How in the F#ck did we not make the playoffs?

[Johnnybravo4]

There was a thread in ISH about the best frontcourt of all time which made me think of our frontcourt in 2002-2003 which could have been our best frontcourt ever...and in hindsight should have been our best team ever.

Just for laughs check out this preview article.

http://probasketball.about.com/library/wee...rms=jason+terry

Atlanta Hawks Preview

...Team Most Likely to Come From Nowhere and Win the East

The Big Dog is barking for the Atlanta Hawks and why not? The Hawks boast a formidable frontline not seen in the Eastern Conference in years as the Hawks look to be prime contenders for the title of next great surprise team in the East.

Power Ranking: #9

Projected Record: 46-36

Projected Finish: 1st in Central Division, 2nd in Eastern Conference

Odds to Win the NBA Title: 40/1 (Opened 120/1)

Atlanta Hawks Win Total Over/Under: 41.5

Game of the Year: Jan. 14, Atlanta Hawks vs. Milwaukee Bucks

Additions: SF Darvin Ham (from Milwaukee), PF Antonio Harvey, C Amal McCaskill (from Portland), SF Glenn Robinson (from Milwaukee)

Subtractions: C Cal Bowdler, SF Toni Kukoc (to Milwaukee), SF Hanno Mottola (Overseas), C Leon Smith (to Milwaukee), PF Mark Strickland, PG Jacque Vaughn (to Orlando)

Rookies: PG Dan Dickau (Gonzaga)

Projected Starting Five

SF: Glenn Robinson

PF: Shareef Abdur-Rahim

C: Theo Ratliff

SG: Dion Glover

PG: Jason Terry

Sixth Man: Ira Newble

Franchise Player: Shareef Abdur-Rahim

Breakout: Dion Glover

Burnout: DerMarr Johnson

Projected No.1 Pick: (No.16 from Indiana) C David Harrison (Colorado)

One Trade That Needs to Happen: PF Alan Henderson to Miami Heat for SF Laphonso Ellis and PG Anthony Carter

Fantasy Basketball Rankings and Stat Projections:

Shareef Abdur-Rahim/Overall: #23/Power Forward: #7/18.8 PPG/9.2 RPG/3.2 APG/1.1 BPG/

1.2 SPG/81% FT Shooting/47% FG Shooting

Glenn Robinson/Overall: #35/Small Forward: #7/22.6 PPG/6.6 RPG/3.6 APG/1.3 SPG/

84% FT Shooting/47% FG Shooting

Theo Ratliff/Overall: #49/Center: #6/11.2 PPG/7.9 RPG/3.1 BPG/50% FG Shooting

Jason Terry/Overall: #60/Point Guard: #13/16.4 PPG/6.6 APG/1.6 SPG/82% FT Shooting/

145 3-Pointers/37% 3-Point FG Shooting

Dion Glover/Overall: Top 150/Shooting Guard: #26/12.1 PPG/1.2 SPG

Nazr Mohammed/Overall: Top 150/Center: #32/8.4 PPG/5.3 RPG/49% FG Shooting

[AHF]

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There was a thread in ISH about the best frontcourt of all time which made me think of our frontcourt in 2002-2003 which could have been our best frontcourt ever...and in hindsight should have been our best team ever.

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Wow. That is overstating it by so much I don't know where to begin. Best team ever? Better than the Nique teams? Better than the multiple HOF squads led by Pettit and Hagan? Heck, that team doesn't even rise to the level of the Mutombo, Mookie, Smitty and Laettner squad. The 2002-03 is not even close to the Hawks best ever.

If it was, we would be one sorry franchise.

[Johnnybravo4]

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There was a thread in ISH about the best frontcourt of all time which made me think of our frontcourt in 2002-2003 which could have been our best frontcourt ever...and in hindsight should have been our best team ever.

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Wow. That is overstating it by so much I don't know where to begin. Best team ever? Better than the Nique teams? Better than the multiple HOF squads led by Pettit and Hagan? Heck, that team doesn't even rise to the level of the Mutombo, Mookie, Smitty and Laettner squad. The 2002-03 is not even close to the Hawks best ever.

If it was, we would be one sorry franchise.

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A bit of hyperbole but you know what I mean. But that team would have beat the 90's Nique teams, I don't know about the Petit teams..I am only in my 30's. But you get what I am saying.

Even in our heyday in the 80's, would any media outlet proclaim us to pretty much be the best team in the east? The best we have ever been conceived is possibly 3rd, behind manifestations of Celtics and Pistons, and Celtics and Sixers.

[AHF]

I know what you mean in terms of that team looking good on paper but they were pretty bad defenders at most positions (Ratliff mixed boat; SAR weak; Robinson useless; Glover bad; Terry weak); they ballhandling and playmaking was aweful; and nobody was a "lift the level of the team" kind of player. It was really a team of useful role players who didn't compliment eachother well.

If you just look at the stats of the players and look at them on paper, though, you would clearly think they should make the playoffs. That team illustrates the importance of getting pieces that fit together.

[Johnnybravo4]

Exactly. It is the problem that the Knicks are facing right now.

[AHF]

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Exactly. It is the problem that the Knicks are facing right now.

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That is the same team that came to my mind. Guys like Marbury, Francis, Curry, etc. seem like they are talented enough to be a lot better than they are but they just don't seem to fit together well and nobody raises the level of play on the court. Consequently, the individual numbers of the guys (historically) look a lot better than the collective effort of the team.

[TheDude]

put the current Joe Johnson on that team and we go to the playoffs..that team was without a leader or coach or defense or ahh what the hell what am i saying, they sucked.

[KB21]

It's because that front line was very flawed.

Neither Glenn Robinson or Shareef Abdur-Rahim were good defenders. In fact, I would call both below average defenders. Theo Ratliff was a great help defender, but he couldn't defend straight up. Glenn Robinson was also a shot chucker that did very little else on the court. Shareef was a good player, but he wasn't the type of player a team should have as a go-to guy. Theo had no offense.

Overall, that was a flawed team that was put together with no vision nor any thought of how those players would work together. It was a team that was put together as a quick fix, and doing that set this franchise back a few years.

Hindsight is 20/20, but I believe things should have been done a lot differently looking back on it. When Pete Babcock decided that it was time to blow up an older team that didn't have much upside and had no ability to help itself in free agency, he should have stuck with the youth movement. Instead, he got antsy and tried to go the veteran route for the quick fix.

[Johnnybravo4]

But they were veterans who were relatively young..I think Reef was pretty much JJ's age, Ratliff about 26 and Big Dog around 28. I think that we would have still done better with a better coach. And we couldn't go with a youth movement because most of our drafts sucked. 10 years drafting of Ed Grays, and Roshawn Mcleods and Cal Bowdlers killed us.

Just for kicks I like going to Basketball reference.com and lookup past linups and drafts...it is pretty sad. But I can't blame Babcock too much...look at the stiffs who were picked behind the stiff we picked. There is usually one that will raise an eyebrow but that's about it. The draft is an effin crapshoot after pick 3.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/draft/

[AHF]

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But they were veterans who were relatively young..I think Reef was pretty much JJ's age, Ratliff about 26 and Big Dog around 28.

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In the 2002-03 season, Ratliff was 29; Glenn Robinson was 30; Shareef was 26; Terry was around JJ's age at 25. They weren't ancient (although Robinson was over the hill) but they should have pretty much been at their peak then. Their peak just wasn't good enough.

[Duff_Man]

Robinson couldn't pass or defend, Shareef only wanted to shoot 20 footers, and we started Dion Glover for gods sake. They went by stats alone and never broke down the flaws of each player. I hated that team from day 1.

[warcore]

i remember what happened!

Theo was injured almost the whole season.

People stole the ball from Robinson for fast break points cuz he would just dribble really badly instead of passing. I hated watching when the ball was in his hands.

Reef and JT were fine by me

[AHF]

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i remember what happened!

Theo was injured almost the whole season.

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Ratliff played 81 games.