The uncomfortable truth

[AHF]

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It comes down to what did you do.

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And what AI has done his entire career in the NBA is dominate the ball and score lots of points without ever being very impressive in terms of efficiency or shooting %. I think AI is MUCH better than Marbury and I would rather have Marbury any day of the week but in terms of dominating the ball they are similar players. Kobe was also in that category until he realized he needed to spread the ball around a little more this season and gave up some control.

If AI could reinvent himself I think he could be a huge addition to a team. If he can't reinvent his game, he would be a huge trainwreck long-term and only boost this team to .500 status in the short-term, IMO (because we don't have the defenders and rebounders needed to support a low % shooter who dominates the ball). I do think AI genuinely wants to win, though, and I would hope against hope that he becomes more of a facilitator on offense rather than trying to be the entire offense if he came to Atlanta.

[DJlaysitup]

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There is no valid reason to say AI plays no defense.

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Go to any Philly board and ask them about AI's defense. You will find that he doesn't stop penetration from his man, doesn't pressure the ball at all, and is constantly cheating off his man for steals leaving the guys behind him to cover for him.

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Get realistic...cheating off your man is exactly why we put up with Speedy...but he can't shoot.

[Swatguy]

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lol steals stats: the last defense of the desperate.

Big Dog used to routinely lead or be in the top three for SFs in steals. I guess he was a defensive stopper too using that logic.

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Nope I look at his total game. He leaves EVERYTHING on the floor. He is the first to dive for the ball get the hand ion for the steal. Force offensive fouls. Gives his body up for the cause, totally. You are incorrect about Iverson. He is a first ballot HOF without a doubt.Hawks with Iverson we would win more than lose. We would be a contender. If we could get him for Smoove, Lo, Speedy and a pick, Get Him. As much as you disdain him, players adore him, because he plays the game as you suppose to, All out.

[DJlaysitup]

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lol steals stats: the last defense of the desperate.

Big Dog used to routinely lead or be in the top three for SFs in steals. I guess he was a defensive stopper too using that logic.

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Nope I look at his total game. He leaves EVERYTHING on the floor. He is the first to dive for the ball get the hand ion for the steal. Force offensive fouls. Gives his body up for the cause, totally. You are incorrect about Iverson. He is a first ballot HOF without a doubt.Hawks with Iverson we would win more than lose. We would be a contender. If we could get him for Smoove, Lo, Speedy and a pick, Get Him. As much as you disdain him, players adore him, because he plays the game as you suppose to, All out.

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well said

[exodus]

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Then why is he (AI) shooting 41%? Why is he ranked 87th in the league in True Shooting %?

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*crickets*

[Sothron]

Yep, he plays the game hard core...except when it comes to actually doing things that helps your team win like, I dunno, practice. Do you want that cancer on our team? The only reason this story about Iverson demanding a trade broke is that agents for his own teammates were being told by the players to try and get Iverson off the team because they didn't want someone on the team who didn't want to be there.

I realize some of you guys love Iverson but I can't stand him or the half ass approach he has to playing the game. If he really wanted to be a winner then he'd cut down on his horrible shot selection and actually care about practice and improving the TEAM around him. Putting that cancer on our young ballclub would be killing our young guys.

[DJlaysitup]

He's a guard

[DJlaysitup]

[quote...practice....

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LOL - practice the phuck out of Este and see what you get.

[exodus]

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There is no valid reason to say AI plays no defense.

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Go to any Philly board and ask them about AI's defense. You will find that he doesn't stop penetration from his man, doesn't pressure the ball at all, and is constantly cheating off his man for steals leaving the guys behind him to cover for him.

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Get realistic...cheating off your man is exactly why we put up with Speedy...but he can't shoot.

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That is ridiculous. Speedy puts pressure on the ball constantly. he rarely cheats off his man when he is away from the ball. he does cheat when his man is close and he can recover quickly.

Speedy actually stops his man from scoring and penetrating. AI doesn't.

[DJlaysitup]

Speedy was a nice backup for CP3 - in his rookie year - ROY I should say to be fair. Speedy is Boykins - but slower and taller.

[hawkman]

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lol steals stats: the last defense of the desperate.

Big Dog used to routinely lead or be in the top three for SFs in steals. I guess he was a defensive stopper too using that logic.

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Nope I look at his total game. He leaves EVERYTHING on the floor. He is the first to dive for the ball get the hand ion for the steal. Force offensive fouls. Gives his body up for the cause, totally. You are incorrect about Iverson. He is a first ballot HOF without a doubt.Hawks with Iverson we would win more than lose. We would be a contender. If we could get him for Smoove, Lo, Speedy and a pick, Get Him. As much as you disdain him, players adore him, because he plays the game as you suppose to, All out.

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Thankyou. Somebody had to say it. Compare Iverson to Marbury??? Francis??? What in the world is going on? I bet most of these people were the same ones criticizing AI during his rookie year in the league when he was Philly's main offensive weapon. If you really know basketball you know that at 5'10", it should be impossible to do what AI has done for as long as he's done it. True he's a score first guard, but name one weakness in his offensive arsenal. The guy plays all out and no matter how you feel about him as a PERSON, at least acknowledge the PLAYER. This is getting ridiculous. It's getting to the point that we are bashing players who aren't even on our team.......yet.

[exodus]

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but name one weakness in his offensive arsenal.

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41%

[exodus]

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Speedy was a nice backup for CP3 - in his rookie year - ROY I should say to be fair. Speedy is Boykins - but slower and taller.

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When you say a guy named Speedy is slow you are really losing it.

And Speedy spent a lot of time last year playing the 2 along with CP and still was a tough defender even though being badly outsized.

I just started a thread on a Philly board asking about AI's defense. Prepare to be punk'd.

[gutz]

Exodus that is still a decent good shooting percentage for someone who HAS HAD to be the whole offense on his team. Again Iverson has NEVER had a player of JJ's caliber alongside him to play with. DO you expect him to shoot 50% with no other proven scorer on his team? If Iverson was on the Hawks his assist numbers would go up even more also allowing him to take better shots since JJ commands respect on the offensive end as well. Do you people not understand that?

[exodus]

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DO you expect him to shoot 50% with no other proven scorer on his team?

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Look at JJ's "supporting cast". Not very good is it? Yet it hasn't stopped him from shooting 50% so far this season.

[exodus]

Looks like someone already started a thread on it earlier today. Here are a few responses;

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If you're enamored by steals the same way some folks are enamored by blocks, than its adequate... If you're talking about man-to-man don't let your man score defense, none of the above...

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Lol @ iverson plays very good defense, Nuggets fan here And A pretty big iverson fan, but he doesnt play that good of defense, he interupts the passing lanes but rarely contests shots and his 1-1 defense is mediocre at best, this guy is an offensive powerhouse but saying he plays "very very good defense" is very very ignorant

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heck no - he plays okay defense - not great not bad - hes okay man on man -my problem is that he plays the passing lanes way too much and when he goes for steals , and misses the majority of them, it leaves guys wide open

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defense

[gutz]

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DO you expect him to shoot 50% with no other proven scorer on his team?

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Look at JJ's "supporting cast". Not very good is it? Yet it hasn't stopped him from shooting 50% so far this season.

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Dude were 20 games into the season. I'm sure at some point in Iverson's career he shot 50% in the first 20games of a season too. Your making ridiculous arguements here with no merit. Plus I think the Hawks have a better supporting cast right now than the Sixers. Were better and deeper at every position than they are. They are weaker than we are at PG, SG, SF, PF . They have Dalembert which I guess you could say is better than our Center position defensively but Zaza is probably better offensively. SO again your wrong

[gutz]

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Looks like someone already started a thread on it earlier today. Here are a few responses;

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If you're enamored by steals the same way some folks are enamored by blocks, than its adequate... If you're talking about man-to-man don't let your man score defense, none of the above...

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Lol @ iverson plays very good defense, Nuggets fan here And A pretty big iverson fan, but he doesnt play that good of defense, he interupts the passing lanes but rarely contests shots and his 1-1 defense is mediocre at best, this guy is an offensive powerhouse but saying he plays "very very good defense" is very very ignorant

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heck no - he plays okay defense - not great not bad - hes okay man on man -my problem is that he plays the passing lanes way too much and when he goes for steals , and misses the majority of them, it leaves guys wide open

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defense

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Okay so he plays okay defense from these responses. Whats your point? I don't think anyone on this board said he was a GREAT defender right? I think his incredible offense makes up for a FEW shortcomings on defense don't you think? Your laughable!!

[exodus]

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Were better and deeper at every position than they are

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So JJ's supporting cast is better than anything Iverson has had in 10 years?

ROFLMAO

FYI every year's game logs are avaiable at basketball reference.com. Good luck trying to find any month where AI shot 50%.

[gutz]

This year we are which is what you were referencing with JJ's shooting percentage. You were saying JJ is shooting almost 50% this year with his supporting cast right? Well Iverson supporting cast has sucked his whole career and this year. Don't try to twist your claims a different way. You said this year. Has JJ EVER shot 50% before in any year?