What if....

[Lascar78]

I don't know. Not working people out does seem very bizarre. I'll judge it once I see who we draft. A lot of times actions seem weird until you find out the details and it makes a lot more sense. To be honest though, I think everyone knows what you get with Morrisson, Gay, Shelden, Aldridge, Thomas. The real questions with those guys are desire and improvement, and you don't really see those in a workout. Of course they'll be motivated fighting for a payday, but the question is what their hunger wil be once the money's in the bank.

It is nevertheless very bizarre. It seems like every year we don't work that many people out.

[Yeti]

I hope you are right. Lately my black cloud is turning into a mushroom cloud.

[Diesel]

You know somewhere in Seattle there's somebody just as stoked about Robert Swift as many here are about Marvin. The point is just like Seattle we have NEEDS and We have redundancy.

That's two things that a team shouldn't have at the same time.

I don't think we'd be complaining too much about Missing out on Marvin because he's not Jordan. At best... he's Rashard Lewis. Like somebody above said, he's just a possible Allstar talent and not a superstar.

[ATLBob]

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he's just a possible Allstar talent

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Diesel, you just made my day.

[drzachary]

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he's just a possible Allstar talent

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Diesel, you just made my day.

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Might have to put "[Marvin Williams is] a possible Allstar talent" -- Diesel in your sig?

[Yeti]

I don't agree with your assessment of Marvin, but I do agree with the solution. Send him to Seattle.

I wonder if this really just Woodson's fault for not being diverse enough. He seems to get minimal output from players from outside his sphere of reference. (In business, I've seen us send many good managers out to the West Coast and see them fail because they don't know how to relate to and communcate with people on the west coast. Different culture and values. Sometimes the results have been laughable.) So I wonder if it is the same with Woody -he does ok with eastern players like himself, but stumbles with others - Diaw, Terry, Marvin, Salim, Darko. But then he did ok with ZaZa.

[unknownjdb]

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...My thought is that if we traded him to Seattle for Swift/#10, we get a shot at 2 possible allstars.

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Makes sense to me (and I'm only a marginal Marvin hater)...plus, once the deal's over Marvin is way out there in Seattle so you don't have to face them much...the hoopla would blow over fairly quickly.

Whatever we do we better do something.

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Has Diaw blown over quickly?

[DrReality]

The thing that slays me is you do not think that Marvin has much value on our team, BUT when you talk about trading him you expect to get great deals in return. Doesn't add up. Looks like a blind eye to me.

[Diesel]

Well, let's see.

If I had 2 Mercedes S550s... does the value in either decrease? So I can go out on the market and sale them at price right?

However, for me... I don't need 2 Mercedes S550s. It's kinda wasteful. In fact, I might need a pretty good truck... Say a Ford 250 because sometimes I like to haul stuff around.

What you guys here are saying is that I should haul stuff around in one of my Mercedes S550. What I'm telling you is that my S550 is not made for that, so I might as well sell one of them and get a Ford F250 and a whole lot of other stuff.

Do you get it yet?

As long as we have redundancy, I don't see a great future HERE for Marvin. So why not use him while he still has value and get something good for him??

[uga2006]

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...I could see: Swift/Shelden/JSmoove as being the frontcourt that is hardest to score against in the league.

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Yeah...and if the AJC article is accurate, Rondo may be closer to the NBA starter level than we thought. Him driving to the hoop and sometimes finishing - sometimes dishing back to JJ could work out.

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Rondo is the best PG in this draft. Think about what he did with the type of players around him. Not to mention Tubby doesn't have a style that fits a Pg like Rondo. Put him with Rudy Gay instead of M.Williams and Gay would've still been considered the #1 overall pick. He was what made Kentucky go last year...as a true freshmen. I saw enough UK games last year and this year(even though im a die hard UGA fan) to see how great a talent he is. He pressed way to hard on a bad team this year but he will be a good point in this league.

[Buzzard]

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What you guys here are saying is that I should haul stuff around in one of my Mercedes S550. What I'm telling you is that my S550 is not made for that, so I might as well sell one of them and get a Ford F250 and a whole lot of other stuff.

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No Diesel that is what you are saying. Again putting your words in others mouth. What some of us are saying is, we like having two S550's; one red and one black, possibly a hardtop and a convertable; and if we need a big old f250, maybe plain old white; so as not to worry about the paint job, we should just go out and get (draft) one...

[Buzzard]

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he's just a possible Allstar talent and not a superstar.

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I think the 1st step to becoming a superstar is to become an all-star. Then see where the chips fall. And like someone else stated, you don't value Marvin much in Atlanta; but send him somewhere else and he is worth at least two lottery picks. You would definitely be a GM that rolled the dice feverishly with his teams’ future at stake. Sort of like Lefty rolling the dice this weekend at Wing Foot; if you know what I mean. You would be a very scary GM....

[Diesel]

I think the fact that we have redundancy... it does make Marvin Less valuable to us. Honestly, if we traded Marvin, what would we miss about his game??

For instance, if the trade was Marvin for Livingston.... What about Marvin's game would we miss? Would there be somebody crying about losing Marvin's ability to shoot from the midrange?

Back to my Mercedes S550. You can only drive one at a time. Having a black and a red one is overkill if you can't just go out and find something else that you need. Having redundancy and NEED is a bad thing.

[Yeti]

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Honestly, if we traded Marvin, what would we miss about his game??

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I can say the same thing about every player on the team including Smoove, Chill, and ZaZa. None are close to being finished products yet. Maybe they'll turn out, maybe they won't and if you don't want to wait and watch their development then you've got the wrong team. Try the Pistons or Heat. - Personally I like watching Marvin explode to the basket but he doesn't do it enough and needs to back up a foot on his jumper to clear the 3pt line. But you can see something exciting there that he's holding back for now.

But honestly, I haven't missed too many players when they left - 'Nique, Doc Rivers, S.Smith, maybe Spud.

I would only consider trading Marvin because I think the kid needs good coaching and playing time ... and it isn't happening here. Especially if we draft another forward which is your redundancy argument. That's valid - it just piss poor management. Our weaknesses are a 1 and 5, but we are going to take a 4? And maybe pass on Roy. And we held AL so long we may get nothing? Or even worse, we keep him with all the others? and we don't know whats happening with Andersen? Not to mention our ownership. That's enough, I feel the black clouds gathering again.

[DrReality]

I prefer Volvo's.

[Diesel]

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Honestly, if we traded Marvin, what would we miss about his game??

I can say the same thing about every player on the team including Smoove, Chill, and ZaZa. None are close to being finished products yet.

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Only about the redundant players... You could say that about Smoove because you have Marvin to step in his place. You can not say that about Zaza because we don't have another C. You can not say that about JJ because we can not replace what he does. You can not say that about even Al because for now we have no low post scorers.

There are only 2 maybe three players for whom that statement applies and it has less to do about ability at this moment and more to do with skillset that will be developed. Like it or not, Marvin and Smoove are developing the same skill sets... not different ones. Sadly, neither is a Pf. So you wishing that Smoove comes back from summer break to be a PF is a joke. Even tweeners like Walker and Jamison who play both positions played PF primarily as HS and college players. The same can not be said about either Marvin or Smoove.

[DJlaysitup]

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...Our weaknesses are a 1 and 5, but we are going to take a 4?...

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Al is likely gone - so our weaknesses are 1 3 4 5. We have a below starting level PG, a great 2, 2 youngsters that should be developmental backups at the 3, nobody who can really play the 4 and a decent backup at the 5.

This team is still FULL of holes.

[Diesel]

Even with all those holes and backups, we were in a lot of games. I know you can't live off of almost... however, I think that some of our players are suitable if we can clear up the holes and find the right players to compliment what we have.

Too many guys are looking for the Next KG, the Next Kobe, the Next MJ... There is nobody in this draft that fits that bill. So our job is to find the best player for US. We don't have time to d*ck around with potential this year.

[AHF]

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...Our weaknesses are a 1 and 5, but we are going to take a 4?...

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Al is likely gone - so our weaknesses are 1 3 4 5. We have a below starting level PG, a great 2, 2 youngsters that should be developmental backups at the 3, nobody who can really play the 4 and a decent backup at the 5.

This team is still FULL of holes.

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Josh Smith should not be a developmental backup. He needs to be starting for any team he plays for. Marvin has shown he can definitely play the 3. We don't have any need at the 3 spot. Whether either can fill the need at the 4 is a different question, but I can't say this team remotely has a need for a SF as you do.

[DJlaysitup]

Well I'm not saying we have a need at small forward...just that on most good teams either JS or MW would be backing up a more experienced starter. I certainly don't see a need to bring in anybody for the 3 spot - but I still wouldn't call it a position of strength for the Hawks right now. Probably will be in a couple more years. TLue, MW/JS, Zaza would all be backups on the upper tier teams (IMHO). As far as real 4s go - we have nobody.