Bonzi Wells

phx_suns · September 12, 2006

I for one would be extremely pissed if you guys signed Wells, as that all but assures us that we don't get the number 4 or 5 pick next year. Things are great as it is, and I hope Knight doesn't frell it all up. Leave the damn team alone. Marvin and 'Chiltz' are all the 3s that your team needs. I.E. they suck. Wells had delusions of grandeur this offseason and it costed him. I sure hope it doesn't cost us.

Plainview1981 · September 12, 2006

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I for one would be extremely pissed if you guys signed Wells, as that all but assures us that we don't get the number 4 or 5 pick next year. Things are great as it is, and I hope Knight doesn't frell it all up. Leave the damn team alone. Marvin and 'Chiltz' are all the 3s that your team needs. I.E. they suck. Wells had delusions of grandeur this offseason and it costed him. I sure hope it doesn't cost us.

It's funny that you show up in a thread that talks about Webber and his decline (and injuries) and a bloated contact when that's the situation PHX will soon have with Amare and Nash.

One will be old and broken soon and the other will be a shadow of what he was before his injury. Enjoy your short reign.

gsuteke · September 12, 2006

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I for one would be extremely pissed if you guys signed Wells, as that all but assures us that we don't get the number 4 or 5 pick next year. Things are great as it is, and I hope Knight doesn't frell it all up. Leave the damn team alone. Marvin and 'Chiltz' are all the 3s that your team needs. I.E. they suck. Wells had delusions of grandeur this offseason and it costed him. I sure hope it doesn't cost us.

this guy is like the peeps on the Carolina Panther board i was posting on last week.

he has no clue.

CBAreject · September 12, 2006

Well, his perception is not that different from that of the masses. Honestly, if you consider the Hawks something like a 24-win team after the "loss" of Harrington, you probably expect them to pick 4th or 5th. Most 24-win teams have some gaping holes with some absolute scrubs starting. In that case, a guy like Bonzi can add 6 wins or so. I mean, that guy just said that MW/Chillz suck. I'm not saying they're great (yet), but Chillz was the most efficient scorer in the league last year. Granted, he can't create much, and that is the difference with Bonzi. Seriously, though, I would rather have Chillz starting at SF for me that Bonzi Wells. He'd play higher energy on a regular basis and get more rebounds. I wonder what he would've said about Boris Diaw a year ago. "What a scrub! He plays for the Hawks."

Johnnybravo4 · September 12, 2006

I love the whole, "don't want to ruin the development argument". You are basically saying that we should refuse to pick up inexpensive, competent, veteran players because they may prevent Chills, Marvin, and Smoove from developing into the All stars that they could be.

It is funny because winning teams don't think that way...only losers do. Anytime you can upgrade the talent on the team, especially on a young team..you do it.

Do you think that Miami said, "Well I don't know about siging Toine' because that may slow the development of Wayne Simien or Udonis Haslem?"

Or do you think that Phoenix said to themselves, If we bring that Diaw guy in, he could take time away from Amare...maybe we should waive him instead.

I don't give a rat's azz if Marvin, Smoove and Childress lose 5 minutes each to give time to Bonzi Wells. Ultimately our team is better served by having his talent and veteran presence on the team.

And wouldn't signing him on a one year deal make him a contract player again?

Packfill · September 12, 2006

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The Hawks future depends on Smoove and Marvin. Those are the two guys that have the potential to be big time players. JJ already is a star in my book but he needs help.

If those two don't become major contributors then the Hawks are screwed no matter what they do. There is no point in bringing in a rental that will take away from their development.

Agreed.

Signing Bonzi would be a big mistake for this franchise.

CBAreject · September 12, 2006

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Do you think that Miami said, "Well I don't know about siging Toine' because that may slow the development of Wayne Simien or Udonis Haslem?"

1) Wayne Simien was a fringe-1st round selection. Haslem was a Hawks cast-off. Neither player is considered a potential All-Star or figures to be a cornerstone for the Heat.

2) Antoine Walker played SF for the Heat, not PF, so even if the players you mentioned were young studs, he wouldn't take their minutes. There was no redundancy at the SF position.

3) The question was whether Walker would be an upgrade on a declining Eddie Jones.

4) Miami's time is NOW. They were driving for a championship this year. Bringing in Walker to be the third option on offense made sense, especially when they thought Eddie Jones was done. The Heat would've probably made the Finals without Walker, but he may have swung a close game in the Finals toward the Heat.

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Or do you think that Phoenix said to themselves, If we bring that Diaw guy in, he could take time away from Amare...maybe we should waive him instead.

This is hardly the same. Diaw is a young, cheap, versatile, UNSELFISH player who is just good to have on the bench, even if it's just to trade him later. He was not expected to start at the 4 or 5. What you should ask yourself is whether Phx would have brought in Chris Webber to start at the 4.

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I don't give a rat's azz if Marvin, Smoove and Childress lose 5 minutes each to give time to Bonzi Wells.

Ha. If you are going to take only 5 mpg from them, you will give Bonzi 15 mpg. Think Bonzi will have a good attitude about playing 15 mpg in a contract year? HA! If he takes a 1 year deal, he wants 35 mpg so he can play himself into a contract.

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Ultimately our team is better served by having his talent and veteran presence on the team.

It's like you're talking about Charles Oakley or Grant Long type players. In those cases, I'd be inclined to agree. I'll give you that Bonzi is talented, but he has never been a leader.

CBAreject · September 12, 2006

From a GQ article, "The Ten Most Hated Athletes"

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Words like fumigate come up when people try to explain why GMs trade him. “It doesn’t bother him if his unhappiness infects the entire team,” says Memphis sportswriter Geoff Calkins, who recalls that when Grizzlies coach Hubie Brown was contemplating retirement (citing health reasons), “part of the calculus for Hubie was ‘It’s not worth it,’ and a big part of that was Bonzi. He helped bring Hubie down.”

When Brown’s successor, Mike Fratello, pulled Wells from a game at the end of last season, Bonzi threw a tantrum involving, characteristically, both profanity and projectiles. “This was in the final weeks of the season,” says Ron Higgins, another Memphis sportswriter, “when the Grizzlies were desperately trying to make the playoffs. Other players looked at him like, What the hell are you doing?”

Recalls sportswriter Jason Quick, who covered Bonzi in Portland: “He would flip off a fan and the next day say, ‘I blacked out.’ He’s such a con man. When the TV lights went on, he’d put on that million-dollar smile, then be an ass when they left.” He spat, infamously, on Danny Ferry. He bitched constantly at his coaches. He was fined for bad-mouthing his own fans in Sports Illustrated. He made a veiled threat after a reporter wrote a negative story about him. “He told me, ‘Don’t be surprised one day if you show up to practice with a steak over your eye,’ ” Quick remembers. “And I said, ‘If you want to do that, I’ll be a rich man.’ He said, ‘I’m not dumb enough to do it myself. I’ll have my posse do it.’ ”

Yup. I wonder why nobody wants to sign him. I, for one, got quite enough of Bonzi the first time, when he went by "Isaiah Rider".

Johnnybravo4 · September 12, 2006

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From a GQ article, "The Ten Most Hated Athletes"

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Words like fumigate come up when people try to explain why GMs trade him. “It doesn’t bother him if his unhappiness infects the entire team,” says Memphis sportswriter Geoff Calkins, who recalls that when Grizzlies coach Hubie Brown was contemplating retirement (citing health reasons), “part of the calculus for Hubie was ‘It’s not worth it,’ and a big part of that was Bonzi. He helped bring Hubie down.”

When Brown’s successor, Mike Fratello, pulled Wells from a game at the end of last season, Bonzi threw a tantrum involving, characteristically, both profanity and projectiles. “This was in the final weeks of the season,” says Ron Higgins, another Memphis sportswriter, “when the Grizzlies were desperately trying to make the playoffs. Other players looked at him like, What the hell are you doing?”

Recalls sportswriter Jason Quick, who covered Bonzi in Portland: “He would flip off a fan and the next day say, ‘I blacked out.’ He’s such a con man. When the TV lights went on, he’d put on that million-dollar smile, then be an ass when they left.” He spat, infamously, on Danny Ferry. He bitched constantly at his coaches. He was fined for bad-mouthing his own fans in Sports Illustrated. He made a veiled threat after a reporter wrote a negative story about him. “He told me, ‘Don’t be surprised one day if you show up to practice with a steak over your eye,’ ” Quick remembers. “And I said, ‘If you want to do that, I’ll be a rich man.’ He said, ‘I’m not dumb enough to do it myself. I’ll have my posse do it.’ ”

Yup. I wonder why nobody wants to sign him. I, for one, got quite enough of Bonzi the first time, when he went by "Isaiah Rider".

Like I said earlier, Sac-town had no problems with that malcontent Ron Artest.

Lascar78 · September 12, 2006

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Like I said earlier, Sac-town had no problems with that malcontent Ron Artest.

Players like Ron Artest, Terell Owens, etc... typically don't cause problems their first year when they're on their best behavior. They cause problems a couple of years down the road when they start bashing their teammates, organizations, and acting erratically on the court. Besides, Artest almost didn't report, so that transition wasn't exactly smooth.

There are 2 things we absolutely don't need at this point: small forwards, and guys with big attitude problems that could blow up with losing. Bonzi is both. No thanks.

I don't understand why any hawks fan would want to bring a player that would chop the minutes for Marvin/Smith/Chill when that is already an issue. This is the year that both Marvin and Smith need to step up, why would you want to lessen their chances? It's swim or sink time.

CBAreject · September 12, 2006

What's your point? Before you respond without thinking, consider what's below.

Your quip about Artest is a typical response from the type of person who doesn't understand risk.

If I tell that type of person that dangerous activity 'A' is associated with negative outcome 'B', he will respond by saying "I know of a person who did 'A' and 'B' didn't happen to him."

That person doesn't understand my position. It's not that 'B' always happens when you do 'A'. Rather, there's a significant chance of 'B' with 'A', so you might want to consider it.

A common example is the smoker who says "My friend's granny smoked 'til she was 90, and she never got lung cancer." Again, not every person who smokes heavily gets lung cancer or has a heart attack/stroke/etc. However, the chances of one of those is very significant for a smoker.

"Risk" mean taking a chance against an adverse outcome. When I give you an example of a case where bringing an attitude problem into a young team was an absolute disaster, I am illustrating that risk. Giving me a counter-example does not negate that risk, so your position is worthless. Note that an example is effective in arguing that something is risky, but a single is example is a poor argument against it.

By the way, you could argue that the risk is exceedingly small by giving me many, many contrary examples, but you haven't done that, and I doubt you could.

Johnnybravo4 · September 12, 2006

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What's your point? Before you respond without thinking, consider what's below.

Your quip about Artest is a typical response from the type of person who doesn't understand risk.

If I tell that type of person that dangerous activity 'A' is associated with negative outcome 'B', he will respond by saying "I know of a person who did 'A' and 'B' didn't happen to him."

That person doesn't understand my position. It's not that 'B' always happens when you do 'A'. Rather, there's a significant chance of 'B' with 'A', so you might want to consider it.

A common example is the smoker who says "My friend's granny smoked 'til she was 90, and she never got lung cancer." Again, not every person who smokes heavily gets lung cancer or has a heart attack/stroke/etc. However, the chances of one of those is very significant for a smoker.

"Risk" mean taking a chance against an adverse outcome. When I give you an example of a case where bringing an attitude problem into a young team was an absolute disaster, I am illustrating that risk. Giving me a counter-example does not negate that risk, so your position is worthless. Note that an example is effective in arguing that something is risky, but a single is example is a poor argument against it.

By the way, you could argue that the risk is exceedingly small by giving me many, many contrary examples, but you haven't done that, and I doubt you could.

Sir our society is based upon risk. Capitalism is based upon risk. Just because Bob's Pizza joint failed at a given location doesn't necessarily mean that Bill's pizza joint will fail at the same location. Cowards like you will always be average because you are afraid to stick your neck out and take risk. All I have heard from some of you so called fan is.."We can't do X because this might happen" Or, "We don't want to stunt the growth of the young guys". Why don't we just waive all of the backups and just run a team of Speedy, JJ, Marvin, Smoove and Childress. I mean everyone takes potential time from our young folk.

Don't be afraid to take risks people, it is often what separates the extraordinary from the ordinary.

mrhonline · September 12, 2006

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Don't be afraid to take risks people, it is often what separates the extraordinary from the ordinary.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

AHF · September 12, 2006