Hawks exercise contracts on Josh, Josh and Marvin

[Packfill]

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Josh Childress is a 2/3. Josh Smith is a 3/4. Marvin Williams is a 3/4. Shelden Williams is a 4/5. Joe Johnson is a 1/2. Where's the log jam? The five players mentioned above will probably get 10-15 minutes a game on the court together.

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Let's look at this in more depth:

PG - Speedy (28) + Lue (12) + JJ (8) = 48

SG - JJ (30) + Salim (10) + Chill (8) = 48

SF - Marvin (25) + Smoove (10) + Chill (13) = 48

PF - Smoove (25) + Sheldon (15) + Marvin (8) = 48

C - Zaza (30) + Lo (12) + Sheldon (8) = 48

The above scenario works in theory. I say in "theory" because it is still not clear whether Josh Smith or Marvin Williams are best utilized at power forward or should be left to battle it out at their natural small forward position. Same can be true of whether Sheldon can play minutes at center. It would be great if it works, but I will reserve judgment until the team demonstrates that it can win games with such a line-up.

In the end, only actual games played will reveal whether this "theory" works or we have another "JJ is a point guard" type of problem.

[Guest Walter]

...and the true center was an 18 y/o, albeit very good, prospect yes I would trade him for Al/Childress.

Diesel, has LA ever built a team primarily through the draft? No. They can get just about any FA they want due to players wanting to play in that market with its many other endorsement and earning opportunities. Moreover, the Lakers are not a team that can afford to lose. Losing for them costs them so much more as a franchise.

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You sound like KB with your "next great thing" strawman. While I believe Bynum is a very good prospect at center and worth taking the mentioned "risk" on him due to the fact that prospect centers don't lose their value, he's no sure thing. There hardly is in this league, however. If he did pan out, FOR US, he has more value than for LA as he would be the catalyst that allows us to run a 2-Sf lineup with JS and MW. That would be invaluable.

W

[Guest Walter]

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with players like Marvin, Joe, Josh, and Josh, they have the core talent to build a championship team around.

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Too bad we can't force oother teams to play their best 4 small forwards against our best 4. We'd rule the world (uah, ha, ha, ha).

Actually, if we take this team on the 3 on 1 circuit we'd kill!

Interesting, no mention fo SW. Hmm? Wonder why. Was that a BK mistake again KB or brilliance beyond our comprehension?

W

[gsuteke]

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Walter, the world is not black or white. It is comprised of many shades of grey.

While Chillz may not be the next D Wade he certainly can be an important role player on this team.

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I don't disagree with anything you said about Chilldress and have even stated a preferance to keep him over MW (or rather the lesser of MW and JS should things change) if we can't get a true center as he can BU both the 2/3 and MW could get more in a trade. If we can get said center then I'd like to keep MW and JS and run a true center with 2, Sfs being I think they are more talented.

While I express strong opinions they are neither black or white but grey. The above itself is a very nuanced position. I don't get your take on what I say.

W

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my take is you've become an extremist Walter.

this obsession with the Center position has replaced the always predictable anti-Marvin Williams posts.

it's not going to get fixed this year. if you don't like it send a letter to Billy Knight, stop him outside his house, better yet ask his daughter out on a date.

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you are pulling a Diesel/KB with selective responses here my friend.

[Guest Walter]

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In the end, only actual games played will reveal whether this "theory" works or we have another "JJ is a point guard" type of problem.

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First playing SW at center, JJ at PG, JS at Pf (without a center and especially with SW @ center) is a disaster. Anytime you have one player out of their ideal position it's bad enough but 3? Crazy.

Second, no coach can be so focused upon equitable if not equal minutes for players without sacrificing winning games. Having our coach so focused on juggling our roster is just crazy. Poor Mike Woodson. No wonder the guy can't even remember JS. This year it only gets significantly worse for him.

Thirdly, our center position is WEAK. We have other, more pressing needs besides musical bench chairs at the 2-4.

[Guest Walter]

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you are pulling a Diesel/KB with selective responses here my friend.

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Give examples of my "selective responses". Please, I'm only one man but I haven't done whatever it is you are accusing me of. Just silly.

I have repeatedly stated that there are essentially two options for us. Fill the center position with a true, potentially dominant center if you want to start JS and MW at the forward positions or trade one of JS or MW for a similar talent at a position of need. I am 100% consistent with my opinion on these matters. My opinion on our need for a center if we are to want to start MW and JS together is absolutely not "extremist", is only one of my two consistent positions, and is historically supported.

I invite you to make a poll. Ask people if we need a center or don't, PERIOD. What do you think the outcome would be?

W

[exodus]

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SF - Marvin (25) + Smoove (10) + Chill (13) = 48

PF - Smoove (25) + Sheldon (15) + Marvin (8) = 48

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We both know that won't happen. After the way Smoove played after the All-Star break it is a safe bet that he will get more than 10 minutes per game at the 3.

And Shelden will get every opportunity to get the majority of the minutes at the 4. That is what they drafted him for.

Chill played a lot better last year but he is slower, smaller, weaker and a worse defender than MW and JS. Unless something radical happens during the season he is the odd man out.

[Guest Walter]

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Get outta town clown.

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I would most definately argue "limited sight" is confusing talent with talent used. We won't use a great portion of our young prospect talent. Wouldn't it be great if Childress were an 18 y/o 7'er playing 20 MPG this year and having a future with the team? He doesn't have one as it stands. I'd rather have a young talent that does. That is nothing personal, just professional. Talent we can use is better thna talent we won't. Simple.

W

[Guest Walter]

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SF - Marvin (25) + Smoove (10) + Chill (13) = 48

PF - Smoove (25) + Sheldon (15) + Marvin (8) = 48

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We both know that won't happen. After the way Smoove played after the All-Star break it is a safe bet that he will get more than 10 minutes per game at the 3.

And Shelden will get every opportunity to get the majority of the minutes at the 4. That is what they drafted him for.

Chill played a lot better last year but he is slower, smaller, weaker and a worse defender than MW and JS. Unless something radical happens during the season he is the odd man out.

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And simply no coach can be asked to pull off that rotation consistently AND win games. Just crazy. It'll take 3 months to settle into a rotation. I believe in definate starters generally played within there prefered position and versatile BUs able to play mutliple positions. It makes rotations far easier and determines. Childress is one of those type BUs and a very good one. I'd love to keep him. I just think we have other, more pressing needs and somebody has to go to fill them. I'm more inclined to keep Chill if we can't get our project center. Less inclined if we can.

W

[KB21]

Anything is brilliance beyond your comprehension.

[Guest Walter]

[Johnnybravo4]

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In the end, only actual games played will reveal whether this "theory" works or we have another "JJ is a point guard" type of problem.

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First playing SW at center, JJ at PG, JS at Pf (without a center and especially with SW @ center) is a disaster. Anytime you have one player out of their ideal position it's bad enough but 3? Crazy.

Second, no coach can be so focused upon equitable if not equal minutes for players without sacrificing winning games. Having our coach so focused on juggling our roster is just crazy. Poor Mike Woodson. No wonder the guy can't even remember JS. This year it only gets significantly worse for him.

Thirdly, our center position is WEAK. We have other, more pressing needs besides musical bench chairs at the 2-4.

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Seems to work for Phoenix and Detroit.

[TheDude]

i don't think past offseason was the time to pull off a "major trade." i think it was wise to bring in some pieces to fill our areas of weaknesses and then see how we do and more importantly, how our youth develops this year without Al Harrington. Then, at that point you can assess if we'll even need to bring a star in (one who would normally steal touches away from our youth this coming season) to further push our team over the hump.

[Diesel]

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nd the true center was an 18 y/o, albeit very good, prospect yes I would trade him for Al/Childress.

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Where is the honesty?? You would trade Let's say Bynum for Al/Childress? I read you plaster Chillz day in and day out as an unworthy 6th pick... I think you called him a bust.

Now, you say.. I will trade a true Center ("great") for Chillz/Al... Come on Walt, that's certainly not believable. Not from you..

Moreover, since you want to pull the Lakers in...

Yes, the Lakers have built from the draft. Technically, they drafted Kobe. A draft night trade is just as good as drafting.

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You sound like KB with your "next great thing" strawman.

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If you would be so kind to look... What I asked was a direct quote from what you wrote...

[slap]

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Josh Childress is a 2/3. Josh Smith is a 3/4. Marvin Williams is a 3/4. Shelden Williams is a 4/5. Joe Johnson is a 1/2. Where's the log jam? The five players mentioned above will probably get 10-15 minutes a game on the court together.

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Let's look at this in more depth:

PG - Speedy (28) + Lue (12) + JJ (8) = 48

SG - JJ (30) + Salim (10) + Chill (8) = 48

SF - Marvin (25) + Smoove (10) + Chill (13) = 48

PF - Smoove (25) + Sheldon (15) + Marvin (8) = 48

C - Zaza (30) + Lo (12) + Sheldon (8) = 48

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The minutes argument is what I think most defends why taking a player back in the Harrington deal wasn't needed. Far as I'm concerned, you'd like to get more minutes for Lo, Salim, Speedy, and Chill, at least. But, I don't think there are too many minutes given to any player here. Demonstrates to me that the team is ready to do battle.

[Final_quest]

What's fuzzy to me is the insistence that a fantasy trade you made up is reality.

I don't have a problem with an opinion that we need to trade either Marvin or Smoove, and that we need to get better at center. Sounds reasonable to me. You lose me with the Bynum fantasy trade was one we turned down.

I have one further question that I have wondered about. In your opinion who are all the so called 2-way dominant centers in the league? Not sure what you mean by that.

[Final_quest]

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The minutes argument is what I think most defends why taking a player back in the Harrington deal wasn't needed. Far as I'm concerned, you'd like to get more minutes for Lo, Salim, Speedy, and Chill, at least. But, I don't think there are too many minutes given to any player here. Demonstrates to me that the team is ready to do battle.

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You know, that didn't come up as much as it should have during the Al fiasco. I think the main reason is because we need quality bigs at either PF or C. Still much overlooked was that we had depth at every position already.

[Packfill]

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SF - Marvin (25) + Smoove (10) + Chill (13) = 48

PF - Smoove (25) + Sheldon (15) + Marvin (8) = 48

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We both know that won't happen. After the way Smoove played after the All-Star break it is a safe bet that he will get more than 10 minutes per game at the 3.

And Shelden will get every opportunity to get the majority of the minutes at the 4. That is what they drafted him for.

Chill played a lot better last year but he is slower, smaller, weaker and a worse defender than MW and JS. Unless something radical happens during the season he is the odd man out.

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Personally, I agree that Smoove demonstrated an ability to play the 3 and deserves to get the majority of the minutes there. That said, if the organization really is high on Marvin they have to fit him in somewhere and he seems like a natural small forward.

[exodus]

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Personally, I agree that Smoove demonstrated an ability to play the 3 and deserves to get the majority of the minutes there. That said, if the organization really is high on Marvin they have to fit him in somewhere and he seems like a natural small forward.

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Which leaves Chill SOL.

[Packfill]

Probably - though I think if both Marvin and smoove demonstrate real all-star potential at small forward one of them will be dealt and Chill can then fill the role of super-sub.