IVEY STINKS!

[MoonKnight]

Why playa hate on Ivey? I missed the Sac game but I did catch the Seattle game. IMO Salim was a big reason we lost the Seattle game. He has no point guard instincts at all and his forced jumpers ignited several fast breaks for Seattle. Ivey played his usual solid D and pushed the ball for several easy transition baskets. Instead of going to the D league as you propose, I think Ivey should be getting far more minutes then he currently is seeing. While Ivey might not be true starter material now (though he might at some point in the future) he is far better then what we have now at the 1 spot.

[Diesel]

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Diesel, do you feel that any of our young guys are getting time they don't deserve?

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I would easily suggest that Salim Stoudamire is getting time that he doesn't deserve. His being on the court really hurts us more than it helps us. He comes into the game, Jacks up a 3 every time the ball is swung his way. When he hits, throw a parade, but when he most (most of the time) it leads to fast breaks... Then he doesn't play defense. He's the guy at the GYM that just knows his shot is going in every time and he never passes, never plays in the flow of the game, never plays defense. You can find him cherry picking. I was watching last night and for a minute it looked like JSmoove just would not pass it to Salim when he was open. I don't blame him.

Mainly, I believe this because I think Delk is probably better.

We can make points about Smoove vs. Chillz vs. Marvin.. But there's no doubt in my mind that Salim should be learning behind lue and delk and maybe Ivey.

[DJlaysitup]

MoonKnight...I'm not proposing Ivey be sent to the D League...just mentioning my opinion that if he were there now he doesn't have the kind of "stand out" game that would likely turn many heads. That doesn't mean he should be sent there. He has some skill and experience and we certainly need somebody to play PG minutes.

I just don't think he's ever going to be compared to Bibby, Nash, Billups, CP, or the other upper echelon PGs. Probably not ever with the 2nd level guys like Brevin Knight or Hinrich. He's not likely going to lead us to the promised land, just my opinion.

[Johnnybravo4]

Salim is avg 10ppg. Ivey couldn't score 10 points in 10 games. And if I see another post about how much the other team scores when Ivey is on the court I am going to vomit. You can't gauge a players defensive impact on 10-15 minutes a game. But I can gauge whether or not he has game...and he has none...zero..nada...nicht. And the fact that half of the people on this board are excited about him starting shows how low the standards are for Hawks fans nowadays.

Salim is a dynamic offensive talent who can be taught defense by the right coach and system. Ivey has no offensive talent whatsoever and shouldn't be starting on an NBA team because he can dribble the ball...if that is the case we could just bring over my homeboy Kevin Morris from Georgia State and have him run point. He at least was 1st team all Atlantic Sun Conf.

[exodus]

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Salim is avg 10ppg. Ivey couldn't score 10 points in 10 games.

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How many points would Salim be averaging if he only played 10 minutes a game?

3 times this month Ivey has scored 6 pts in 16 minutes or less. Looks like your math is just a little off.

And Ivey doesn't come in jacking up shots and screwing up the offense.

[Johnnybravo4]

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Salim is avg 10ppg. Ivey couldn't score 10 points in 10 games.

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How many points would Salim be averaging if he only played 10 minutes a game?

3 times this month Ivey has scored 6 pts in 16 minutes or less. Looks like your math is just a little off.

And Ivey doesn't come in jacking up shots and screwing up the offense.

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That is because Ivey doesn't do anything. It is 4 on 5 when he is in the game. I guarantee that he is not on the squad in 06'-07' But I bet that Salim is.

[Nicholasp27]

he will be on the squad and has good potential to be here long-term as our BACKUP pg; we are excited about him starting because DON'T HAVE A REAL PG, so at least we have someone who will keep the other team from blowing us out to start each half; once we get a real pg from trade/facy/draft, he should play his 10-15mpg as a backup to relieve the good pg...his being defensive is great for this as it'll help the other teams from going on big runs when our main pg is out of the game...and yes, he's no nash, but he's a backup pg that will be similiar to eric snow (tho snow was a starting pg on a good team)

[Johnnybravo4]

We don't lose game in the begining of halves..shooters are cold in the beginnings of halves..we lose games right before the half and the beginning of the fourth quarter. Put him in then and then we could gauge his effectiveness. But as far as I can tell he is garbage.

Ask any GM besides BK who he would rather have Salim or Royal and I bet it would be unanimous for Salim.

[DJlaysitup]

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he will be on the squad and has good potential to be here long-term as our BACKUP pg; we are excited about him starting because DON'T HAVE A REAL PG

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My opinion exactly. If the question is "pick the Hawks PG of the future"

A. Salim

B. Ivey

C. JJ

D. TLue

E. None of the above

I think you have to go with E.

[Plainview1981]

I slightly agree with Jonny in that this team isn't talented enough to have a poor mans Eric Snow in there at this time.

[Nicholasp27]

we got in real big holes early in the first quarter and 3rd quarter in quite a few of the first 20 or so games this year before ivey started starting

[Nicholasp27]

no, not as a starter

but a poor man's eric snow as a backup is fine, especially once we have our defensive rebounding big and our true pg

but for this team, he's our best option to start at pg due to his consistent defense and he still provides 6-8 points in the first 4 mins of the game once or twice a month

[Johnnybravo4]

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I slightly agree with Jonny in that this team isn't talented enough to have a poor mans Eric Snow in there at this time.

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Real poor man's Eric Snow. I would rather have Penny Hardaway running our point right now.

[exodus]

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But as far as I can tell he is garbage.

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This from the guy who thinks Lue > Duhon, Zaza > Big Z, and thinks Skita and Hunter (even after the failed physical) would be good pickups.

[exodus]

BTW this month Ivey has over twice as many assists as Salim and 1/4 the turnovers. They could find guys at Run and Shoot that could run the point better than Salim and shoot 37% from the field.

Any clown in the NBA can score 10 pts if they take enough shots.

[Lascar78]

Woody puts him out there and tells him just to gun. Who knows what he could do if Woody asked him to run a more normal offense and not jack every shot up? I don't know, but I know that right now he's being put in to jack up shots. So I can't hold that against him

[TheDude]

yeah i think even with developing our young talent, which i'm all for, i think you need two good veterans...joe is one of those but i don't think Al is the other one due to our depth at that position..plus i think it has to be someone who is better than Al and has to be someone who can be the central part of our team....

but again free agency is not kind to us this year.

[Lascar78]

well free agency won't be kind in terms of attracting stars, but every single summer brings an opportunity to get some vets in here. Not necessarily starters, but you can always get vets to come in here and help groom the youth. Let's hope BK does that

[Johnnybravo4]

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But as far as I can tell he is garbage.

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This from the guy who thinks Lue > Duhon, Zaza > Big Z, and thinks Skita and Hunter (even after the failed physical) would be good pickups.

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And your point is? And I don't care about failed physicals. Ask SAR about failed physicals..or even Eddy Curry.

[exodus]

The point is that Hunter sucks. Even if the Hawks were offered Hunter for free they would be better off declining. He isn't worth his contract, as Philly quickly found out.