Food for thought

[codyatl]

I will admit to being 1 of the Woody bashers on this site. Something hit me as I was reading a post about Marvin maturing as a player and developing into a star. Why do we not give coaches the same developement period? Just want to hear what u guys think.

[Lascar78]

I guess because coaches are in charge and directing the entire team. Just like you would be tolerant of a new employee fresh out of college not really knowing what he's doing, but it would not fly if the CEO was clueless.

While the young players are learning, other players can carry the team. If the coach blows, no one else can step up to coach the team.

You do have a point that Woody is growing and getting a bit better, but if we really want to win we clearly need a better coach.

[pimp]

Because, When u have a team that has not made the playoff

in 7 or 8 years, you need a coach that already knows how

to win.We have had nothing but rookie Coaches since we fired

Lenny Wilkens...And we haven't come close to making the playoffs since then.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

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I will admit to being 1 of the Woody bashers on this site. Something hit me as I was reading a post about Marvin maturing as a player and developing into a star. Why do we not give coaches the same developement period? Just want to hear what u guys think.

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The question you should be asking is . . . "why not give the coaches CREDIT for developing these players?"

A lot of people on this board think that Josh's transformation has everything to do with his change in mindset as a player, rather than the COACHES actually changing his mindset as an offensive player.

The same goes for Marvin and Childress. It's actually the coaches putting these young players in position to become better players. These coaches are constantly challenging these young players to raise their level of play.

I like what Woody said about Smoove after the Chicago loss. (( paraphrasing )) "We have to get back on working on Josh ( Smith ). We don't want to take the jumpshot away from him, but we also want him to drive the ball more and get easier looks at the basket."

That's straight from the coaches mouth. That same coach that 85% of the posters despise around here. Yet, those same people will give all of the credit to the transformation of Smoove, to Smoove only. Saying that Woody and the staff had a lot to do with Smoove's transformation as a player, would be a slap in the face to everything they believe about Woody.

Things the coaches have done with the kids since all of them have been able to play together this year:

Smoove:

(1) Move him almost permanately to the 4 spot, to create possible offensive mismatches against bigger and slower 4's. That move to the 4 spot has also increased the number of rebounds the kid can grab, especially on the defensive end. He's even played the 5 on a few occasions when both ZaZa and Ren are having "difficulty". Smoove has grabbed double figure rebounds in 10 of his last 16 games. When he reaches that double figure number, we're 7 - 3 in those games.

(2) Stressed upon him to not settle for every open look he has from 18 feet on out. They're telling him to take it to the basket and possibly draw fouls. He's gone to the line 70 times this month . . 15 more than he went to the line back in November.

(3) Worked on his post up offense. He's developing a little jump hook, especially when matcehd up against players his size or smaller. His post game still needs a lot of work, but the coaches are doing just that . . working on it with him.

Marvin:

(1) Encouraging him to spot up somewhere around the 18 - 21 foot range, so that he can receive a pass and immeadiately shoot the open jumper without rushing the shot. If you remember last year, Marvin would come in the game, and take at least one 3-pointer to try to develop some range on his shot. Since Smoove's return on Jan 12, Marvin has taken a total of 5 threes. He's concentrating on developing his mid-range jumper when he does get that open look almost exclusively.

(2) When the jumper isn't falling, they're telling him to ATTACK ! Although he needs to become a better finisher when he does get to the hole, it's evident that he has the ability to get to the basket and cause problems for the opponent. And he probably needs to attack more than he already does.

(3) When matched up against a smaller player, he's posting up. That's a call that usually comes from the sideline. Some teams think they can get away with playing their 2-guard on Marvin, while letting their bigger SF guard JJ. When that happens, Marvin usually has a play ran for him where he posts up the smaller man. Sometimes he scores. A lot of times, he draws a foul and gets to the line.

Childress:

(1) Enabling him to impact the game in a variety of ways by playing him at three positions PG, SG, SF. As a PG, he concentrates more at playing defense and possibly posting up the smaller PG. Like Marvin, the call for a Chill post up usually comes from Woody. As a SG, he's usually open for that 18 - 22 foot shot that he knocks down so much, and usually draws the assignment to guard the other team's best 2 or 3 on the floor at the time.. As a SF, he really becomes very active around the basket, almost Tayshawn Prince-like, while doing all those other things.

(2) Because of his ability to play 3 positions, and because of our PG injury situation, his minutes have increased. Out of the 3 kids, Childress has been playing the most minutes since Jan. 12.

While people criticize everything about the organization, I love the way Woody and the coaches have persevered through everything, and not quit on these kids. They work with what they have, and try to make the best of it. Few people will give them credit for that, but the ASG definitely notices the hard work that Woody and his staff puts in on a nightly basis. That's one of the reasons why they're not quick to do what most of the fans say, and get rid of Woody.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

One more thing. Woody gets crucified on this site about his lack of an offense and the fact that the Hawks don't run a lot.

2 questions to that:

1) How many good running teams are there in the league, that doesn't have a good PG making the decisions on the break?

2) How many teams rely on their SFs and PFs to lead fast breaks?

I mean, that's basically what you guys are asking Woody to do. Have someone like Smoove or Childress lead the fast break and make the right decision. Personally, I cringe everytime Smoove pushes the ball up the floor. I don't mind him running it into the frontcourt. But I don't want him making decisions on the fast break. He should be the finisher, not the distributor.

Speedy is more like Turtley these days. He can't run for extended minutes. Lue is hurt. Salim could run the break, but do you want that guy making the decisions on the break? LOL . . even that good pass he made to Marvin in the Spurs game, he acutally took 3 steps before Marvin got the ball. The refs didn't call it though. Ivey? I guess he should run the break . . lol. JJ? JJ could do it, but he's better off spotting up for a 3, than actually making the decision to take the ball all the way to the hole.

So basically, Woody has to work with what he has. He'll let the kids run in spurts, which is all they should be doing right now.

AJ isn't a guy known to push tempo, so don't expect us to run with him either.

Woody isn't perfect, but he's probably had to do more with his personnel, than any other coach in the league.

[coachx]

Good points northcyde.

I totally agree with your points about Woody. Teaching kids to play and beat men takes time. Granted the players would develop on their own but coaching is what nurtures the players into who they are now. (Sure any kid will grow into an adult but good parents give them a better shot at being a good adult.)

Marvin, Chils, and Smoove all looking more comfortable on the floor. They are starting to play like true NBA veterans in my opinion.

I think Woody disiplines his players much more then what we see as fans. Heck, he learned from Bobby Knight, so I'm sure people are held accountable behind closed doors.

Not many coaches would want the job Woody was given.

Woody and Knight's patience WILL PAY OFF. Nothing happens as fast as many fans and press precieve it should happen.

[pimp]

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Why do we not give coaches the same developement period?

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Well Josh Smith has always given credit to assitant coach

Larry Drew for alot of his improvement...

[Hoosier]

The coaching staff has done well bringing out talents in their young players, I'll grant you that. But, how can you argue that that is what makes a good or even average head coach in the NBA. Talent development is usually handled by assistants. I have no problem keeping Woody on staff for that role.

Great coaches get payed to win games, by making in-game match-up adjustments. I sometimes think Woody brings his plan out of the war room, and follows it, no matter what happens during the course of the game. That won't get it in the NBA, maybe High School. If you cannot see that he is way out of his League out there, during the game, then I don't what else to say.

The player talent level on this team right now, is way ahead of the coaching, and that is the reason why the Hawks are winning some games right now. Maybe give Woody some credit for that, but he has to be replaced for the Hawks to really compete.

[bumpyphish1]

Northcyde, I agree with much of what you said. Solid, well thought out as usual. However, I will ask you this (to play devil's advocate): If you say we should give credit to Woody for J-Smoove's attacking the rim more often, what the heck took so long for him to put that plan into action? Everyone on here has been calling for Josh to quit shooting three's up until the All-Star break. I would have told him not to shoot on Day 1.

[BusBoyIsBack]

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Northcyde, I agree with much of what you said. Solid, well thought out as usual. However, I will ask you this (to play devil's advocate): If you say we should give credit to Woody for J-Smoove's attacking the rim more often, what the heck took so long for him to put that plan into action? Everyone on here has been calling for Josh to quit shooting three's up until the All-Star break. I would have told him not to shoot on Day 1.

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He's constantly been telling Smoove to do this.

He can't go out there and make him do it.

[AHF]

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Northcyde, I agree with much of what you said. Solid, well thought out as usual. However, I will ask you this (to play devil's advocate): If you say we should give credit to Woody for J-Smoove's attacking the rim more often, what the heck took so long for him to put that plan into action? Everyone on here has been calling for Josh to quit shooting three's up until the All-Star break. I would have told him not to shoot on Day 1.

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He's constantly been telling Smoove to do this.

He can't go out there and make him do it.

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I am sure they told Smoove to keep working on his 3 shot - just not to use it so much in the games. That is a tough balance for a young player to strike. He seems to be in a pretty place right now with his shot selection most games.