Challenging the 20 yr old rule

[Guest Walter]

Anyone heard of or considered a challenge to the 20 new year old rule? Such things usually require a respectable candidate and Oden might represent just that. Any word?

W

[Devon]

Oden's at OSU, no doubt he loses his eligibilty to challenge anewly ratified, highly publicized issue.

He may stay 2 years, much like Thaddeus Young at Ga. Tech

[Lascar78]

what is there to challenge? The nba and player's association came to an agreement. Anyone who challenges will just be throwing money away and giving it to lawyers

[DJlaysitup]

Well from a strictly "legalese" standpoint, I think there could easily be a challenge under unfair labor practices.

But no quality player with any sense would do it (that sort of thing made a Curt Flood a great reputation, but not a lot of money).

Plus, with the SCOTUS getting another conservative justice there may not be any guarrantee how the labor laws would be interpretted anyway....

Sincerely, DJLaysitup

Partner, DJ, Bird, Bird, and DJ (ameteur attorneys)

[AHF]

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Well from a strictly "legalese" standpoint, I think there could easily be a challenge under unfair labor practices.

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Doubtful because the rule is the result of a collective bargaining agreement signed by the player's union.

[Lascar78]

exactly. The trial would take a day. It would be challengable if the NBA had imposed it on its own. But with the players' union having signed off on it via the CBA, it's bulletproof.

[DJlaysitup]

That's true...but the current agreement prevents a person of legal age (18-20) from making a living at his/her chosen profession strictly on the basis of age when it could easily be argued that somebody like Oden was definitely qualified to do so.

Even full-fledged labor unions can't do that.

Of course the owners would collude and screw the player who challenged.

[AHF]

The nature of the challenge Oden would bring would be an anti-trust challenge. However, it is NOT illegal to have that type of agreement if it is the result of collective bargaining. This was the exact challenge that the NFL won and there is no reason to think it would come out differently with the NBA.

[Lascar78]

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That's true...but the current agreement prevents a person of legal age (18-20) from making a living at his/her chosen profession strictly on the basis of age when it could easily be argued that somebody like Oden was definitely qualified to do so.

Even full-fledged labor unions can't do that.

Of course the owners would collude and screw the player who challenged.

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no it prevents him from joining the NBA. It does not prevent him from going to the NBDL, the CBA etc...

[Packfill]

We might as well stop talking about Oden because the only way he becomes a Hawk is if the team tanks next season, which is unlikely to happen assuming some modest roster improvements this off-season.

[Lascar78]

is there no longer a lottery next year?

[DJlaysitup]

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is there no longer a lottery next year?

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Surely...would we have a pick?

[mudderfudder77]

Heard of Maurice Clarett? It was collectively bargained, there is nothing to challenge.

And it is not denying employment to a 18yr old in thier chosen profession, they can always go play overseas.

[Packfill]

I imagine there is but the chances are very slim given that the team should be significantly better next year because of (1) the experienced gained by the rookies and second year players and (2) further reinforcements brought in through the draft and free agency.

I think it is reasonable to expect major improvements from the team given those factors. If they don't then Oden becomes a possibility, but that would mean three years of rebuilding would result in no improvement.

[Lascar78]

milwaukee won the top pick last year and they had 30+ wins. I also don't think we'll get it, but it's not an impossibility. I would hope that we're not bottom 3, but we probably won't be in the playoffs either. That's all it takes

[Guest Walter]

Maurice Clarett was a lousy representative to challenge the NFL rule. A lousy guy and marginal player. Oden appears to be quite the difference. A good guy and GREAT prospect. If you are going to challenge the rule, this is the guy you do it with.

I think forcing someone to go overseas for employment is pretty much denying them that employment.

Yes, I know it's a CBA thing, but it may read slightly different than the NFL law, may still be open to challenge, and may not have the support internally (all owners and player's union) to not allow for a reversal.

W

[mudderfudder77]

It was collectively bargained. It doesn't matter if he is a marginal prospect or not (the law doesn't care "how good you are"). Unions do this all the time with hiring quotas or freezes. Its a waste of time.

He could play ball in the states too if he wanted. ABA, CBA, just because you don't like the alternatives doesn't mean you are being denied gainful employment. But none of that matters because, again, it was collectively bargained...

[warcore]

speakin of 20 year olds-saw marvin williams at phipps plaza theatre tonight.

[AHF]

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Maurice Clarett was a lousy representative to challenge the NFL rule. A lousy guy and marginal player. Oden appears to be quite the difference. A good guy and GREAT prospect. If you are going to challenge the rule, this is the guy you do it with.

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As mudder pointed out, that is not relevant. Also, Clarett was a former heisman candidate and a third round pick so even if there was a threshold of ability he would have easily passed.

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I think forcing someone to go overseas for employment is pretty much denying them that employment.

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They can play in the NBDL, AND1 or other domestic leagues.

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Yes, I know it's a CBA thing, but it may read slightly different than the NFL law,

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There is no difference in the law for the NFL or NBA.

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may still be open to challenge,

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Its really not.

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and may not have the support internally (all owners and player's union) to not allow for a reversal.

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Legally that doesn't matter but it could lead to a reversal at the time they negotiate the next collective bargaining agreement.

[DJlaysitup]

Well I know I'm not going to win this arguement but a couple points:

- Something being "collectively bargained" doesn't mean they can just therefore adopt discriminatory practices like age, race, sex, religion, etc. restrictions. You can't collectively bargain something that's against federal law. I mean what if they collectively bargained that Asians couldn't play or Moslems were banned, or nobody under 20 or over 40.

- Most folks I knew thought the Clarett case was basically a hit against him and not a real precedent setter. A quality person with quality legal representation might turn the thing around.