Why the Marvin hate?

[macdaddy]

Every game I hope Marvin shows some flash of things to come but in a year and half I haven't seen it. I thought he was a good pick and I just assumed that everyone can't be wrong. Let's remember that almost everyone outside of Diesel believed he was a superstar in the making.

But I don't understand and no one every answers this question: what is it that will make him an offensive force in the nba??????????

-he really doesn't shoot well. The form looks good but the ball doesn't go in.

-he doesn't handle the ball well. I know he has a bad hand but he fumbled often last year too.

-he doesn't seem to be blowing by his man and getting to the hole...ever. You would think in 1 1/2 years we'd see this happen.

I'm really not trying to hate on him. I just want someone to explain WHY he will be a great player. Most great players can do 2 things: nail jumpers from all over the court(not open jumpers either) and take their man off the dribble. I'm ready to see it from Marvin.

[Sothron]

We have no choice but to give Marvin and all the young guys as much court time as possible. We need to use yet another disaster of a season to at least develop the youth. Why isn't Shellhead playing 40 minutes a game? Why isn't Marvin?

[macdaddy]

I agree Shelden should be not only playing more but actually having some offense run through him. He plays under control for the most part.

[drzachary]

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Why isn't Shellhead playing 40 minutes a game? Why isn't Marvin?

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Because he'd foul out in 32! Then again, we probably should be using him just like that

[hawkman]

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Every game I hope Marvin shows some flash of things to come but in a year and half I haven't seen it. I thought he was a good pick and I just assumed that everyone can't be wrong. Let's remember that almost everyone outside of Diesel believed he was a superstar in the making.

But I don't understand and no one every answers this question: what is it that will make him an offensive force in the nba??????????

-he really doesn't shoot well. The form looks good but the ball doesn't go in.

-he doesn't handle the ball well. I know he has a bad hand but he fumbled often last year too.

-he doesn't seem to be blowing by his man and getting to the hole...ever. You would think in 1 1/2 years we'd see this happen.

I'm really not trying to hate on him. I just want someone to explain WHY he will be a great player. Most great players can do 2 things: nail jumpers from all over the court(not open jumpers either) and take their man off the dribble. I'm ready to see it from Marvin.

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Spot on. I don't doubt his ABILITY but I do question his MENTALITY. He just doesn't seem to have it in him.

[mrhonline]

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Spot on. I don't doubt his ABILITY but I do question his MENTALITY. He just doesn't seem to have it in him.

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He's 20.

I was a very mature 20, and I had no idea what "it" was, much less whether I had it or not.

[hawkman]

That's what separates the good players from the great ones. Magic, MJ, and LBJ had it at that age. Heck, Carmelo actually LED his team to a college championship at that age. If Marv was the basketball prodigy that everyone said he was before the draft, it would have been more evident right now in his play. So far, all I've heard is excuses. It almost seems that those who cosigned him as the 2nd pick feel like they have to defend him. I just have to call it like I see it. He may be a late bloomer, but I haven't seen anything to make me say, "he's the guy". He looks like he could be a good player but not a superstar. Heck, even Hakim Warrick is averaging 14 and 6 right now, is he going to be a superstar? It's hard to explain, but all I can say is that I just don't see what you guys see in this kid to think he will be the next big thing.

[Diesel]

Shelden has a better shot than most gave him credit for...even out to three point range.. He doesn't make many bad passes. More time on the court would only help him improve. I say that Solo man, Shelden, and Marvin should see more PT while JSmoove is out... but I wouldn't start Marvin... Not as long as Chillz can suit up.

Ideally, I think that we will get better when Smith and Lue gets back... Realistically, while they are out, we should try to work on players who should play more. That's Shelden and Jones.

I would trade Marvin but many would say it's too early. But like has been mentioned, I haven't seen the reason for the hype. NEver have.

[MoonKnight]

MW might know how to attack the rim but he never does it. He has become a standstill jump shooter that is not hitting his jumpers. He is having no impact on the game. To this point, JSmoove's impact on a game far outweights anything Marvin has done. It is great that he is being active in practice but it is time to show some flashes when it counts of why he was chosen #2 overall. I hope he shows it soon or this pick could be a Koncak-like lead balloon attached to this team for some time.

[Diesel]

Marvin doesn't play inspired basketball. Marvin doesn't even play like he wants it 1/2 the time. Marvin plays like a trained seal... Not literally but when Marvin gets the ball it's like he has to say in his mind, I have to drive the ball. Then he barrells into players left and right. At UNC, it was better orchestrated. He had wide lanes because of the pinpoint accuracy of the college game. But when the college game got tight, Marvin was a no show there too. Watch those last two NCAA games. Play the find Marvin game. May and Felton were the only studs on that side of the court.

However, now, in the pro game, the pinpoint accuracy is not there and it won't be there on any team accept Utah. What separates superstars from good players is that a superstar can create for himself. This is what makes JJ so good. JJ just gets the ball, finds a crease and scores. But Marvin may have the tools but he damn sure doesn't come to work. It's like his mind can't comprehend that he may have to do something different and find a way to get to the basket. It's that same ole thing... Watch him. When he hits the floor and the ball is passed to him, there are 2 things that he does:

1. Standstill jumper.

2. Drive to the right, head down, with lots of Jukes & akward pauses but no real attempt to go strong.

That's not the work of a superstar.

I've said it before, Dion Glover came into the league knowing how to get to the basket much better than Marvin. Out of Cedar Grove, Dion could have drove head up to the goal.

[drzachary]

Diesel, if you're right about mentality, you may be onto something about BK's skill as an evaluator. He seems to pick players with great talent, but with poor character traits. IMO, Diaw and Salim definitely fit this pattern, and it seems as though Marvin could, too!

[MoonKnight]

I would not say poor character traits but I think BK has selected guys that are not internally driven or intense in how they approach the game. While it is common to attack today's NBA player for having too much attitude, BK appears to be selecting guys without enought attitude.

[drzachary]

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I would not say poor character traits but I think BK has selected guys that are not internally driven or intense in how they approach the game. While it is common to attack today's NBA player for having too much attitude, BK appears to be selecting guys without enought attitude.

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That is a fair assessment. I have no complaints about Shelden yet, though. Or Chillz, really.

[Packfill]

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So has everyone else on the roster apparently

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Marvin doesn't get a free pass from me just because he is young. Smith is young too and I didn't give him a free pass when he was playing poorly in november.

In fact Smith played better as a rookie than Marvin is playing now.

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Let us not forget all these guys are 21 or younger and play significant roles on their respective teams: Dwight Howard, Monta Ellis, Andris Biedrins, Luol Deng, Chris Paul, Josh Smith, Al Jefferson, Josh Smith, Andrew Bynum and Shaun Livingston.

[hawkman]

Exactly, and I'm not even hating on him being picked 2nd. He just has to show more than what he has so far. He doesn't drive to the hole often, and when he does, he either gets blocked or stripped. He may have a thunderous dunk now and then, but not much else. But it really isn't about all that, it's about his mentality. He scored a lot of points against weak competition during summer league, but most of that seemed to come from the line. He was pretty much getting the superstar treatment out there but that hasn't been the case during the season. Driving to the hole and flailing around doesn't really work unless you're a proven star. He doesn't seem to have any offensive moves or even any post moves. What's up with that? Say what you want about AL, but at least he had some pretty devastating moves around the basket. I thought that MW would AT LEAST be as affective as AL but I haven't seen much improvement in his game at all. MW makes AL look like a beast. He looks like he's trying to be the next Jarvis Hayes instead of the next Jamaal Mashburn. If his ceiling is going to be 17, 6, 0 assists, and below par defense, we could have kept AL and at least had 3-4 assists to go along with that. You can't help but wonder what could have been had we just got what we really needed from that draft. 99.9% of the people on this board would be slurping CP right now, praising BK as a genius(big surprise), comparing Woody to Phil Jackson, and laughing at the team who picked MW. I know I'll get flamed for saying that but it's just my opinion.

[rascurrein]

Every team needs a player to be "hate" by the fans (i preffer talk about beeing discussed by the fans), and since Al is gone he is the one who is playing and in who the expectations of everyone of us rest; since he is not playing as we expect makes of himself the target of most of the criticism.

This kind of thing happens in every team in every team sport.

[SmooveTheFuture]

The fact that most of the people on here thought he was gonna me a miracle worker when he came back I cant remeber how many times I heard. I cant wait till we get Marvin and CHill back. Well there back and were losing more then ever. People are hard on Marvin because we took him way too high and passed on allstar players who would have helped this franchise much more. THe fact of the matter that we have other similar playera at his position. Im tired of hearing the age crap with him he went to college he should be ready. Hes not living up to expectations at the moment.

[SmooveTheFuture]

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So has everyone else on the roster apparently

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Marvin doesn't get a free pass from me just because he is young. Smith is young too and I didn't give him a free pass when he was playing poorly in november.

In fact Smith played better as a rookie than Marvin is playing now.

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Good Stuff I agree too many free passes for Marvin when he was taken over much better players and 2nd overall.

[SmooveTheFuture]

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Total BS ^^^. I'm telling you the kid is going to be good. He is the only player on the team who knows how to attack the rim. Smoove fumbles the ball away every time he drives. Marvin's offensive game is much more advance than Smiths. Smooves defensive rebounding and shot blocking are better than MWs. The kid has had a bad hand and is working his way back. He will be a helluva player. Coming from a guy advocating Paul Freaking Westhead...LOL.

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Marvin just runs into players puts heads his hand down and charges into people. If you wanna talk about clumsy look at Marvin he has to be one of the clumiest looking players I ever seen in a long time. It looks hes out there running through the motions. Marvin is no where the near the all around player SMoove is now. Smoove fills up the stats sheet all across the board and is a game changer.

[Diesel]

He goes to the line so often because he awkwardly tumbles at people.

The other day, Juwaun Howard was playing perfect defense on Marvin, Marvin did a backward step and a forward tumble and got a foul call. I'm not routing against him, I just know that after a while, the refs are going to get used to his junk drive and won't blow the whistle anymore.