Did we tryout Sene?

[gsuteke]

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it's not about the stats Walter. it's about winning games.

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Then why did you make it about the stats. You made a big deal about whether Sene was a better shot blocker than SW. Cant' deal with it biting you in the ass then tough.

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Sheldon Williams will block more shots in the 2006-2007 NBA season than Saer Sene.

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That is utter comedy. You cry and [censored] and moan about how unrealistic it is to call Sene a better shot blocker than SW, yet you have to PAD Shellhead's stats with extra MPG because he's 23 with experience and not 20 without it on a team with 2 other center prospects.

When the MPG are even, Sene easily bests SW's production regardless of minutes in the summer league, earning the top honors with 3.75 BPG.

BTW, Boris Diaw blocked more shots per game than Dikembe Mutombo. Since we're not considering MPG or per48, who's the better shot blocker?

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most importantly

the Hawks will win more games than the Sonics.

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Christ. When did this become the discussion? I would argue that between 3-10+ years, all other things remaining the same, we would win considerably more games with Sene than with SW. More importantly, Sene's upside and potential defensive dominance would give us the potential to WIN GAMES OF IMPORTANCE, not bask in mediocrity. That's not even to mention Roy or Foye. We're a 26 win team. We're essentially playing against ourselves at this point.

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It is that simple.

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It's so simple you can't even type "SW will block more shots per minute than Sene".

I'll even make the wager easier for you, coward. Sene will block more shots than SW regardless of MPG I-F both players play within 8 MPG of each other. I'm willing to give SW a 8 MPG pad for BS because you are such a weak kneed coward you can't even stand behind your own noisemaking about SW being a better NBA shot-blocker than Sene. Can you even agree to that coward?

W

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Walter you are so close to being the first person on my ignore list.

I along with the rest of the board (take a poll if you don't believe me) are getting tired of you spamming the board with this Anti-BK crap that won't get addressed for 9 months. either move on or.... move on man. RealGM is waiting.......

[Guest Walter]

Where on earth the BK stuff came from I won't know? This is about you trying to make repeated outlandish ignorant statements about how SW was a better shot blocker than Sene and then refusing to back it up.

I even gave SW an 8 minute headstart and you won't even take it insisting on padding his stats with as many more MPG as a 23 yr old with experience can get over a 20 yr old without it on a team with 2 additional prospect centers.

Again, don't change the subject, don't run, don't cower. anyhow, I'm done with it also. You've proven you either were wrong in the first place and it would be foolhardy for you to back yourself up now or you simply don't have the courage. Next time you post pictures of white centers getting posted and Africans in the hospital to reflect Sene's center prospects, don't then tuck your tail from your own standard of shot blocking ability. Done.

W

[gsuteke]

Walter come back to this thread in 3 months and read it again.

i don't think we are understanding one another here.

i agree, let's move on to something else.

[AHF]

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Do you know the difference between a highlight reel of plays against sub-Division I level talent in a lowly regarded foreign league and meaningful scouting? If you put any number of big men against that level of competition and then selectively editted it to take his best moments you would end up with something making the guy look like a star. There weren't many blocks there that I haven't seen from Shagari against guys like Andrew Bogut who are better than anyone Shagari faced in that league.

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There were two videos. One against the top 19 yr olds and the other against summer league rosters. 9 blocks against the 19 yr olds and 3.75 to lead the summer league. And yes, it is a highlight reel but again, if you can't tell the different between big and big with potential then don't cry when I can. It's not that hard when a green prospect outshines all other shotblockers including our own SW at the RMR.

W

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Your ego is amazing.

You can't even define potential but you believe you are more qualified than NBA scouts to identify it (demonstrated when you say most big men selected in the lottery don't have potential except for the couple to whom you give your ambiguous seal of approval).

Good luck with that!

[AHF]

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It's so simple you can't even type "SW will block more shots per minute than Sene".

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That is the dumbest challenge I have ever seen. Who is going to get more BPM...the guy who plays very few minutes and gets sent in only when there are favorable matchups and mostly in garbage time and whose BPM are going to be high because that is all he is going to be asked to do this year or someone who is expected to contribute in several different areas against better competition in longer minutes?

Sene will be among the league leaders in BPM but won't be within the top 50 in total blocks so who cares? Does anyone give a flying F that Jamal Sampson averaged more BPM than Marcus Camby? Anyone care that DJ Mbenga averaged mor BPM than Dalemert, Kirilenko, Pryzbilla, etc.? Anyone?

[HawksFan87]

Sene is years away from being able to contribute on a daily basis.

[Guest Walter]

I offered that Sene would get more BPG than SW as long as they played within 8 minutes of each other. Hell, I'll make it 10. If SW plays 25 MPG and Sene plays 15, Sene will still out-block SW.

I realize the per minute standard requires at least a moderate amount of PT in enough games to provide a statistically significant sample. I've addressed that. It's clearly better than saying Diaw is a better shotblocker than Dikembe Mutombo because he blocked more shots than Dikembe did this year. The MPG differntial was FAR too great. MPG does matter and you can't compare without a minimum statistically significant sample (not Jamal Sampsons rare, infrequent, short PT) and an equal playing field (BPM).

I'm willing to give SW almost double the MPG Sene will likely get believing Sene is that much better of a shot blocker, shot intimidator. I don't see anybody taking me up or offering a reasonable alternative. Just bitching how everything's unfair. There is nothing more "fair" than an 8-10 MPG headstart.

W

[AHF]

That is fair enough but I seriously doubt Sene gets within 10 mpg of Shelden's average. He didn't get many minutes in the god foresaken league he just came from.

[Guest Walter]

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That is fair enough but I seriously doubt Sene gets within 10 mpg of Shelden's average. He didn't get many minutes in the god foresaken league he just came from.

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...but he's already gone from developmental league to roster with his summerleague play. His number of blocks and shot alterations are game changing. Hard to keep that off the court for any team, especially a team like Seattle even with the many prospects. We'll see, although in 3 years I see him being mini-Deke for Seattle.

W

[Popeye]

Why didn't you put this thread in "around the league".

I don't think Sene plays for us.

[newkid]

Hey guys. I'm new to this blog, so please take it easy on me, alright. Back on April 10th I saw Sene play with a team of international players against our best high school players. Yeah, they were all just high school kids (without Greg Oden), but many of them would've likely been in the '06 draft under pre-2006 draft rules. I've watched a fair bit of college and NBA basketball over the years, and it was pretty immediately clear to me that this 'unknown' kid with only a few years of experience playing b-ball was potentially very special. In some ways as I watched the game it reminded me of the reaction I had when I sat in Carmichael Auditorium to watch Michael Jordan and some of the other incoming Carolina freshman in the 81/82 class play in an intra-squad game against Worthy, Perkins and others. You could tell from the very outset that while raw, this guy has some really special natural gifts. Surely Sene won't ever get remotely close to MJ's stature, but don't write him off as just another 7-foot project.

Here's a link that summarizes the performances of those who played with and against Sene in the Nike Hoop Summit game on April 10th.

http://www.draftexpress.com/viewarticle.php?a=1260

[gsuteke]

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I offered that Sene would get more BPG than SW as long as they played within 8 minutes of each other. Hell, I'll make it 10. If SW plays 25 MPG and Sene plays 15, Sene will still out-block SW.

I realize the per minute standard requires at least a moderate amount of PT in enough games to provide a statistically significant sample. I've addressed that. It's clearly better than saying Diaw is a better shotblocker than Dikembe Mutombo because he blocked more shots than Dikembe did this year. The MPG differntial was FAR too great. MPG does matter and you can't compare without a minimum statistically significant sample (not Jamal Sampsons rare, infrequent, short PT) and an equal playing field (BPM).

I'm willing to give SW almost double the MPG Sene will likely get believing Sene is that much better of a shot blocker, shot intimidator. I don't see anybody taking me up or offering a reasonable alternative. Just bitching how everything's unfair. There is nothing more "fair" than an 8-10 MPG headstart.

W

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S H U T U P ! !

[TheNorthCydeRises]

LOL @ this thread. Straight comedy.

I guess when Sene gets his 2.5 blocks per 48 minute ratio, but only seeing 8 minutes a game in garbage time, that Walter will declare himself the "winner".

I'll make a bet with you Walter.

I bet that Solomon Jones, who was a very good shot blocker in the Big East, will have more blocks per minute/per 48 minutes, etc, than Sene.

Walter reminds me of one of my old girlfriends . . who likes to argue about points that she knows that she's dead wrong on, just for the sake of arguing.

[Guest Walter]

...didn't even try the kid out.

Frustrating when many of the forum want to defend or protect a guy whose job is to make the best personel decision for the team and he doesn't even do his homework. Roy, Foye, and Sene will all bit us in the ass but it's BK who caused it with lazy scouting and terrible GMing.

W

[CBAreject]

There are plenty of folks on here whom you might liken arguing with to banging your head against the wall, but I don't think Walter is one of them. As much as he's taking an extreme and premature position the SW drafting, he makes a consistent, logical, and sensical case. Walter sticks to his position, and he doesn't change it. He responds to the points you make, albeit usually to contradict them.

Diesel, on the other hand doesn't understand critical reasoning or the rules of arguments. He would change his position during the argument, distort some peripheral point in your rebuttal to rail against, setting up a strawman, or resort to claiming you worship him. In many cases, he would make absolutely no sense in the first place, such as any argument involving anything quantitative, but he would refuse to change his position, even when it could be shown by very many that he's objectively and undeniably wrong.

I would keep the picture but change the name. There are much more frustrating saps to argue with than Walter on this forum.

[CBAreject]

As much as I think Sene is raw and would've been a risky pick, I think it's ludicrous to believe he will only average 2.5 blocks per 48. He might shoot 40% from the field, and he might not rebound like Deke, but I would be astonished if he doesn't generate blocks at an extremely high rate. It's what he does.

[Diesel]

Damn dude...

I must have wounded you for LIFE...

A thread in which I have taken no part in and you post to the thread about Me.

IF I never had my own person [censored] before... I know I got one, and here name is CBAREJECT...

I used to feel good about exerting so much control over a persons' life... It made me feel powerful... However, you have become some type of evil sycophant.

Maybe Hawksquawk needs a personal Psychotherapist or Psychologist that can book a few hours a week to chat with you... So you can get over your Diesel Envy!

[Guest Walter]

I know my consistent, definative, sometimes out of the mainstream positions challenge people, but they aren't that different than most fans.

Perhaps if I were more a homer fan...

As far as Sene, how on earth people could choose to attack his potentially game changing shot-blocking ability is beyond me. That's like saying, "that Heidi Klum can't fill out a bathing suit". The guy is perhaps the purest shot-blocker to come into the league in 10 years. We'll see but I can't see this guy "failing" because he doesn't block enough shots.

W

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There are plenty of folks on here whom you might liken arguing with to banging your head against the wall, but I don't think Walter is one of them. As much as he's taking an extreme and premature position the SW drafting, he makes a consistent, logical, and sensical case. Walter sticks to his position, and he doesn't change it. He responds to the points you make, albeit usually to contradict them.

Diesel, on the other hand doesn't understand critical reasoning or the rules of arguments. He would change his position during the argument, distort some peripheral point in your rebuttal to rail against, setting up a strawman, or resort to claiming you worship him. In many cases, he would make absolutely no sense in the first place, such as any argument involving anything quantitative, but he would refuse to change his position, even when it could be shown by very many that he's objectively and undeniably wrong.

I would keep the picture but change the name. There are much more frustrating saps to argue with than Walter on this forum.

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[DJlaysitup]

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...As far as Sene, how on earth people could choose to attack his potentially game changing shot-blocking ability is beyond me. That's like saying, "that Heidi Klum can't fill out a bathing suit". The guy is perhaps the purest shot-blocker to come into the league in 10 years. We'll see but I can't see this guy "failing" because he doesn't block enough shots...

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Sene will be a real interresting guy to keep tabs on as the season progresses. His stock rose bigtime as the draft approached. I believe I remember that when his name first surfaced pre-draft, most folks were looking at him as a candidate for the NBDL. It's pretty obvious that that isn't the case now. I believe I read on a Sonics board that he had a pretty good summer league and they are expecting him to get meaningful minutes in his first year.

Should be a good side-story to follow once the season gets underway. Looks like he's stacked up behind two other centers...Sonics have a problem with positional redundancy :-) ...but that may be an advantage for him in that he can learn and do his thing without being under the gun too much.

[AHF]

I think people can justifiably be skeptical of someone like Sene who is incredibly raw and played in a league with a low level of competition and didn't do much in the same way someone could be skeptical of the next Darko or Skita. Both of them had scouts drooling with their potential as well. However, when you haven't proven it on the court in real games the concern about a potential bust is higher. (Before anyone mentions success in the summer league look at Skita's history there).

I do expect Sene to be a great BPM guy regardless, though.