LOL @ Chad Ford

[gsuteke]

Justin (Brooklyn, NY): Which of the early surprise teams (Atlanta, Utah, Sacramento) do you see keeping it up?

Chad Ford: (12:31 PM ET ) Utah is for real and with Denver losing Kenyon Martin, I think they should be the hands down favorites to win the Northeast. Sacramento, because of their defensive intensity, also looks like they're for real (how about Kevin Martin for Most Improved Player ... he's been great). And, though it pains me to admit it, the Hawks aren't going to come crashing down to Earth the way I thought they would. I don't think they're close to a playoff team mind you, but it also looks like they won't be the cellar dwellers I pegged them to be in the pre-season. They're getting great contributions from Joe Johnson, Zaza Pachulia, Josh Smith and Josh Childress this year. If Marvin Williams can come back and play the way he did in the summer league ...I can't believe I'm writing this ...

[Popeye]

Haha, "I can't believe i am writting this".

[mrhonline]

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And, though it pains me to admit it...I can't believe I'm writing this ...

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He's such a brilliant man, huh?

[Sothron]

His hatred of BK for Knight's refusal to swap gossip with him as Babs used to do is just too much. Everyone here knows my feelings about BK but I don't think he's anywhere close as bad as Ford makes out.

[GoDawgs21]

LOL @ Sothron:

Talk about all time call outs:

You seem to think he was pretty bad, looks like at least Ford admits it when he says I might have been wrong. All quotes from last weeks thread.

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Why not? He's 6'9" and can play either forward spot and can't pass. He'd be a perfect Knight lottery pick.

Mrhonline, you'll have to excuse me I expect more out of our general manager than "Well he didn't pick the absolute worst pick every single year, just near the bottom every year". When you have a general manager in what six years? seven? that can't put together a team that can surpass thirty wins more than deserves firing.

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yep guess we should fire him for all 7 of those years, oops only been there 3.

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Knight has been here 2002. That is more than enough time to produce something more than the slideshow of 6'9" wunderkinds who can't even win thirty games. As Texas Pete and myself have said previously this man has blown picks by taking decent players when we could have had much better.

Mrhonline, I did not say the Joshes and Marvin were the absolute worst picks. Reread my post prior to this one. I said that just because he did NOT make the absolute worst picks does not mean he should be kept.

If peddling mediocrity is sufficient for most of you then Pete Babcock never should have been fired. Pete at least managed to put together 50+ win teams to his credit. Using the new Hawks fans criteria that should put him somewhere between God and Jesus.

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Last week you were in favor of the old Babcock days lol

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We as fans should demand more than a bottom five general manager.

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Yep sorry that bottom 5 GM led us from nothing to hope for something.

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Yes, I'd rather have taken a chance on POB than settling on an undersized and old (for a rookie) 23 year old with limited upside.

You want a list of good general managers? Jerry West tops that category. Greg Popavich would be second. Don Nelson Jr or whoever runs Dallas would be third. I love the job Charlotte has done in the draft and Orlando has two young studs in the making with Howard and Nelson. The Bucks GM has done a good job and isn't scared to make trades to bring in better talent. Jerry Colangelo is off to a good start in Toronto. The Phoenix GM is good. The Nets guy, Rod Thorpe? doesn't get enough credit. Kiki Vanderweighe did a good job in Denver. Joe Dumars has been very good in Detroit.

I can keep going here. There's at least twenty general managers in the NBA I would list above BK without breaking a sweat. The only GM I can categorically put below Knight is Isiah Thomas.

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Then he was the 2nd worst GM in the league.

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So at what point of passing over better players does BK need to reach in order for him to be fired? What's the magic number here? We've already seen Paul, Felton, Deron, Roy, Foye, Gay, Ellis, Deng, Igoudala (sp?) and who knows who else in just the last two seasons.

Knight will remain as long as the Atlanta Spirit is fighting wtih Belkin. Which may last until next season.

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I guess every other GM that passed on Ellis should be fired too uh? I guess since BK is the only guy in all 4 drafts to get starting talent, without missing one, yep he should be gone.

I remind you of other GM drafts.

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We need a real point guard that can pass, defend and shoot. So far Lue is doing a nice job in that role but he's better coming off the bench. This is where I think we are really missing passing on Deron Williams who fits my criteria to a "T" and that's about it for this season. Next year we will have to choose between Smoove or Chill since one (or both) will be leaving.

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Too bad thats 2 years.

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Call it a slow day at work, but just to show what we are saying by picks better GM, here are teams drafts for 2003,2004,2005 since the 2006 rookies havent played enough to judge they will not be included. The teams are ranked in avg. pick number. This only includes 1st rounders. SO logically the teams with the lower draft postion should be worse picks. Those at the top of the list have had picks of better caliber players.

Avg Pick

1) 4.5 Mil- 8)TJ Ford, 1)Andrew Bogut

2) 5.5 Cle- 1)Lebron James, 10)Luke Jackson

3) 5.6 Chi- 7)Kirk Hinrich, 3)Ben Gordon, 7)Loul Deng

4) 6.6 Cha- 2)Emkea Okafor, 5)Raymond Felton,13)Sean May

5) 7.3 LAC- 6)Kaman, 4) Livingston, 12)Yaraslov Korolev

6) 8.5 NYK- 9)Frye, 8)Sweetney

7) 8.8 Tor- 4)Bosh, 8)Arajuo, 7)Villenueva, 16)J. Graham

8) 9 Phi- 9)Iguedola

9) 10 Was- 10)Jarvis Hayes

10) 10.3 GST- 11)Pietrus, 11)Biedrinis, 9)Diogiu

11) 11.8 Atl- 22)Boris, 6)Chill, 17)Smoove, 2)Marvin

12) 12 Orl- 16)R. Gains, 1)Howard, 20)Nelson, 11)Vazquez

13) 13.3 Uta- 20)Pavlovic, 14)Humphries, 16)Snyder, 3)Deron

14) 13.6 NO - 19)West, 18) JR Smith, 4) Paul

15) 16 Sea- 12)Collison, 15)Ridnour, 12)Swift, 25)Petro

16) 16.6 Den- 3)Melo, 20)Julis Hodge, 27) Linos Kleiza

17) 17.6 Mia- 5)Wade, 19)Dorell Wright, 29)Wayne Simon

18) 18 Det- 2)Darko, 26)Delfino, 26)Jason Maxell

19) 18.3 Por- 24)Outlaw, 13)Telfair, 22)Khyrpa, 23)Monia,

6)Jack, 22)Martell Wbster

20) 18.6 Dal- 30)Howard, 5)Harris, 21)Pavel Podkolzine

21) 19 NJN- 23)Zoran Planic

22) 19.5 PHX- 18)Cabarkaba, 21)Nate Robinson

23) 20 Bos- 17)T. bell, 21)D. Jones, 15)Jefferson,

18)Green, 24) West, 25) Allen

24) 20.3 Mem- 14)Banks, 28)Perkins, 19)Warrick

25) 20.5 Min- 27)Nbudi Ebi, 14)Rashd McCants

26) 20.6 LAL- 25)Cook, 27)Vujaecic, 10)Bynum

27) 23 Ind- 29)Harrison, 17)Granger

28) 24 Hou- 24) Luther Head

29) 24.5 Sac- 26) Kevin Martin, 23) F. Garcia

30) 28.3 SA- 29)Barbosa, 28) Udrih, 28) Ian Mahiuni

Have fun but name 5 teams with better total picks, not just one guy cause they had a high pick and then compare that years pick wtih Atl. Name 5 teams with better drafts. PLEASE.

I will give you with avg picks worse then ours Dal, NO, and Utah have done better.

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We need a real point guard that can pass, defend and shoot. So far Lue is doing a nice job in that role but he's better coming off the bench. This is where I think we are really missing passing on Deron Williams who fits my criteria to a "T" and that's about it for this season. Next year we will have to choose between Smoove or Chill since one (or both) will be leaving.

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Too bad thats 2 years.

I can go on all day and make you look like a fool, its kind of fun.

[Sothron]

Wow I feel so warm to have someone here using their troll alias to stalk me.

Let's bust your crap out yet again. Owning you is becoming a second job at this site. I just wish you had the cajones to do this under your real screen name. You know if you did you would get banned from the site under the new "Play Nice Guys" rules sticked at the top. Gutless wonder.

"yep guess we should fire him for all 7 of those years, oops only been there 3."

Did you miss the part in my quote where I was ASKING HOW LONG he had been here? My quote:

"When you have a general manager in what six years? seven? that can't put together a team that can surpass thirty wins more than deserves firing."

It should be obvious to anyone with the intelligence above an empty beer can that I was questioning how exactly he had been here. Was it six year? seven years?

You DO know what a question mark signifies, don't you? Of course if you don't then my including one in the preceding sentence probably confused the hell out of you.

Next:

"Last week you were in favor of the old Babcock days lol"

You REALLY need to work on your reading comprehension. I was pointing out that people defending a general manager who can't even field a team that wins thirty games a year should have accepted a general manager that churned out several 50+ win teams at an even more diehard level. Nowhere in that post did I say I was in favor of the old Babcock days.

Read much? Oh wait, I ended that with a question mark. Don't be confused cupcake!

Next:

"Yep sorry that bottom 5 GM led us from nothing to hope for something."

Meh. Knight has never had a team win more than thirty games in a eighty two game season. Under anyone's definition that has to fall under the category as "bad". If the Hawks finally do something this year then I'll consider adjusting my opinion on Knight. Happy now? Oops sorry about the question mark cupcake!

"Then he was the 2nd worst GM in the league."

More reading issues from our friend the troll stalker.

What I ACTUALLY said: "There's at least twenty general managers in the NBA I would list above BK without breaking a sweat. The only GM I can categorically put below Knight is Isiah Thomas.

Reread that. I never said he was the second worst GM in the league. I said the only GM I can CATEGORICALLY put below Knight is Thomas. That means there can be OTHER PEOPLE below Knight but only Thomas is DEFINITELY behind Knight.

On to the next lie:

"I guess every other GM that passed on Ellis should be fired too uh? I guess since BK is the only guy in all 4 drafts to get starting talent, without missing one, yep he should be gone.

I remind you of other GM drafts."

Where did I say Knight should be fired only for passing on Ellis? My quote actually read:

"So at what point of passing over better players does BK need to reach in order for him to be fired? What's the magic number here? We've already seen Paul, Felton, Deron, Roy, Foye, Gay, Ellis, Deng, Igoudala (sp?) and who knows who else in just the last two seasons.

Knight will remain as long as the Atlanta Spirit is fighting wtih Belkin. Which may last until next season."

I pointed out several players Knight passed over. I also asked what was the number of players he passed over TO BE fired. I also said that Knight will remain in Atlanta as long as the AS is here. So where is he getting fired in my post cupcake??

Next:

"Too bad thats 2 years."

Well ya got me on this one cupcake. Its two years and not one. I'll give you a cookie on that one to show I'm not really such a bad guy.

Next:

I'm not sure what you were trying to show after this since you apparently had some copy and paste issues. Considering your difficulty reading English I can understand why the task of highlighting and copying and pasting can be difficult though.

Try harder next time. I also wish you had the spine to post under your real screen name instead of an alias you made two years ago and never bothered to post with until you decided to stalk me on this forum. I welcome the chance to just completely own you, as I have done yet again, but I wish we could see the real you and not the winter you.

Kupo.

[GoDawgs21]

Oh Sothy, I am not under any other name I have post that go back to 2004 under here. I usually just read and laugh. I know you were asking about how long he had been here. That was my whole point, you are supposed long time Hawk fan. Yet you dont know when the GM and regime changed? Thats funny. It helps to base your judgemnet on the actual time frame a guy has been in charge. So until last week you didnt even know how long BK had been here.

Next point about him not winning 30 games. So his first year he had to completely undo Babcocks crap you cant honestly use the players Babcock had brought here against BK. Thats like saying if BK were fired tomorrow that his predaccesor should be held for next years suad with these players. So now we are looking at 2 years of data, one of which a locker room guy dies a week before the season causing a 2-17 start, yet the team still wins 26. Lastly, BK doesnt coach. I am a huge fan of what BK has done getting the talent in here, but he doesnt coach the team which is a big sticking point of mine. Notice I have never defended Woody. Coaching and GM'ing are two totally diffrent subjects. I feel witha better coach last year we win 38 or so. The talent is here thats all you can ask for from BK. He got Woody the talent that should be winning 40 this year. BK also cant take the shots for the players, without some poor shot attempts from players this year we are 6-1. Like I just said BK doesnt coach or play, his job is to get the talent here. Which he has done.

I am the biggest BK supporter I see his vision, and I agree with most of his moves. Notice I never stepped up for the Ivey pick, but I look over 2nd round picks, they are the biggest crap shoot. I never once have stood up for Woody.

[GoDawgs21]

That and I really want to know how you own me. I have shown you stat, sources, and everything else to rebuff your postion. Other poster have laughed at you and called you a clown. I have legitmately gone through point by point even detailing finances till 2010. Your entire argument every post is, well my opinion is, I know we could do this or that, you dont know.

My whole problem with you is you call out Bk for being awful yet you love his moves.

1) You say Chilldress was a bad pick, yet later he should start for half the league. I want to know what % of number 5 picks are starters 5 years later. Any time you draft a starter its a good pick. How many top 3 picks have never panned out. Drafts are land mines with uncertainty of who well or wont pan out, the fact that every single BK pick has become an impact player in the NBA speaks enough on talent evaluation.

2) Now you say if Zaza improves he will command all this money. Who saw something in Zaza signed him for a 4 yr deal for peanuts when he was a RFA. His own team didnt know what they had. Now we have a 22 yr old starting center that is more then capable for basically nothing.

3) He gets JJ in here. The trade which a lot of people whine about is now after last years draft protection, Diaw and what may end up being the 19th or 20th pick in the draft. Even ESPN who hates BK, hollinger, Ford, and Stein said this week in the Daily Dime that JJ was worth every penny.

4) Your only hatered for BK is picking Marvin over Deron, and then Salim over Monta. So if Marvin plays like every NBA scout feels and makes multiple all-star games you are splitting apples between Deron and him. So now your hatered is based on a second rd pick which at the time everyone said was the steal of the draft.

Cmon, you may not like some of his discission but dont go bashing him when, a) you dont even know how long he has been here and b) he has actually turned the team around.

If this was a debate 95% of your arguement wouldnt even be heard because you have to able to substaniate your points.

[Sothron]

Please. You have not posted anything on this forum except to stalk my posts and try to flame me when you get a chance. I just wish you had the guts to post this under your real screen name so when you get this alias banned for flaming/stalking your real screen name goes down with it.

I don't expect you to own up to it though.

Not bothering to humiliate yourself further by refuting my post I see. I don't blame you. When you can't even read and understand English and its brought to your attention I would feel a little sick to my stomach myself if I were in your shoes. You sit back and search back God only knows how many posts to try and get some flame material on me, it gets blown up in your face and now you want to admit you were COMPLETELY wrong.

Typical troll behavior.

And as much as you like to bring up other posters for who knows what reason you'll notice more than one spoke up for me in another thread. I know you can't understand English very well but the text below my post is called a signature. That signature (or sig for short) gives you my complete internet history in terms of the Hawks. I have been a Hawks fan since my dad took me to games to see Fast Eddie Johnson the [censored] pedophile and I've been a die hard Hawks fan since I was literally old enough to walk. Same with ALL the sports teams in Georgia.

So don't even begin to question my committment to this team. I honestly at the time of that post did not remember if BK had been here since 2001 or 2002 or 2003. Which is why I ASKED how long he had been here to give BK appropriate credit or discredit for what he had done.

If you want to play nice and agree to disagree, that's fine with me. I don't have time at work to play paddy cake all day long and dig up posts or scour the internet for "sources" as you obviously do. If Knight has a team that finally makes the playoffs then I will give him credit for that and will reassess my judgement of his overall performence. I am not insane enough to ignore winning seasons because I don't like the job they had done on specific issues or players.

If you want to show you aren't a troll then start posting on this site without flaming or stalking me in the process. As it stands now I firmly believe you are nothing but a troll account and until evidence proves otherwise I will not change that opinion.

Ditto with Knight.

Kupo.

[mrhonline]

How come I don't get a stalker?

[Sothron]

You are too nice a fellow to incur the attentions of one. I remember back on the old espn.com days I had one stalker who called me "Softron" for the obvious sexual insult and he only posted to flame or attack me. Oh well. At least I've got experience with this.

[GoDawgs21]

Click on my name and you can see all post I made. Thats how its so easy to get your quotes. I just have to click and it takes me to all of your post. Its not hard. Also for stats its not hard to type in google bar 2006 mock or predraft and see what comes up I used the first 5 entries. Secondly when reviewing depth charts. Is it that hard to copy and paste a link from espn.com, or to navigate to rotoworld for fantasy stats that still dont back up your point. How am I just a flamer, I started the thread talking bout BK making us Piston like and you jumped on for the debate. You started something you coudlnt finish. Notice who's the createor of that thread.

Please look:

http://www.hawksquawk.net/forums/dosearch....at=0&Forum=,,,,All_Forums,,,,&Words=&Searchpage=4&Limit=25&where=&newerval=&newertype=&olderval=&oldertype=&daterange=&bodyprev=&Name=618

look at the Eddy Curry thread the Walker frethrow thread. I was calling for JJ and Salim 3 months before that draft this year. Thats why I have seen BK's plan and I understand it.

Im sorry but if you honestly think you have owned me that is the sadest thing I have ever heard.

[Vicktabulousness]

y the hell do people love to hate us?

[mrhonline]

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y the hell do people love to hate us?

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Which is worse: being hated or being ignored?

[Sothron]

If it means anything I do enjoy reading your posts MrH even if we don't always agree.

[AHF]

Why don't we get off battling eachother on this one (debate the points, but not the poster) and get back to something we all agree on. Chad Ford is an ass who does not even try to coverup his hatred for the Hawks.

[gsuteke]

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Why don't we get off battling eachother on this one (debate the points, but not the poster) and get back to something we all agree on. Chad Ford is an ass who does not even try to coverup his hatred for the Hawks.

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LOL

you guys are silly

[AHF]

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Why don't we get off battling eachother on this one (debate the points, but not the poster) and get back to something we all agree on. Chad Ford is an ass who does not even try to coverup his hatred for the Hawks.

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LOL

you guys are silly

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I enlongated the thread by posting about what a jerk Chad Ford is. Unless I missed the boat, that is directly on topic for this thread!

[gsuteke]

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Why don't we get off battling eachother on this one (debate the points, but not the poster) and get back to something we all agree on. Chad Ford is an ass who does not even try to coverup his hatred for the Hawks.

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LOL

you guys are silly

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I enlongated the thread by posting about what a jerk Chad Ford is. Unless I missed the boat, that is directly on topic for this thread!

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ain't that the truth. i just love it when threads get hijacked.

[TheDude]

you know whats terrible is that he says it's pains him to say it and he can't beleive he's saying it....WHY ARE YOU SO ANTI-HAWKS CHAD!?....it's not like he's debating contributions of players or player development or performance...other writers have predicted things about teams and been wrong. it's not like this is a first. but why so "pained" about it Chad?

wow, at first i thought it was my homerism talking but with comments like that it's obvious that a sportswriter has a bias that affects his judgement. heck, just because i hate the lakers doesnt mean they suck.

Dear Chad, do your job.

where do i apply for his position? heck, i got the nbaseason pass, i'll watch all the games and write about it.