Chicago's coming for Al (Probably)...

[KB21]

Sweetney is a stiff, and Nocioni is nothing to write home about. Trading Al for those two would be an incredible rip off in the Bulls favor.

They either give the Hawks Ben Gordon, or no deal.

[KB21]

Yeah.

Let's continue to devalue an above average player and deal him for a couple of scrubs and a mid first round pick.

Sometimes, I think some of you just want Billy Knight to make a bad deal.

[Admin]

mark my words on Nocioni, he is going to be a really good player for many years. I have no doubt that he is capable of putting up the numbers that Al is or close to it were he on the Hawks. He is a severely underrated player and BK said last year that he was really fond of his game when they were talking to him about Curry.

Right now I am very underwhelmed with Sweetneys game, but he has shown flashes of being a good player at times.

[mrhonline]

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Let's continue to devalue an above average player and deal him for a couple of scrubs and a mid first round pick.

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KB, it's you who have no sense of Harrington's value. He's a soon-to-be free agent who plays no defense, is a tweener, hasn't helped his team to win consistently, and is looking for a big payday.

Couple that with Knight's reported desire to add a draft pick to replace one of the two he sent to Phoenix, and this deal is a likely deadline trade.

Funny thing is, the Hawks traded an important, yet flawed player last year for - you guessed it - expiring contracts and mid-first. I'm sure you would have poo-poo'd the Walker trade last year at this time, too.

Meanwhile, you keep blathering on about Gordon, who isn't even on the trade block:

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Gordon hasn't said anything publicly to indicate he's disgruntled, and Bulls GM John Paxson told SI.com on Wednesday that his second-year star has not approached him with any concerns.

Paxson also said he has no intention of trading Gordon

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Gordon's agent, meanwhile, says that while his client might get frustrated at times,

he wants to stay in Chicago

. "My typical response is, every player wants to play more. If you ask any player, they'd say the same thing," Billy Ceisler told SI.com. "As far as this trade talk, I told John Paxson, '(Ben) is a selfless kid. He'll do everything in his power to help his team win. He did it in college.'"

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http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2005/writ...ning.questions/

[KB21]

Al Harrington is a consistent 18 PPG, 7 RPG player, and you want to deal him for chump change.

As I've said, if Chicago is willing to give up Ben Gordon, then BK will talk to them. If the Lakers are willing to give up Lamar Odom, then BK will talk. BK is not going to take on someone's trash for a 25 year old player just entering the prime of his career that BK absolutely loves.

[Admin]

They are very close in shooting percentage across the board and if you give Nocioni the extra 10mpg that Al is getting, I guarantee he would add the extra 7 ppg and 2 rpg that Al has over him. Given that his salary is much lower than Al's and that he has a very bright future in front of him, he is a far more valuable player than you are giving him credit for.

[mrhonline]

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As I've said, if Chicago is willing to give up Ben Gordon, then BK will talk to them. If the Lakers are willing to give up Lamar Odom, then BK will talk. BK is not going to take on someone's trash for a 25 year old player just entering the prime of his career that BK absolutely loves.

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I love how you always speak for Knight like you have any clue what he intends to do.

I went and checked and, yes, you pulled this same material out for Walker:

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Well, this is a situation where the Hawks need to be careful. They don't need to overpay for Walker,

but they also don't need to use him as a salary dump.

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That's exactly what happened, huh, KB? Did Billy not consult you that time?

Meanwhile, in the real world:

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/spo...ts/13491670.htm

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Perhaps the most interesting question for the Hawks is where will they ship forward Al Harrington? He can become a free agent after this season, and Atlanta is overloaded at the position, so

it makes little sense to pay big to keep him.

General manager Billy Knight is listening to offers, and

he wants draft picks to replace the first-rounders he must send Phoenix as part of the Joe Johnson sign-and-trade.

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That's funny - the exact same logic you used about 'Toine being used about Al. And, yes, Harrington is younger in age, but with those knees...plus, the Hawks didn't even have Marvin when they traded Walker.

1+1=2.

[KB21]

Give Nocioni 10 more minutes, and he'll foul out 9 times out of 10.

[KB21]

No. That's not what happened. Antoine Walker turned into Joe Johnson, because the draft pick we get in that deal is going to Phoenix for Johnson. Walker was also not a 25 year old entering his prime. He's showing this year that he's clearly on the downside of his career.

Being able to get a first round pick for Antoine was a genius move on the part of BK. Al is worth more than just a first round pick though.

[Admin]

he is a far better defender than Al and a similarly effective scorer as well. I am not trying to make this a slam Al thread because I am a huge fan of his and wish he were going to be here long term, but I dont have any confidence in that and to be able to get a young player of Nocionis caliber would be good for us.

Oh and I just looked this up, in 27 mpg Nocioni only averages 3 fouls per game. In 37 minutes Al is averaged 4.2 fouls. Sounds about even to me.

[KB21]

With the Hawks, he'd foul out. His reputation is one where he does nothing but run around on the court with his arms flailing, bumping people all the time.

The scouting report:

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If there's anyone who needs a nickname, it's this guy. Nocioni is constantly flailing his arms, runs around with a crazy wide-eyed look, and

fouls anything that moves.

You know the type -- he's the manic, annoying guy at a pickup game who tries way too hard. Adding to the effect, Nocioni wore a Lincoln-esque goatee-minus-the-mustache thing for much of the season. I propose dubbing him "The Wild Bull of the Pampas" in light of his Argentine heritage, but I'm accepting other nominations.

As for his abilities, Nocioni projected to be an adequate NBA player, but

his numbers were pretty awful. He continually lost the ball on drives to the basket, struggled to hit outside shots, and got lit up on defense.

The only aspect that held up was his rebounding, which was among the best at his position.

I suspect the reason is that Nocioni needs to play power forward, which was his position in Europe. It's a risk to put a player of his size at that position, but Nocioni is so unrelentingly physical that he probably could hold his own defensively. He also might get called for fewer fouls, as officials tend to look the other way more often in the post. Offensively, a switch might help get his game in gear. He would have a quickness edge on opposing power forwards and have an easier time getting to the basket.

Nocioni's physical play fit in perfectly with Chicago's style and endeared him to the locals, but the Bulls have to figure out how to put him in a better position to succeed at both ends of the court. Considering the frontcourt will be shorthanded if Curry leaves, shifting positions might be the perfect solution.

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[TheDude]

al for duhon and 1st.

[mrhonline]

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Al is worth more than just a first round pick though.

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Nice recovery, but won't you at least try to explain why?

IMO, the only thing Al does well is score, and even that is highly inconsistent. He is virutally useless as a starter in the WC, where he's not big enough to play the 4, nor agile enough to play the 3. His future as a Hawk is already sealed, with three possible replacements in Smith, Childress, and Marvin. As was mentioned, he has old knees, a desire for a big payday, poor defense both on the perimeter and in the post, isn't a great passer, and doesn't improve his team. Remind me again why a team would give up anything of significant value for Al Harrington? The "3/4 tweener" market isn't exactly a thriving one.

I bet Knight would love to get a viable young player in exchange for Harrington, but the chances of that are slim. He'll likely settle for the best first rounder he can get.

Finally, you keep referring to Knight's beloved affection for Al, but Knight also said those same things about Walker. There were also rumors that the Hawks were disappointed with Al's production, and I find those just as credible because of BK's "stonewall" impression.

[Buzzard]

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If their package involved Gordon and NY's first and they take a PG off our hands...I would consider it. Especially if they give up Sweetney too.

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Who are we talking about that Chicago would give up all that for, Stojakovich? Unless Chicago or any other team we send Al to matches a very nice offer....he walks next year.

My expectations are high on Marvin, yours are at least as high on what we will get for Al. He is a very talented player but not many teams will be willing to give him 10 mill a year, which is what it will cost to keep him.

[Diesel]

Gordon is not a PG.

[Diesel]

With Al's Bird Rights, they will be first in line to re-sign Al in the offseason.

Secondly. They lack scoring. They are getting beat because they can't push the score beyond 80 points a night. They don't have anybody on that team that can create for themselves.

I think they have loads of interest in either Al or Boozer.

[Diesel]

My terms are that we get both Gordon and NY's first for AL plus they take back one of our PGs...

I would hope that BK would hold that same kind of value..

But it's nuts to see some of these guys say Al for Nioconi and Sweetney or Al for Songalia and Piawkwoski or whatever they proposed... I would have rather heard Al for a lifetime of Corndogs... At least with Corndogs there would be a purpose...

[Diesel]

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ouple that with Knight's reported desire to add a draft pick to replace one of the two he sent to Phoenix, and this deal is a likely deadline trade.

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Is this first hand information that you are talking about or is this something that I can read about... When did BK say that he desired a first round pick to replace the 2 he sent to Phoenix... I don't think he has..

So are you making this up as you go along or has BK been whispering sweet nuthings to you.

[Diesel]

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He is a very talented player but not many teams will be willing to give him 10 mill a year, which is what it will cost to keep him.

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So if not many other teams will give Al 10 million dollars per year, why do you expect him to walk??

I mean, I can see us offering Al between 8-10 million.

My question is what team will match that?? You just told me NONE. So the best thing for us to do is just wait and re-sign him UNLESS a good deal comes along. I don't see any good deals yet... So we might as well just resign Al.

[Spiral]

I think we'd be shooting ourselves in the foot if we traded Al for Sweetney/Nocioni. Nocioni is a nice "hustle" player who can knock down an open shot occasionally. Sweetney isn't what I'd think to be a deal maker. He's got a nice little back to the basket game, but he's nothing to be overly excited about. I think Al's value is at an all time high right now. He has the consistant post game that the Bulls are coveting. I personally feel his value warrants a lottery pick. I don't think he's worth Gordon & a lottery pick, but I don't think his value is low enough to accept a trade for what would equate to 2 reserves. Yes he'll be a free agent at the end of this year, but whoever he ends up with this year will have the best chance of signing him b/c they will be able to offer a better payout.

I would consent to a trade of Al/Delk for TT/2006 lottery pick, be it the Knicks pick or the Bulls pick. Reason being is because if we accept the trade for just the Bulls pick and they make the playoffs, we will come away empty handed because that pick would automatically go to Phoenix.