Rookie Rankings (I.H.)

[Diesel]

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I think BK believed those things. I think that hopefully this season has shown him that these things are false.

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Outside of laying a blueprint for the team, BK's Job is the main talent evaluator. If BK can't evaluate talent and determine successfully how it is to be used in his blueprint, then he's not the guy for the job.

We all worry about that talent evaluation because of his track record..

He drafted Swift and Bender before he came to us.

He also drafted Diaw over Howard. Regaurdless of how good Diaw has been for Phoenix, Howard is still the better player.

He took Chillz over Iguadala (although, I would have done this move).

He also took Marvin over Paul.

I can't exactly give him a pass on his talent evaluation.

I can only hope that it mends in with his blueprint..

However, when he acquires 7 Sfs/Sgs at one time and say that one will be a PG and others will be this position and that position but they don't have the skill set for those positions... I have to wonder.

[Lascar78]

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So, your position is that if we had Paul we might be too good to get a high lottery pick?? Sounds like the Clipper plan.

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I'm not saying that's my plan, but it might work out that way

Someone was saying that Paul would have been perfect because we could have had him and possibly gotten a guy in Gay who has equal potential. I was just responding by saying that there is no way that we would be that bad with Paul here. That's all. That is pretty much factual to me. Paul is the difference maker in NO, and he would be a difference maker here. I thought he would struggle much more than he has against bigger guards.

However, what I am saying is that given how things have worked out, this might still work out for the better for us. Again, Marvin+Rondo or Marvin+Aldridge might end up being better than Paul + #10 pick next year. At this point, that seems somewhat more likely than Marvin flat out being better than Paul.

The clipper plan was to do this year after year and lose on the cheap. Our plan is basically to have 2 real high picks (last year and this coming year) and then move on up hopefully. That's about how fast you can have a complete rebuild.

[DJlaysitup]

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...JJ wanted payday... BK wanted JJ.

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I think you're dead on there Diesel. That's not a knock against JJ, he's proven to be a top quality 2 and nobody should have to apologize for looking out for themselves, money-wise.

As far as BK overpaying (with the draft picks), that's not JJ's fault either. There should be no additional pressure on him just because BK got snookered.

[drzachary]

Even with those blunders (some are arguably not), he's still a pretty good evaluator: Gasol, Magic Diaw (I refuse to give him anything but credit for our Gallic friend), Smoove, Salim.

A lot of GMs don't even do that well in the draft.

[tmac13]

BK's only method of GMing is to strip a team, make it horrible, and hope to draft where you cannot fail..However, even in doing this he has made huge mistakes..Deng over Chills was a nobrainer, Paul or Deron over Marvin was only logical..All 3 had star potential and we were loaded at Marvins position and bare at the point..I know I am in the minority here, but so far BK's track record is lousy..Babcock could have done as well if he decided to intentionally be awful every year.I know some of you take delight in BK's smartass attitude, but to me he simply looks like a bully who responds poorly anytime he is asked to explain his actions or intentions.

[jezmund]

BK can draft. Plain and simple. We have more players that contribute than those that don't from the draft. You can't even compare him and Babcock because Babcock never drafted a player that contributed. (Besides maybe JT?)

[Lascar78]

well I don't disagree, and I'm not without any concerns with BK. However I don't think it's fair to judge Marvin in any way at this point, he was a known long-term project.

Given how Diaw's looking, it looks like he was smart for drafting him, he just didn't keep him long enough and get the right system for him.

Drafting Smoove was a steal.

To me his only drafting mistake as a hawk is Chill over Iguodala. I would reverse that in a heartbeat, and he went against the general concensus of talent scouts.

The problem is that you are judging a long-term plan in the short term. If he trades Al for a big (let's say Nene for instance), drafts a PG (let's say Rondo), or the opposite, we're looking good

Rondo/Lue

JJ/Salim

Marvin/Chill

Smith/Batista

Nene/Zaza/Anderson

is a great young team with balance, offense, and defense.

We are in year 2 of a full rebuild.

Exchange Rondo/Nene with [PG we get for Al]/Aldridge if you want.

I think BK is an above average GM, but he is not without flaws. Like I've said before, I think this coming summer is the one where he finally has the tools to assemble a complete team if he's competent. If he fails this summer, I think he should be fired.

But so far I think he's done a great job of getting rid of our bad contracts, a great job of getting talent for players who were going to leave, a great job attracting a big FA to a losing situation, a good job finding FA's that are good deals, a good job drafting (not great). He's hired a coach who so far has been average at best and has failed to put together a cohesive team.

If he can adress our holes this offseason, he's been great overall. If he still thinks Lue/JJ is a great PG combination, and doesn't get us a presence in the middle, that's a major problem. I see no reason to not have faith at this point.

[KB21]

You know what makes me sick to my stomach? Fans that have no appreciation for what it is to look forward and get a good idea of what a player will be, not what they are right now.

It would make me sick to know that I was the GM that took Joe Smith instead of Kevin Garnett. It would make me sick to know that I took Chauncy Billups with the third pick when I could have taken Tracy McGrady.

You know what? If New Orleans could have put together a package to get the 2nd pick in the draft (and they tried), do you think they would have taken Chris Paul. Hell no!! They would have taken Marvin Williams, just as every other sane GM in the NBA would have taken Marvin Williams with the 2nd pick.

[Diesel]

The way that you turn around a losing franchise is by acquiring talent. BK knows that it won't be long before people start to look at his creation and wonder... I mean nobody but Marvin on Hawksquawk has an indefinite time to develop.

I think overpaying for JJ was a neccessary step to get this team on the right track.

Nobody said anything when Cleveland signed Hughes for 70 million.

I think in the longrun this move will be seen as a pivotal move, even if JJ never becomes an allstar.

[tmac13]

Babcock also tried to win, so far BK has made no attempt to put a complete team on the court..Here are the people that BK has drafted in the 1st round, you tell me..

(2)Swift..Average player..an all potential guy like Marvin

(3)Gasol..Great pick, but at 3 you should get a great pick.

(7)Battier..A little above average player

(21)Diaw..Over Howard?

(6)Chills..Over Deng?

(17)Smoove..Great pick, we were lucky he fell to 17..

(2)Marvin..Over Paul and Deron?

Nothing great about that record, looks about average to me considering where he has drafted.

[Lascar78]

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It would make me sick to know that I took Chauncy Billups with the third pick when I could have taken Tracy McGrady.

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While I get your point, I'll take the 2004 finals MVP over a guy who quit on his team and has never won a playoff series

[Diesel]

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You can't even compare him and Babcock because Babcock never drafted a player that contributed. (Besides maybe JT?)

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I think a more evident truth is that you can't compare the two because Babcock never had a team this BAD.

I will give Babcock some credit. He could evaluate talent in a trade. The problem is this... He had NO Blueprint and He had no clue about putting together a winning vet team. He also could never capitalize in the draft because he was drafting in positions where you actually have to be good to find talent and he wasn't good. Nor did he have enough scouts.

However, as Tmac pointed out... BK has us in the lottery top 8 for the past 2 years. We should be getting talent.

I will credit BK on some of his acquisition. Like the acquisition of Al for Jax. The acquisition of JJ. The acquisition of Zaza.

About Smoove.

I still believe him picking Smoove was a Homer move and not because he believed in Smoove's ability. Read what he said about Smoove. He didn't declare that Smoove was a great talent. He used the P word. He actually felt that it would be 2-3 yrs before Smoove could contribute. I'm sure he also undervalued Smoove's work ethic (as did most scouts and GMs)..

Still, on the board he could have choosen: Smoove, JR SMITH, and Jameer Nelson. He picked the Homeboy to make up for not getting Dwight Howard. Smoove is not long. At the time, Smoove was not versatile. He didn't fit BK's mold.

I'm not going to harp over him passing over Duhon because the second round is the biggest crap shoot in the world.

[KB21]

Who cares that he was on a better team that won a championship? He is not the better player.

Tracy McGrady is the player that has gone on to put up at least 24 ppg, 6 rpg, and 4.5 apg over his last six years.

It took him 3 years to get to that point.

[Lascar78]

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(3)Gasol..Great pick, but at 3 you should get a great pick.

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Yeah I mean he's only averaging a shade under 20/10, with

26.6 PPG, 12.0 RPG, 4.2 APG, 2.8 BPG, 55 FG%, 80 FT%

over the last 5

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(7)Battier..A little above average player

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Who was drafted right after? Eddie Griffin, then Diop, then White. A solid pick

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(21)Diaw..Over Howard?

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this year:

Diaw: 11/7/6/1blk

Howard: 15/7/2

I'll take diaw's numbers

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(17)Smoove..Great pick, we were lucky he fell to 17..

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So it doesn't count when he picks well because someone else should have taken him?

Your hate is blinding you

[KB21]

What?

Josh is 6'9". He had a 7'1" wingspan. How is that not long?

[Diesel]

In 1996 after the Dominique dibacle.. Babcock said.. In the year 1999, we will make it up. We will have a dominant team with 4 draft picks in the first round and 2 big exemptions...... 1999 came. Babcock destroyed that team with Smitty, Deke, Mookie... He replaced them with his four big picks:

JT, Dion Glover, Cal Bowdler, and Jumaine Jones (I mean some Philly Pick that I can't remember)..

& his two big exemptions:

Jim Jackson & Duane Ferrell...

And started us down the road to losing...

That taught me that nothing in Basketball is worth waiting for...

So you can be sick KB. Be sick as you please. You will never be as sick as I was the day they traded Smitty, Mookie, and Nique and told me to wait..

[tmac13]

Its not hate, its just not the blind faith some here have..BK has the worst record in any GM , in any sport that I can remember, and all I hear from most here is how great he is, I would love to see some results on the court..Intentionally tanking entire seasons to get high draft choices is not much of a plan, but so far thats all he has done.

[Lascar78]

ok maybe it's not hate, but it's the opposite of pro-BK homerism. Just because some are excessively optimistic doesn't mean you have to be extra pessimistic.

[tmac13]

I only want to some some fruits for the labor of BK's demolition plan..I simply think so far he an average GM with a lousy attitude and a huge ego.

[Lascar78]

well if there are to be fruits, I think next year is when they will be visible in terms of W/L