Sekou: Feeling better about Shelden

[DrReality]

Feeling better about Shelden

By Sekou Smith | Monday, October 9, 2006, 03:50 PM

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

After further review, that trepidation we all had about Shelden Williams contributing big things as a rookie might have been misguided. I’ll admit to my part, especially after watching him struggle a bit during summer league.

But Hawks coach Mike Woodson said something to me then that didn’t totally make sense until I watched the Hawks scrimmage Saturday morning at Woodward Academy. Woodson said “Shelden will show up better when he’s out there with better competition.”

Now I don’t think he was cracking the guys who were on all those summer league teams in Utah. I think he was speaking more about the fact that a guy who is as well versed in the nuances of the game and his position the way Williams appears to be, simply looks better when there are lots of good players sharing the same space.

Williams bumps defenders on screens, knows how and when to rotate on defense, and isn’t afraid to get his hands dirty, no matter who he’s battling for the ball or low post position. With so little structure in summer league competition, it was hard to see all those subtle things he does well. But with a week of training camp in the books, it’s easy to see why the coaching staff has been so much more positive than the rest of us about what Williams might be able to contribute.

Initially, it was his size that had me concerned. Williams wasn’t 6-10 and 250 pounds, which, for some unknown reason, I thought were his dimensions. He’s about the same height as Marvin Williams and Josh Smith. And only a few pounds heavier than either of those guys. But he plays a lot bigger than his listed size. Much like one of those “undersized” running backs, Shelden Williams is the one guy who doesn’t seem overly concerned with size, or lack thereof.

It will be interesting to see what toll a bruising NBA season will take on him - and please believe that the length of the season will get him at some point, it gets everyone eventually. Still, I’ll have to admit to being pleasantly surprised at what I’ve seen from Williams thus far. Those early reviews of him were probably a bit harsh and premature.

And for those of you who love to read a headline here and assume that’s what I said about something, I didn’t make any Rookie of the Year predictions. I’m simply saying that many people have made hasty decisions about what type of player we thought Williams was and that was probably something we shouldn’t have done.

[Nicholasp27]

so sekou, who has watched shelden, says that shell plays "a lot bigger than his size"

but walter says shelden plays smaller than his size...

who to believe? who to believe?

[CBAreject]

I'm glad he has a positive take. When I first read that he "will show up better against better competition", I thought it was ridiculous. Then, I saw what he meant about "the little things". I guess those things don't show up in summer league street ball.

Little things are great, and this team needs those, but I hope he'll do some big things, too. We need some of that.

[unknownjdb]

Quote:

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so sekou, who has watched shelden, says that shell plays "a lot bigger than his size"

but walter says shelden plays smaller than his size...

who to believe? who to believe?

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LOL. classic...

[TheNorthCydeRises]

LOL

Walter will come around, when Shelden is doing those little things to help us win games.

Then again, maybe he won't. Because that will mean that he was wrong all along. Can/will he admit that he was wrong?

[vdunkndunk]

I watched two summer league games on tape and I was at the open practice on Saturday, and Shelden is one of the guys I tried to focus on.

I agree with Sekou and the coaches that the summer league environment wasn't really one were Shelden could shine (I actually thought that before the summer league games even started), but with that being said it was still troubling to watch him struggle to get rebounds that I thought he should have had and to basically just look a little lost out there.

I do think he looked better and more comfortable at the open practice, and he did some nice things, even showing a nice turn around jump shot from the base line. The only thing that bothered me was that he still seemed to struggle getting his shot off around the basket. I think he could afford to drop about 20 lbs and go with a sleeker, more athletic body.

I hope he comes out and proves me wrong, but I foresee him struggling at the beginning of the season. But I'm hoping he can come out and at least bring some defensive leadership, toughness, a mid-range baseline jumper, and some shotblocking and rebounding right from the beginning.

[Guest Walter]

Quote:

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so sekou, who has watched shelden, says that shell plays "a lot bigger than his size"

but walter says shelden plays smaller than his size...

who to believe? who to believe?

---

BTW, I the stat guy that used the formula comparing average individual ratios to basketball players to determine their True Height Index, who made Shelden Williams a primary exampel of playing shorter than his listed height, AND who indicated his tall forhead was "wasted height" was even more impartial than any Hawks' reporter could be. Moreover, the statistical staff at realgm highlight the quality of his statistical work and link it. Lastly, all Sekou is saying is that SW may be a role player rather than a bust. With the 5th pick you don't want AT BEST Grant Long.

W

[Guest Walter]

Shelden Williams is a 4 year senior. Supposedly the most NBA ready player in the draft. And he's being asked to rebound and be physical. How hard is it for a player to do those things well off the bat in any circumstance? There aren't plays run for rebounding. You just have to want it more, get position, and be taller/longer/jump better.

We have so lowered our 5th overall pick standards we find it a good thing a 4 year college player only does the "little things". We promised ourselves out of draft day trades for this?!? Come on people. You're getting snowed. He's a 5th pick for christ's sake. Quit oohing and ahhing over "little things" when that's his role player ceiling.

W

[gsuteke]

Quote:

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Quote:

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so sekou, who has watched shelden, says that shell plays "a lot bigger than his size"

but walter says shelden plays smaller than his size...

who to believe? who to believe?

---

BTW, I the stat guy that used the formula comparing average individual ratios to basketball players to determine their True Height Index, who made Shelden Williams a primary exampel of playing shorter than his listed height, AND who indicated his tall forhead was "wasted height" was even more impartial than any Hawks' reporter could be. Moreover, the statistical staff at realgm highlight the quality of his statistical work and link it. Lastly, all Sekou is saying is that SW may be a role player rather than a bust. With the 5th pick you don't want AT BEST Grant Long.

W

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BTW, I the stat guy that used the formula comparing average individual ratios to idiotic posts and Walter came away the winner in a landslide.

[vdunkndunk]

I agree that you don't want a role player with the number 5 pick. But if he's a good enough role player he can make a big difference for this team, especially because I'm hoping we'll soon have enough star power with the players we already have.

If Joe, Marvin and Smoove can be all-stars or borderline all-stars in the near future...

...and Chill, Shelden, Zaza, Speedy, Lue and Salim can play their roles well...

...then we should be OK right now and in the future.

Here's the way I see the next 2 or 3 years for the Hawks:

Speedy and Lue, I think, are here to guide this young team and provide veteran leadership from the PG position while the young guys get their feet under them, but we'll need to find a longterm solution at PG within the next two or three years. Look for BK to keep searching for that long, athletic PG he covets.

And Zaza is definitely a keeper at C (give BK credit for locking this guy up for 4 years at a bargain price), but Lo Wright is basically another stopgap to help get these young guys over the hump, so in the next couple years we'll have to either luck into a great starting C and make Zaza one of the better backup C's in the NBA, or more likely we'll need to find a longterm backup for Zaza.

Either way, I think Joe, Marvin and Smoove make great foundational pieces, and Chill and Zaza have proven they can be great surrounding pieces. Hopefully Shelden will prove he's good enough to be a longterm piece of the puzzle as well. If we can keep these guys together for a couple more years and slowly add those last permanent pieces to the puzzle, that's when we can start arguing about how far we're going in the playoffs instead of whether we'll make it at all.

[Johnnybravo4]

Quote:

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I agree that you don't want a role player with the number 5 pick. But if he's a good enough role player he can make a big difference for this team, especially because I'm hoping we'll soon have enough star power with the players we already have.

If Joe, Marvin and Smoove can be all-stars or borderline all-stars in the near future...

...and Chill, Shelden, Zaza, Speedy, Lue and Salim can play their roles well...

...then we should be OK right now and in the future.

Here's the way I see the next 2 or 3 years for the Hawks:

Speedy and Lue, I think, are here to guide this young team and provide veteran leadership from the PG position while the young guys get their feet under them, but we'll need to find a longterm solution at PG within the next two or three years. Look for BK to keep searching for that long, athletic PG he covets.

And Zaza is definitely a keeper at C (give BK credit for locking this guy up for 4 years at a bargain price), but Lo Wright is basically another stopgap to help get these young guys over the hump, so in the next couple years we'll have to either luck into a great starting C and make Zaza one of the better backup C's in the NBA, or more likely we'll need to find a longterm backup for Zaza.

Either way, I think Joe, Marvin and Smoove make great foundational pieces, and Chill and Zaza have proven they can be great surrounding pieces. Hopefully Shelden will prove he's good enough to be a longterm piece of the puzzle as well. If we can keep these guys together for a couple more years and slowly add those last permanent pieces to the puzzle, that's when we can start arguing about how far we're going in the playoffs instead of whether we'll make it at all.

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The thing is that after the first four picks, pretty much the rest of the draft was full of role players. Roy and Foye are role players, O'bryant and Sene were role players. Rondo is a role player. Only time will tell who turns out what and when but there was really no definitive star in this draft, so I don't see why people like Walter fail to see that.

[Diesel]

How about getting a Dennis Rodman (less the attitude) with the 5th pick? Or what about getting a Dave Cowens.

Walt, it seems to me that YOU only want a high flyer at #5. You must not understand the game that well. Yes, High flyers are good and yes, big time scorers are good... but what really wins games are guys who can play defense and rebound. What you have called "role Players"...

We needed a PF going into the draft. We got the best PF that the draft could yield.

He was All American.

He was 2nd runner up to the Wooden Award.

He was the MVP of the College University Games.

He was the Team USA Male Basketball Player of the year.

He is the third player in ACC history to have 1,500 points, 1,000 rebounds and 350 blocks (joining Tim Duncan and Ralph Sampson). His 1,217 rebounds and 1,859 career points rank him seventh in ACC history and sixteenth in Duke history, respectively.

Surely, you can't challenge his accomplishments because he was the most accomplished player in the draft.

He has yet to play one game and you have already started your pessimism.. WHY?

Do you hate Duke? Be honest Walt... Is this all about the WCU pride?

[Johnnybravo4]

Quote:

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How about getting a Dennis Rodman (less the attitude) with the 5th pick? Or what about getting a Dave Cowens.

Walt, it seems to me that YOU only want a high flyer at #5. You must not understand the game that well. Yes, High flyers are good and yes, big time scorers are good... but what really wins games are guys who can play defense and rebound. What you have called "role Players"...

We needed a PF going into the draft. We got the best PF that the draft could yield.

He was All American.

He was 2nd runner up to the Wooden Award.

He was the MVP of the College University Games.

He was the Team USA Male Basketball Player of the year.

He is the third player in ACC history to have 1,500 points, 1,000 rebounds and 350 blocks (joining Tim Duncan and Ralph Sampson). His 1,217 rebounds and 1,859 career points rank him seventh in ACC history and sixteenth in Duke history, respectively.

Surely, you can't challenge his accomplishments because he was the most accomplished player in the draft.

He has yet to play one game and you have already started your pessimism.. WHY?

Do you hate Duke? Be honest Walt... Is this all about the WCU pride?

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I think that he'd rather have the guy that started playing basketball 2 weeks ago. Who is probably a better soccer prospect.

[jerrywest]

I'd say if SW plays as good as Charles Oakley, which he is perfectly capable of playing (and more), I won't have any complain.

[Gray Mule]

Getting the job done - That's what IT'S all about.

Forget where he was drafted - 4th or 41st doesn't matter.

Forget how tall or short he really is. Doesn't matter.

Getting the job done matters.

Can he rebound? Can he play defense? Can he fill the

lane and quieten those lay-up drills that other teams

run on the Hawks??

Does he have hands of stone? Or, perhaps, can he handle

the ball so that his rebounds stay the property of the

Hawks - IE, he doesn't just grab the rebound then create

a turnover because he can't handle the ball?

Role player? Aren't they all role players? What else

is there? A star? Still, that's a role. A certain

position player - That's a role.

Big or little? Short or tall? Skinny or fat?

Doesn't really matter. Can he do the job? Now, that

matters!!

He did the job while he was in school. For four years

he did the job. He apparently did it well.

So, he looks a little lost in the NBA. Hasn't played

one game in the NBA. Not a regular season game. Not

even an exibition game. Scouts, coaches and all the

NBA people said before the draft he could do the job.

He was the most NBA ready player in the draft.

Could it be that all those people AND all the fans who

watched his career in school AND all the Hawks fans

who thought he was a good pick - Just what we needed -

could it be that we're all wrong?

[DJlaysitup]

I pretty much agree. Everybody's a role player to some degree. Shelden should be fine. a tough guy for a tough job. Besides, the Hawks fortunes this year aren't going to rise and fall on Shelden's shoulders all that much anyway. It's going to be more up to the rest of the guys. Shelden will earn his living and hopefully our core will have improved enough to get off to a decent start this season and avoid getting behind the old 8-ball.

[Guest Walter]

Quote:

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BTW, I the stat guy that used the formula comparing average individual ratios to idiotic posts and Walter came away the winner in a landslide.

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I've made every defensive challenge imaginable, given SW every advantage possible. Where is your spine?

W

[TexasPete]

Teke's just arrogant...he doesn't want to intelligently debate, just to put down. I wouldn't lose any sleep over his insulting methodology. Condescending doesn't work for anybody on this board. He hasn't figured that out yet. He somehow thinks he is smarter or more knowledgeable than you. It's his world and were all just breathing in it.

[Guest Walter]

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Teke's just arrogant...he doesn't want to intelligently debate, just to put down. I wouldn't lose any sleep over his insulting methodology. Condescending doesn't work for anybody on this board. He hasn't figured that out yet. He somehow thinks he is smarter or more knowledgeable than you. It's his world and were all just breathing in it.

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...and honestly, I don't understand why someone who felt so strongly, first that SW was the better shotblocker (without backing it up despite 10 MPG concessions), then the better interior defender (without backing it up...) than Sene, wouldn't want the opportunity to prove it. If only because he dislikes me so much it would seem he would take the opportunity given he is so certain of his claims of SW's superiority. Why would gsuteke not take the opportunity to be proven right and prove me wrong unless he doesn't believe himself and/or is more afraid he will beproven wrong?

W

[BusBoyIsBack]

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Shelden Williams is a 4 year senior. Supposedly the most NBA ready player in the draft. And he's being asked to rebound and be physical. How hard is it for a player to do those things well off the bat in any circumstance? There aren't plays run for rebounding. You just have to want it more, get position, and be taller/longer/jump better.

We have so lowered our 5th overall pick standards we find it a good thing a 4 year college player only does the "little things". We promised ourselves out of draft day trades for this?!? Come on people. You're getting snowed. He's a 5th pick for christ's sake. Quit oohing and ahhing over "little things" when that's his role player ceiling.

W

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Who the hell cares where he was drafted? You are putting too much emphasis on the draft and too little on the reason he was drafted. We had the worst interior D in the NBA. He was the most sure thing interior player in the draft.

We could not ignore our interior D problem any longer and allow layup drills every night.

Shelden was the best step in the right direction to fix that interior D problem with his tenacity on D and contagious energy that he brings to the defensive side of the ball, something our head coach specializes in.

I know you probably think we should have drafted one of those guards because it would have been the sexy pick. Well you don't get a rookie PG to lead the youngest team in NBA history. We got our guard in FA and got our big man in the draft.

Now how about you let him play 1 game in the NBA before you declare him the greatest bust of all time.