be Chillz biggest asset as he gives up the rock, its up to Chillz to do something with it. Being in his 2nd season, you may be expecting too much as well. Chillz will be fine, and he's developing at a good pace.

[Diesel]

I'm not hating on JJ at all.

I agree, he is very talented and I look forward to seeing him be JJ..

What i was saying is that 70 million dollars makes you a starter... He has the talent to command the money...

But for your better understanding.

We could have 5 Micheal Jordans on our team making 2 million dollars apiece... However, with 1 JJ, making 70 million dollars... He has to be a starter!!

So we'd take the floor with 4 MJs and 1 JJ... That Last MJ would have to sit on the bench!

Does that help?

[Diesel]

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Buzzard, I'm picking up what you're putting down. The desperate pleas for a big man and a point guard overshadowed the fact that the team needs starter quality players at every position.

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Why not get a starter quality PG or C then? Your argument is weak. If you have holes on a team that has lost many games... what do you do fill the holes or pack the team up with more of the same?

It's that simple...

Marvin doesn't give us something that we don't already have....

By making the pick, then you have to go with a GOD AWFUL Philosophy that denies that there is a need for specialization in BBall. What will happen is that we will either prove or disprove it.

I consider myself a good student of basketball and of basketball History. What History has shown is that ALWAYS good teams beat good individuals. ALWAYS, there are certain function that must be present in a GOOD TEAM.

I'm going along with BK with this Versatility crap... But even in the midst of Versatility, you need specialization. I just hope on the road to a better understanding we don't nose dive ever night on the boards!

[Nicholasp27]

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Why not get a starter quality PG or C then?

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we did...his name is Joe Johnson

[AHF]

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I consider myself a good student of basketball and of basketball History. What History has shown is that ALWAYS good teams beat good individuals. ALWAYS, there are certain function that must be present in a GOOD TEAM.

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To be fair, a large % of NBA champions were led by the best player in the league that season from Michael to Shaq to Duncan in recent years. The team with the single best player is often the best team.

[Diesel]

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To be fair, a large % of NBA champions were led by the best player in the league that season from Michael to Shaq to Duncan in recent years. The team with the single best player is often the best team.

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Let's be a little more critical...

Micheal was the best player in the league for years before he finally made it to a championship game. The Piston (who was a good team) would whip Chicago's ass year by year.

Shaq. Shaq was the most dominate player in the game for years... with KOBE... First, let's talk about Shaq in Orlando. They made it to the finals and got DISMANTLED by Houston.

Next, Shaq with the Lakers. How many times did Utah beat up on a Laker team that Featured: Shaq, Elden, Kobe, Eddie, Fish, Ceballos, NVE? It's damn embarrassing to have 4 allstars and to get swept by Utah. That's proof to my point for sure.

Duncan went into a good team situation and the Spurs have been very good at keeping a good team around Duncan. But even in this last series... It was evident that Duncan wasn't even the best player on his TEAM. Had somebody Gaurded Horry in game 5, the Pistons would be the repeat world Champs.

I think that even superstars find championship after they find a good team.

One other point is Detroit vs. LAL.

The Lakers had Shaq and Kobe... Two top 5 players in this league. Detroit had no top 5 players.. But they certainly did dismantle the Lakers...

HISTORY SHOWS... a Good team ALWAYS wins out over an Individual.

[dbracy]

I agree money for the most part would dictate who would start, but even if everyone earned the minimal, based on talent along, the starting lineup would really change.

JJ

Chillz

Al

Smooth

ZaZa

[Buzzard]

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Those people and you included Buzzard are forgetting the most important factor in that we are a very young team. I think that was one of the main reasons we were so bad and not that we don't have enough good players. Give the Kids a chance to grow.

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I am not forgetting this. What I am really stating is when you have one of the worst teams in the NBA you have to look for improvement at every position.

How is it that all we need is a center when last year we could not pass, score, or rebound? Your points about our youth are taken but until they do start doing at least one of those things and hopefully more than one it is still a need and should not be counted on...

We just can't decide all we need is a center and stay locked into that.....If we do, the chances are very high we are going to miss the boat on a very good player (draft or free agency)

How many starting quality centers come through the draft or free agency over the course of one season?

We could have drafted a center with all three of our picks this year and still not have gotten one who would ever make an all star team. Heck we may not have gotten one who could outplay Zaza.

[Plainview1981]

I could careless what a sh!tty place like Cleveland thinks.