I want to stay positive about Salim but

[Peoriabird]

He sucks and doesn't deserve much playing time this year if he can't hit jump shots. The guy is a turn-over machine and can't seem to find his way. Once Speedy comes back, there will be no minutes for him anyway. He was the lone negative in the first game and just flat out stunk up the joint in this one. Sorry Salim but I hope not to see you during the regular season.

[DJlaysitup]

Yep PB - I think it's becoming obvious.

[DJlaysitup]

OK - so I know it's bad form to post off your own post but the reality is - we have Speedy (once his non-shooting hand heals up), TLue, and Royale as a desperation 1/2. That's all we need. This team will live or die by JJ and the four horsemen. The 4 horsemen being JChillz, JS, Marvin, and Shell. They can all play multiple positions - but they aren't 1 to 5 guys like Magic Johnson. JChill can play 2 or 3. Marvin and JS can play 3 or 4. Shell can play 4 or 5.

These players are the core of our team (IMHO)...that's not to take anything away from the specialists (ZZ and Lo and Este and the Greek)...but these are the guys who will shoulder most of the load at the 2-ish, 3, 4 spots. Obviously JJ is the leader and ZZ and Lo are keys - but these four JC/MW/JS/SW are very key as far as competing in all games.

We need about 10 good players (with our youth) - and 2 bench sitters that can come in and be effective. My opinion is: (and in no particular order)

PG: Speedy - TLue

SG: JJ - JChillz

SF: Marvin - JS - JChillz

PF: JS - Shelden - MW

Center: Zaza - Lo - Shelden

bench depth should lean towards bigs - Este and Greek...Ivey (note: Ivey can backup PG and SG - mostly defensively).

Many would say I'm nuts keeping Ivey over Salim - but I don't think so.

[HawksFan87]

You're not nuts too bad Chalmers got hurt because he was pretty impressive and anybody is better than Salim at this point.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

(( shaking my head at the board ))

Salim was one of our best 3 point shooters from last year. Now, people are ready to toss him aside because he shot bad in 2 preseason games?

Pure comedy.

Thank God Shelden got 12 points and 9 rebounds in that Memphis game.

If he'd scored 6 points, pulled down 5 rebounds, and had 5 fouls, like he did tonight, people would be calling Shelden a bust.

Calm down people.

$10 e-dollars says that Salim shoots 50% tomorrow night. And if he doesn't, oh well. The kid won't lose confidence, and his teammates will still tell him to shoot the ball, because they know that he can get red hot and knock down shots in succession.

[DJlaysitup]

Quote:

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You're not nuts too bad Chalmers got hurt because he was pretty impressive and anybody is better than Salim at this point.

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Pretty much yes.

As far as being nuts - that's debateable...as far as Salim? My point is that Salim is the odd man out on this team. I wish he had better handles - - - but then again maybe I don't. This team doesn't need an all-for-me shooter. We need to stay where we seem to be...a team that starts MW and JS but gives JC and SW good playing time too...all good shooters. As far as PGs we have 3....two pretty good (Speedy and TLue) and Ivey as a desperation backup that won't hurt us much.

Granted I know little about Chalmers, but our team should be pretty well set. These guys just need to play together. The "glue guys" will be JChillz and Shelden.

[bootsybug]

i agree 100% with p-bird. i mean tlue and chill shot a better % from 3 than salim did last year. salim should be the 12th player at best because:

1. his attitude problems

2. he is one dimensional, and not even the best on the team at that one dimension

3. he is a turn-over machine

4. he cannot run the point

[bonethugz]

it's only one preseason game

[DJlaysitup]

not really...it's not just one preseason game. It's 4 years of college with SL last year - a neat shhoting exhibition - another year of SL...at this stage you do it or you don't.

Currently it doesn't look like Salim can play PG (unless we want to lose)...and he is otherwise a small guard who is supposed to be able to shoot but doesn't come through often. Once in a blue moon he gets hot and impresses everybody.

[twentythree]

well i love this forum!

Yesterday we were talking about 40-45 wins, today we are talking about worse. If Salim makes his shots tomorrow and we win, we'll go back to playoff talk.

Anyway, my opinion is he could be an effective role player on any team. Since we have good penetrators and they are becoming good passers, Salim's role should be easy on this team.

However, even we have two real point guards on the roster, it is like a sickness for us to see any player as a point guard. Remember the French guy, most of you learned his name after starting to play as a triple-double player. Do you remember what was he doing in our team? Yes, he was trying to play pg -the only position he can't play actually. Now we see Salim, tomorrow we'll see Cenk. None of them are point guards.

Now we are doing it with Salim. His value is great for teams like Spurs -as a role player of course. So why we can't make him play that way? Of course we don't have a Duncan, but we have Smoove, Marv, JJ and Chill. They can penetrate and pass. But because of that sickness we force Salim to play pg. Like we forced Diaw. Maybe if we release him or trade him for two packs of peanuts, we'll understand his value as a role player. Like Tony Delk...

[bootsybug]

How can you compare Diaw to Salim? Diaw was brought in to be Battier-like - a jack of all trades, something Chillz does for us now. Salim was brought in to SHOOT SHOOT SHOOT, and if he's not hitting 40% at least from 3, which he didn't do last year, and he's a turnover machine, and he can't run the point, what good is he? TLue and Chillz hit over 40% mind you, so why not this guy?

[thesheedera]

His point is valid. Even though they are completely different kind of players, the Hawks' mgmt had the same hope for both of them: that they would develop into a point guard.

Had we had a stud point guard over the last 5 years there wouldn't have been much of a need for these kinds of experiments.

Its a bit different in Salim's case, because for his career's sake he needs to see if he can play the point. His value goes up tremendously if he can do so.

He was a second round pick, he's a gunner, and this is the preseason. No need to wite him off now. Sure, he's been in the game a long time, but PG skills take time to develop. Jason Terry is still a work in progress, but look how far he came along over the years.

Salim's a great dude to have on your bench. 20 point deficits don't mean nearly as much when you have a guy on the bench with the mindset and skill to come in and take over the game. He still needs time to develop, but he has value.

[Popeye]

Leave Salim alone guys, we need him of the bench.

[Diesel]

TLue Salim and Ivey all off the bench?

[bootsybug]

All we heard over the offseason is that Salim's attitude has changed and he's a new man and all that. Listening to the game last night, maybe it's just my imagination, but it seemed like he quit, especially right there at the end when he was really really playing crappy. We don't need bad attitudes on this young team.

Maybe his elbow is still bothering him and he was exhausted, but then why leave him in there so long?

I don't have faith in Woody to make personnel decisions anymore, after he "forgot" to put Smoove back in the game one game last year.

[Johnnybravo4]

PB stay away from the Jack Daniels.

[DJlaysitup]

Well I'm with you most of the time JB - but in this case we have 4 PGs and Salim is the 4th. As far as playing the 2, he is a defensive liabilty and realistically JChill should get those minutes. No way do we move JJ to the one. We have a great 2 and a solid 2/3 backup who won't likely see too many minutes at the 3.

Sailm's a one trick pony and the trick ain't workin. Another poster mentioned that we have to "develop" him as a PG (?). It's time to try to win. What are we going to do, sacrifice the young prime of JS/MW/JC/SW just to see if SS can stop turning the ball over? I think not.

By the way - where is that little PG you were touting? I think he has the stuff to stick if some team would give him a chance as a backup. He looked great in SL. I'd take him over Ivey except Ivey is big enough to guard the 1 and the 2 (to a reasonable level).

[Eddielives]

For those who expect Salim to be a pg, don't get your hopes up. He's too offensive minded to be a pg of any caliber. I think that if he wants to have a successful career in the NBA, he needs to just be an average ball-handler(which he is not now) and a lethal jump shooter. If he becomes this, he will be a valuable asset to any team. Still, as mentioned before, he has much more value to a team like San Antonio or Dallas who is already championship caliber and just looking for role-specific pieces.

If he continues to struggle, I wouldn't cry if we traded him for a second round draft pick.

[Peoriabird]

Quote:

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PB stay away from the Jack Daniels.

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What does this mean? Are you implying that I was so drunk that I somehow credited Salim with 9 misses by mistake when in reality, he hit 9 out of 10 shot? Listen, you know I try to stick up for our players bu Salim has not found his niche in the NBA. If he can realize that he is a hired gun right now that is called upon to jump start a stagnant offense by coming into the game to hit shots, that one thing. But he is not even doing that! He is trying to run the offense which he can't do and I hope that is the reason his outside shot is so bad now. Maybe I'll change my mind if he hits a high percentage of his shots tonight.

[DJlaysitup]

Hang in there PB (and JD is a friend of mine JB)...anyway..it doesn't matter if Salim goes 8 - 10 tonight, we have seen his track record. He's a gunner that we don't need on this team. He can do one thing occasionally. Take your pick - SS or JChillz.

Salim is a streak shooter but his streaks are too far between. He should really not be in the league (IMHO) the way it is set up now. He's a dinosaur.

Flashy shooters are getting killed by solid defense and good ball rotation on offense. Plus - you don't cuss at your boss.