Anthony Johnson Trade Poll

[Blunt91]

It is unknown whether AJ will be better than what we could have gotten with our 2ndround pick, on the other hand, he is an upgrade over Royal Ivey. We needed PG help with Lue still being hurt and Speedy's knee's still being weak. I would rather see AJ at the point than Salim or J-Chill trying to run it. We will look for a PG in the draft with the Indy pick. We will probably use Free Agency to address adding a Center.

[Guest Walter]

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I agree all the way. BK has shown guts in his drafting at times, but other than the JJ deal, he really hasn't shown much creativity / guts in getting us the players we need. Still, I think this trade helps, it's just not enough. He keeps positioning the team where we could really do well if we find the right trade, but he never seems to find it. Right now would be a prime time for a real GM to step in, make a bold move and have us right where we need to be. Just like Colangelo did in Toronto.

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What kind of crack are you (Lascar) smoking? You just defended the A.J. move. Like 5 minute ago! Now, you are saying that it is not enough for BK to deserve to keep his job. WTF? You are making no sense.

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Troy, I don't get it either. Lascar's not only all over the place but the fact is a "real GM" would have stepped in and made a bold move a long time ago. Frankly, it's worse to make an inconsequential move right now as the cap space hit further precludes us from making said bold move Lascar is calling for. Lascar, you hate BK but you love this deal. You want a "bold move" but you love a inconsequential deal that diminshes the likelihood of one. You are a walking contradition.

W

[DrReality]

After getting past the disappointment of not making a better trade I see s couple positives in the AJ trade:

First he brings some maturity and leadership that I think will help JJ a great deal. JJ needs the support.

Second he is a physical player and we do not have anyone that is skilled at the guard who can play physically.

Third he always brings good energy off the bench and that could be a big asset for us. Who knows he could be a catalyst for our team.

wonder which is worse for him? Not playing on a winning team or playing on a loser.

[AHF]

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I agree all the way. BK has shown guts in his drafting at times, but other than the JJ deal, he really hasn't shown much creativity / guts in getting us the players we need. Still, I think this trade helps, it's just not enough. He keeps positioning the team where we could really do well if we find the right trade, but he never seems to find it. Right now would be a prime time for a real GM to step in, make a bold move and have us right where we need to be. Just like Colangelo did in Toronto.

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What kind of crack are you (Lascar) smoking? You just defended the A.J. move. Like 5 minute ago! Now, you are saying that it is not enough for BK to deserve to keep his job. WTF? You are making no sense.

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Troy, I don't get it either. Lascar's not only all over the place but the fact is a "real GM" would have stepped in and made a bold move a long time ago. Frankly, it's worse to make an inconsequential move right now as the cap space hit further precludes us from making said bold move Lascar is calling for. Lascar, you hate BK but you love this deal. You want a "bold move" but you love a inconsequential deal that diminshes the likelihood of one. You are a walking contradition.

W

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Come on guys. Read his posts before slamming him. His position is eminently logical here:

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Just don't disguise your overall hatred of BK as evaluation of this trade. This trades helps a little regardless of anyone's overall opinion of BK.

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His position: (1) BK hasn't done enough to keep his job. This takes into account all his moves and the moves he has failed to make.

(2) This trade, evaluated in a vacuum, is a good one for this team and should be defended. Regardless of how bad a job BK has done or what moves he has failed to make, this trade in and of itself is a good thing for the team.

Those positions are not contradictory.

[d2v16DKG]

You call it guts, I call it stupidity! We needed a point guard and for our #2 pick we got a player who was a backup in college and didn't qualify for the recent "Rookie Challenge". BK needs to go!

[gsuteke]

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I agree all the way. BK has shown guts in his drafting at times, but other than the JJ deal, he really hasn't shown much creativity / guts in getting us the players we need. Still, I think this trade helps, it's just not enough. He keeps positioning the team where we could really do well if we find the right trade, but he never seems to find it. Right now would be a prime time for a real GM to step in, make a bold move and have us right where we need to be. Just like Colangelo did in Toronto.

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What kind of crack are you (Lascar) smoking? You just defended the A.J. move. Like 5 minute ago! Now, you are saying that it is not enough for BK to deserve to keep his job. WTF? You are making no sense.

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Troy, I don't get it either. Lascar's not only all over the place but the fact is a "real GM" would have stepped in and made a bold move a long time ago. Frankly, it's worse to make an inconsequential move right now as the cap space hit further precludes us from making said bold move Lascar is calling for. Lascar, you hate BK but you love this deal. You want a "bold move" but you love a inconsequential deal that diminshes the likelihood of one. You are a walking contradition.

W

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Come on guys. Read his posts before slamming him. His position is eminently logical here:

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Just don't disguise your overall hatred of BK as evaluation of this trade. This trades helps a little regardless of anyone's overall opinion of BK.

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His position: (1) BK hasn't done enough to keep his job. This takes into account all his moves and the moves he has failed to make.

(2) This trade, evaluated in a vacuum, is a good one for this team and should be defended. Regardless of how bad a job BK has done or what moves he has failed to make, this trade in and of itself is a good thing for the team.

Those positions are not contradictory.

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why is it you always find yourself babysitting Walter?

[AHF]

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why is it you always find yourself babysitting Walter?

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I have defended Walter's views in the past as well and will again in the future, I am sure. For whatever that is worth.

[gsuteke]

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why is it you always find yourself babysitting Walter?

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I have defended Walter's views in the past as well and will again in the future, I am sure. For whatever that is worth.

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the product may be great, however if the packaging and presentation sucks it simply won't sell. that is the answer to the question.

AHF aka "The Great Communicator"

[TroyMcClure]

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Come on guys. Read his posts before slamming him.

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I sent a pm to you about that. I read his posts.(lascar) He didn't read mine. He accused me of holding many positions that I don't and made assumptions from that mindset.

His logic is illogical. This is life, not a vacuum. Everything relates to something else and has ripples. This trade HAS to to evaluated with the other things he has done. This move hurts both short and long term. His(lascar) stated position is that we stink so bad we won't and shouldn't, in his estimation, make the playoffs. I feel differently.(see coaching) If he knows this and also feels the move for A.J. probably won't get us in the playoffs, where does he get off criticizing us for being upset? His only argument, to me, was "momentum". Give me a break. We have less money now. We also have 4 guards no one wants. How is there logic in thinking that a deal is a good one, when no tangible positive action occurs from it? What is the difference between 28, 29, 30, or 31 wins? Absolutely nothing.

[AHF]

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Come on guys. Read his posts before slamming him.

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I sent a pm to you about that. I read his posts.(lascar) He didn't read mine. He accused me of holding many positions that I don't and made assumptions from that mindset.

His logic is illogical. This is life, not a vacuum. Everything relates to something else and has ripples. This trade HAS to to evaluated with the other things he has done. This move hurts both short and long term. His(lascar) stated position is that we stink so bad we won't and shouldn't, in his estimation, make the playoffs. I feel differently.(see coaching) If he knows this and also feels the move for A.J. probably won't get us in the playoffs, where does he get off criticizing us for being upset? His only argument, to me, was "momentum". Give me a break. We have less money now. We also have 4 guards no one wants. How is there logic in thinking that a deal is a good one, when no tangible positive action occurs from it? What is the difference between 28, 29, 30, or 31 wins? Absolutely nothing.

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I still think that his position was very logical in the same way that you can say that a team played a great game but still stinks and not contradict yourself.

[TroyMcClure]

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Come on guys. Read his posts before slamming him.

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I sent a pm to you about that. I read his posts.(lascar) He didn't read mine. He accused me of holding many positions that I don't and made assumptions from that mindset.

His logic is illogical. This is life, not a vacuum. Everything relates to something else and has ripples. This trade HAS to to evaluated with the other things he has done. This move hurts both short and long term. His(lascar) stated position is that we stink so bad we won't and shouldn't, in his estimation, make the playoffs. I feel differently.(see coaching) If he knows this and also feels the move for A.J. probably won't get us in the playoffs, where does he get off criticizing us for being upset? His only argument, to me, was "momentum". Give me a break. We have less money now. We also have 4 guards no one wants. How is there logic in thinking that a deal is a good one, when no tangible positive action occurs from it? What is the difference between 28, 29, 30, or 31 wins? Absolutely nothing.

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I still think that his position was very logical in the same way that you can say that a team played a great game but still stinks and not contradict yourself.

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He's wrong. Which is more important, I think. His assumption that getting A.J. would help us and our chemistry, which keep in mind was his only argument, is destroyed by the fact that we now know why he was dealt. He should not have backed up a player that an NBA champion point guard wants to get rid of because he is fat and lazy.

[AHF]

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Come on guys. Read his posts before slamming him.

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I sent a pm to you about that. I read his posts.(lascar) He didn't read mine. He accused me of holding many positions that I don't and made assumptions from that mindset.

His logic is illogical. This is life, not a vacuum. Everything relates to something else and has ripples. This trade HAS to to evaluated with the other things he has done. This move hurts both short and long term. His(lascar) stated position is that we stink so bad we won't and shouldn't, in his estimation, make the playoffs. I feel differently.(see coaching) If he knows this and also feels the move for A.J. probably won't get us in the playoffs, where does he get off criticizing us for being upset? His only argument, to me, was "momentum". Give me a break. We have less money now. We also have 4 guards no one wants. How is there logic in thinking that a deal is a good one, when no tangible positive action occurs from it? What is the difference between 28, 29, 30, or 31 wins? Absolutely nothing.

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I still think that his position was very logical in the same way that you can say that a team played a great game but still stinks and not contradict yourself.

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He's wrong. Which is more important, I think. His assumption that getting A.J. would help us and our chemistry, which keep in mind was his only argument, is destroyed by the fact that we now know why he was dealt. He should not have backed up a player that an NBA champion point guard wants to get rid of because he is fat and lazy.

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An NBA champion previously wanted to get rid of Robert Horry because he was an attitude problem. That worked out pretty well for the Lakers. It worries me to hear that AJ is 20 lbs overweight but I will wait and see what he actually brings to the table for the Hawks given the small price they paid for him.

[TroyMcClure]

I'm a Bama guy. I watched Robert in college. There is a huge difference in the two players. Bob is border-line Hall of Fame!

[AHF]

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I'm a Bama guy. I watched Robert in college. There is a huge difference in the two players. Bob is border-line Hall of Fame!

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He is far from a HOF but he is one of the most clutch guys in NBA history and an assett for any team with playoff aspirations. However, my point was that even NBA Champion winning coaches get things wrong from time to time.

[bfwolf]

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Troy, I don't get it either. Lascar's not only all over the place but the fact is a "real GM" would have stepped in and made a bold move a long time ago. Frankly, it's worse to make an inconsequential move right now as the cap space hit further precludes us from making said bold move Lascar is calling for. Lascar, you hate BK but you love this deal. You want a "bold move" but you love a inconsequential deal that diminshes the likelihood of one. You are a walking contradition.

W

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Walter, many people (Lascar included) are incapable of understanding the impact of salaries on a team. These are the same people who call on the Braves to re-sign Andruw Jones to a $20MM/year contract even when the team's total budget is $80MM. They say "Andruw is great, why would we ever let him go?" When the obvious answer to anybody who can think critically is: Because you can do a lot of other things with that money.

In this case, Lascar is saying that Anthony Johnson is likely to play better than a high 2nd round pick (which is hugely debatable), but what he DOESN'T take into account is that a 2nd round pick is going to make about $700M vs. the $2.5MM for AJ. As you pointed out, it just puts us further away from being able to get somebody impactful.

AJ has MAYBE two more years left in the NBA. Why we would acquire him is beyond me. He's not any good, he's getting worse, and he eats up cap space. A 2nd rounder, at WORST, is no good, is getting better, and eats up a small amount of cap space. For a team like the Hawks who have no hope of making the playoffs this year, this is a terrible trade.

[mrhonline]

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AJ has MAYBE two more years left in the NBA. Why we would acquire him is beyond me.

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Perhaps because the team needs a PG who can play more than 15 minutes/night without getting injured?

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He's not any good

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He's a decent PG with lots of experience.

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he's getting worse

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He's played better in his 30's than he ever has in his career. Improving with age tends to happen to PG's more than any other position (e.g., Mike James, Steve Nash, Chauncey Billups, Sam Cassell).

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and he eats up cap space.

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No, he doesn't. He only costs $2.8M, which is not bad for a backup PG (see Lue, Tyronn). He will also have an expiring contract, so he's VERY tradeable this summer as part of a larger package.

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A 2nd rounder, at WORST, is no

good, is getting better, and eats up a small amount of cap space.

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No, a 2nd rounder, on average isn't on the roster the next season.

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For a team like the Hawks who have no hope of making the playoffs this year, this is a terrible trade.

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Yes, you're right. Accumulating tradeable assets for virtually nothing is a DISASTER.

[Lascar78]

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Walter, many people (Lascar included) are incapable of understanding the impact of salaries on a team. These are the same people who call on the Braves to re-sign Andruw Jones to a $20MM/year contract even when the team's total budget is $80MM. They say "Andruw is great, why would we ever let him go?" When the obvious answer to anybody who can think critically is: Because you can do a lot of other things with that money.

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Oh please, save it man. I supported the rebuild and the clearing of all our capspace to get free agents. We got Joe. With the ownership in limbo, what did we get last year? Speedy and Lorenzen. Whoopedidoo! If you think there are any significant real impact free agents at the PG or the C that we could have and would have signed this summer with our capspace, I dare you to name them(bearing in mind that we can only take players for 4 years or less otherwise Belkin has to approve) .

At best we would probably settle on another very average FA or two, stopgaps like Speedy and Lo last year. If we really want to make a move to bring back real talent, we're going to have to trade some of our young talent. In order to do that kind of trade without giving up your best, you need throw-ins like AJ or Lue who can add a little to the total in contracts that you're giving up, without saddling a team with a horrible contract. Any team in a major deal would easily take Lue or AJ at their prices. The difference now is that when we have to throw one of them in we're left with some backup. Plus we can actually have a PG at all times this year.

Don't lump me in with know-nothing fans who dont understand the cap.

So again, let's hear your name of realistic FAs at the PG or C that we'll be getting this summer (or would have without AJ's albatross contract).

[exodus]

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So again, let's hear your name of realistic FAs at the PG or C that we'll be getting this summer

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Mihm and Verajao are possibilities. They are both RFAs and both on teams that need veteran help at the point.

*hint*

Off the top of my head Mags is the only major UFA and frankly i think he is fading so quickly i wouldn't even bother with him.

[DJlaysitup]

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...In this case, Lascar is saying that Anthony Johnson is likely to play better than a high 2nd round pick (which is hugely debatable), but what he DOESN'T take into account is that a 2nd round pick is going to make about $700M vs. the $2.5MM for AJ. As you pointed out, it just puts us further away from being able to get somebody impactful...

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My outlook is - why not just play Salim - then try to package something like our Indy pic + high 2nd round pick (or plus Salim or both) to at least move up high enough to get a big like Visser out of this draft. AJ will help BK get his 30 wins this year I imagine, but won't do much for our future.

[mrhonline]

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Mihm and Verajao are possibilities. They are both RFAs and both on teams that need veteran help at the point.

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Mihm is unrestricted.

A S&T with Varejao is still very much an option because the Hawks will be one of the few teams in the league who can "absorb" what will most definitely be BYC status for him.