Is htere a spot for Salim?

[terrynoonan]

Please point out one innaccuracy in my statements.

[bootsybug]

Quote:

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Anyone with the moniker of the Sheederra probably doesn't need to ask for an apology. Sheed is such a open-minded guy.

I did not call you a racist. I said it sounded like a little racism.

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i mean these statements are just ridiculous. i'm not going to discuss it further, if you don't see why it is ridiculous, more discussion won't help.

[terrynoonan]

Do you?

[DJlaysitup]

boots, I don't see anything in the least bit ridiculous...it's a good point. Are we all getting down on Salim because he went 1-10?...I don't think so - it's more the turnovers and inabilty to run an offense that bothers me. We have to get off the starting line this year (no 2-16 stuff)...therefore we need chemistry between the guys who will actually play.

[terrynoonan]

Thank you. That is exactly my point.

[AHF]

I think Salim will play. However, I don't think he is going to be the primarily ballhandler for the Hawks (or he shouldn't be). I would play him when JJ or someone else can take primary ballhandling responsibilities.

Last year, Paul and Speedy played together a lot so it isn't out of the question that Salim and Speedy could get a few minutes together as well.

However, I agree he should not be running the offense at this point. Development is for the offseason. Getting your team in sync is for the preseason. Getting it on is for the regular season (for this team).

[terrynoonan]

That points to Woodson.

Personally I don't think salim is the kind of guy you want on the team.

He has huge matchup problems X and O wise and his on court attitude and decision making ability are not what I want.

If we play Salim a bunch subscribing to some theory that we have to stretch the D with a "shooter" then we will probably lose and Woodson will be gone.

We have guys that can shoot the long ball and play D.

[DJlaysitup]

Quote:

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...Development is for the offseason. Getting your team in sync is for the preseason. Getting it on is for the regular season (for this team).

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Bingo AHF...and a young team needs more confidence than a vet winning team. You can plant your fields with potential - but don't count on it being a cash crop.

Chemistry is an over-used word I suppose, but the 2345 guys need to have reasonable confidence in the 1 if he's running the offense.

[bootsybug]

DJ,

What I meant was it's OK to be down on Salim, but just because you are down on Salim doesn't mean you are the least bit racist. I am down on Salim as much as anyone right now.

I don't think any of us really care what color these guys are - all I want Salim to do is put the ball in the hoop!

[thesheedera]

DJ I wasn't referring to you, just to the original post about my terribly racist remarks.

[thesheedera]

How was my comment about Redick innacurate? I said he had one skill, shooting. He was one of the best long range shooters I've ever seen, and he could hit 3s with a degree of difficulty that no one else could.

But he couldn't hit a mid range jumper and he couldn't finish near the rim. He scored a huge majority of his points off of long range shots and FTs. He got better at his all around game as he got older, but lt's face it, he was very one dimensional.

Late in every season he played in college his legs gave out and his production suffered terribly, and his team failed down the stretch. Had K been dedicated to an all around game using his myriad of talent, Dook would have racked up a title or two during the JJ/Shelden years. But he was dedicated to JJ ball, and in the end it always failed them.

You may disgaree with what I'm saying, but to call me a retard and suggest that my comments about a white guy basketball player are racist, when I'm a white guy as well, and when I admire the other white guy's skill, is silly as hell. JJ was one dimensional, Dook went with a one dimensional game plan. When they were on, they were unstoppable because he could hit any long shot if he had a glimpse of a look at the hoop. If you watched ACC hoops over the last 4 years you'd know what I'm talking about.

Salim isn't a better player than JJ, he just has more weapons than JJ as a scorer.

I never once mentioned a word about their attitudes or character. The fact that you want to paint me in a corner because my handle is an homage to Rasheed also suggests that you're the inorant one. What are you trying to say about Sheed? What, are you a racist? Must be, that appears to be an answer to anything these days.

[terrynoonan]

How does he have more weapons?

You are right about Reddick except that he will always have a place in the league.

No evidence of Salim's numbers.

What I'm saying is that it sounded racist.

I don't care if it's against your own kind. Not saying you are mean spirited, just wrong.

Please give me some evidence that Salim scored more points from the line or in the paint to back up your argument.

I see no evidence.

Really, I don't think either one of them can ever play an important role on a contenting team. If they can't then why are we talking about them?

Sorry for using retard. I guess it's a little insensitive but this is a message board not a love fest.

First thought usually goes to post.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

JJ is a much better shooter than Salim?

And what do you use to base that on? By their college numbers?

People forget that Salim shot 50% FG and 50% 3FG in his senior year. That's something that not even Redick can say that he did.

The jury is still out on if Redick can even have a good of a year as Salim had last year.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Stop the Hop. If you think that it sounded racist, then you're seeing something that no one else who KNOWS Redick's game, is seeing.

And people better check Redick's numbers, and compare them to Salim's in college.

You might be in for a big surprise, if you do. Matter of fact, I'll do it for you.

JJ's last year at Duke

26.8 ppg

2 rebs

2.6 asst

47% FG

42% 3FG

86% FT

Salim's last year at Arizona

18.4 ppg

2.3 rebs

2.2 asst

50% FG

50% 3FG

91% FT

And Salim took very difficult shots at times, and knocked them down while at Arizona. Anybody remember the shot he hit in the NCAA Tournament that beat Oklahoma St? He had 2 people draped all over him, and hit an off balanced 3 pointer to beat the Cowboys. The crazy thing about that game, is that he also had 7 assists and 2 steals.

Redick's game is "come off screens to get space, and shoot the basketball". Last year, Redick tried to develop a mid-range game, but was somewhat unsuccessful in doing it. But he was such a good long range shooter, especially when he got hot, that his stock still stayed high on the NBA level.

Don't be surprised if JJ has the exact same struggles on the NBA level, that Salim had last year.

But good lord, Salim did put up these numbers last year:

9.7 ppg

1.9 rebs

1.2 asst

1.34 to's ( which is bad )

41.5% FG

38% 3FG

90% FT

Compare those numbers to some of the other rookie guards in the league last year.

http://www.nba.com/statistics/player/Scori...sExp=0&splitDD=

Chill out about Salim. He's just in a preseason slump.

[bootsybug]

I think if Salim had a history of being the so-called "model citizen" that people would cut him much more slack. No one is doubting his ability to shoot.

Here's the thing for me. Joe was brought in to be our point, and Salim was brought in to be the off-guard (part-time). Now that Joe is going to be our off-guard, and Chill gets most of the leftover minutes that Joe doesn't play, it doesn't leave a lot of time for Salim.

That's why the Hawks are trying him at the point. I think we can all pretty much agree that Salim will never be a good point on this team (or any other) on the NBA.

Sooooo since Joe as the point doesn't work, and that scenario was why we brought Salim in... where does that leave Salim? Especially since TLue and Chill were much better from 3 point range last year and are both better overall players.

My problem certainly isn't with Salim's play (I am wary of the attitude problems though), but where does he fit in on this team if he cannot run any point?

[thesheedera]

He has the ability to take it to the basket and finish. JJ had an uncanny inability to get his shots to fall when he took it to the rack.

I'm actually someone who believes that JJ has enough athleticism to get himself just about any shot, but he rarely converted for baskets when he took it off the dribble and got himself an open look.

I didn't watch as much of Salim in college as I did JJ, but I watched enough of Salim last year to know that he CAN convert the pull up jumper from 10-15 feet, and he CAN finish on a drive to the basket. I've seen it with Salim, I still haven't seen it with JJ.

The mere fact that JJ TRIED to drive more often made him a more dangerous shooter, because people had to play off enough to keep him from getting into the lane and getting fouled, but had he been able to finish on those drives, he would have become a more complete player.

I don't have any statistical eveidnce, wouldn't know where to find those numbers, I just know what I've seen from watching them both play.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Quote:

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I think if Salim had a history of being the so-called "model citizen" that people would cut him much more slack. No one is doubting his ability to shoot.

Here's the thing for me. Joe was brought in to be our point, and Salim was brought in to be the off-guard (part-time). Now that Joe is going to be our off-guard, and Chill gets most of the leftover minutes that Joe doesn't play, it doesn't leave a lot of time for Salim.

That's why the Hawks are trying him at the point. I think we can all pretty much agree that Salim will never be a good point on this team (or any other) on the NBA.

Sooooo since Joe as the point doesn't work, and that scenario was why we brought Salim in... where does that leave Salim? Especially since TLue and Chill were much better from 3 point range last year and are both better overall players.

My problem certainly isn't with Salim's play (I am wary of the attitude problems though), but where does he fit in on this team if he cannot run any point?

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LOL. Could it be that the Hawks are trying him at the point because their starting PG is injured right now?

If people weren't doubting his ability to shoot, then why are these threads being created NOW? They weren't created back in summer league, when people were ranting and raving about the fact that he shot well during that time, and seemed to have "better handles".

These threads have only came about since the preseason started.

To say that Joe at the point didn't work, is somewhat innacurate. Joe ran the team very well. But having Joe at the point took away some of his scoring opportunities. That's why Speedy was brought in . . to enhance Joe's offense, and everybody else's. Plus Speedy is a decent defender.

What should Salim's spot be on this team? The same spot that these guys had on their respective teams.

- Eddie House

- Steve Kerr

- Earl Boykins

- Craig Hodges

- Fred Hoiberg

- Damon Jones

- Juan Dixon

All of those guys, past and present, are pretty much known for one thing . . shooting the ball. And when they shot the ball well, they helped their teams tremendously.

They weren't great or even good floor leaders, or the best defensive players in the world. And they didn't get many minutes in a typical game. But they could shoot the basketball.

And there will be situations throughout each game, in which we will need a shooter/scorer to get the ball to. Salim fills that role better than any other person we have on this team, with the exception of JJ.

And no, I don't include Marvin or Smoove or Childress or Speedy in that category, because none of those guys have exhibited the ability to literally take over a game offensively in a short span. Speedy has done it on occasion, but it was during the entire span of a game. And because Speedy can't shoot outside of 18 feet, the extent of his offensive game is limited, compared to Salim's.

Salim's shooting and ability to score in bunches, can break a game wide open. And I'm definitely not ready to give up on the guy because of 3 bad shooting preseason games. Even if he shoots horrible the rest of the preseason, I'll still reserve judgement on him, until the season gets underway.

As for now, if the Hawks want to still experiment with him playing the point, NOW is the time to do it.

[gsuteke]

where there's smoke..... there's fire.