How much trade value does MW have in this draft?

[DavidSomerset]

I've been thinking, if we somehow got the #2 pick, we would obviously take Durant.

My question is, could we then turn around and trade Marvin straight up for a pick in the 7-8 range (surely he is worth that much on potential, alone) and take Hibbert?

If we got out of this draft with Durant, Hibbert, and Conley, I would say we'd be sitting very, very pretty for the future.

Durant is an upgrade over Marvin at SF, Hibbert is the defensive big we need, and Conley would be a great PG for us.

Conley/AJ

JJ/Salim

Durant/Chillz

Smoove/Shelden

Zaza/Hibbert

What do yall think?

[AtLaS]

Doubt we could get better than a mid 1st. Anyone who's done any legit scouting knows that he hasn't improved since his rookie year.

[GST]

I think there only a handful of players in the league that would cause a team to even consider trading out of the top 2. I don't think we have any of those players.

[CBAreject]

I believe Marvin has the value of a 6th pick at best. We could get a 6-8 for him. Once Horford and Wright are off the board, MW is about the best you can do.

It will depend on needs, as always.

A team like Philly, who already has a strong defensive center would do best to trade a 6th or 8th pick for MW.

A team like Seattle, who has Lewis and Allen would be foolish to trade for MW when they obviously need post scoring and defense.

Minnesota, always looking to add a 2nd scoring option, might be tempted to pair MW with Foye and Garnett. They could completely justify going after a 5, though.

Regarding your dream scenario, it's a nice dream. I would obviously be tickled to death if we got that collection of players. I just worry we didn't tank well enough to get it done.

[Packfill]

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I've been thinking, if we somehow got the #2 pick, we would obviously take Durant.

My question is, could we then turn around and trade Marvin straight up for a pick in the 7-8 range (surely he is worth that much on potential, alone) and take Hibbert?

If we got out of this draft with Durant, Hibbert, and Conley, I would say we'd be sitting very, very pretty for the future.

Durant is an upgrade over Marvin at SF, Hibbert is the defensive big we need, and Conley would be a great PG for us.

Conley/AJ

JJ/Salim

Durant/Chillz

Smoove/Shelden

Zaza/Hibbert

What do yall think?

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I think having three rookies playing prominent roles would be a mistake.

[Plastic Man]

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I think having three rookies playing prominent roles would be a mistake.

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We don't need to keep getting younger.

[CBAreject]

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We don't need to keep getting younger.

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Let me put a stop to a common line of thought before it takes over this thread.

First, it is true that all things equal, players are worse when they're very young. HOWEVER, this does not mean that youth should be avoided at all costs.

Let's take it case by case. Oden is younger than Zaza. Is he therefore worse? Oh, my lord, no.

Durant is younger than MW. Is he therefore worse? LOL, no.

Conley is younger than AJ. Is he worse? Oh my sides, no.

Hibbert is younger than Lo. Is he worse? It's hard to be much worse than Lo.

The belief that "we don't need any more young players" is poorly thought out. While it's true we need more veteran leadership, we should realize the changes proposed don't cost us any of that. We're not proposing to get younger at JJ or Smoove's positions. Those guys stay intact. Childress stays with his mature play. Realize that if you are suggesting this youth influx hurts us, you are arguing that a reduction in Zaza's minutes for a stronger defensive center would be a bad thing. You are arguing that MW is better than Durant by virtue of his being 2 years older...or perhaps that experience helps him "know how to win". Clearly these things are false.

[DavidSomerset]

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Regarding your dream scenario, it's a nice dream. I would obviously be tickled to death if we got that collection of players. I just worry we didn't tank well enough to get it done.

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Well...We have a 25% chance of either getting Oden or getting Durant and being able to trade Marvin for a pick.

1 in 4 isn't too bad...Anything can happen.

[Packfill]

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We don't need to keep getting younger.

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Let me put a stop to a common line of thought before it takes over this thread.

First, it is true that all things equal, players are worse when they're very young. HOWEVER, this does not mean that youth should be avoided at all costs.

Let's take it case by case. Oden is younger than Zaza. Is he therefore worse? Oh, my lord, no.

Durant is younger than MW. Is he therefore worse? LOL, no.

Conley is younger than AJ. Is he worse? Oh my sides, no.

Hibbert is younger than Lo. Is he worse? It's hard to be much worse than Lo.

The belief that "we don't need any more young players" is poorly thought out. While it's true we need more veteran leadership, we should realize the changes proposed don't cost us any of that. We're not proposing to get younger at JJ or Smoove's positions. Those guys stay intact. Childress stays with his mature play. Realize that if you are suggesting this youth influx hurts us, you are arguing that a reduction in Zaza's minutes for a stronger defensive center would be a bad thing. You are arguing that MW is better than Durant by virtue of his being 2 years older...or perhaps that experience helps him "know how to win". Clearly these things are false.

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No one is saying Oden, Durant, Conley or Hibbert aren't far superior to current players on the Hawks roster. So don't even go there. What I am saying is that you need BALANCE - i.e., mixture of youth and vets. No team with three rookies, no matter how good they are, is going anywhere fast.

[exodus]

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i.e., mixture of youth and vets.

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We have Speedy, Lue, AJ and Blo. They are vets.

The Joshs will be in their 4th season next year. Time to stop thinking about them as young, inexperienced players considering how many minutes they have played.

Marvin will be in his 3rd season.

Bottom line is that we need TALENT. Personally i don't care if we bring in two teenagers if they can play and actually fill a need.

[CBAreject]

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No team with three rookies, no matter how good they are, is going anywhere fast.

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I disagree. It all depends on who the rookies are and how prominent their roles are. Also, even if the team struggled, it would likely be better than this year's team.

Which line-up is better?

MW

Smoove

Zaza/Lo

JJ

Speedy/Lue

OR

Durant

Smoove

Zaza/Hibbert

JJ

Conley/Speedy

The players in question wouldn't necessarily even start (except for Durant). They have vets at their positions to share time and ease the transition. They replace poor back-ups. Durant replaces MW and has Childress to help in the transition.

I'm not sure how you can argue for the 1st line-up being better. Given that the first one is going to win 30 games, I think a better team with fewer injuries could easily win 40, which is a playoff berth in the pathetic East.

Another good question to ask is what moves we would make that would result in being a better, more veteran team? We can't sign anyone. Could we trade for someone? Who?

[Diesel]

But I doubt it.

Plus, I would just rather get a solid PG with Indy's pick.

[Packfill]

Personally, I am sick of the losing so the idea of another rebuild is not all to appealing. I especially do not want to entrust BK with three lottery picks.

[newkid]

jdu00743, for awhile it has been my hope that the scenario you presented comes to pass. This summer Rashard Lewis is likely to opt out of Seattle (for greener financial pastures in either Orlando or Charlotte), therefore resulting in a need for a 3. Marvin's from the State of Washington, and can probably be a favorable marketing tool especially if the franchise can convince state/local government to build the new arena the franchise seeks. Seattle currently has three young 7-footers (Sene, Petro, & Swift), all of whom are still on their rookie contracts, so no real pressing need for another 'project' type big such as Hibbert. Jeff Green and Yi Jianlian are a couple of 3s Seattle might target in the draft. If Yi's gone, it'll likely not be a hard sell to convince the Sonics GM that Marvin - perhaps more for off-court reasons - is a marginally better fit than Green.

If it comes to pass, there might be more players involved than Marvin. Could also be an opportunity to get Ridnour if Seattle is willing to take Lue's expiring contract for financial considerations. Marvin's and Lue's combined '08 salaries would be just over a million more than Ridnour's, and Lue's portion would fall off the books at the end of next season. Seattle has 3 picks in the upcoming draft, so she'll have other opportunities to find possible bargains at pg and sf.

I like your suggested line-up, but Conley (if he comes out) maybe off the board when we exercise the Indy pick; however Law or Crittenton wouldn't be bad 2nd choices (or perhaps the 6'6'' kid from Italy who's been honing his skills as a sg).

[bfwolf]

Marvin plus Indy's pick is nowhere near #2.

Marvin has, at best, the value of a mid to late lottery pick in this year's draft. I'd say more likely a mid 1st rounder. But for argument's sake, let's say you could get the #6 pick for him.

Nobody would trade the #2 pick for the #6 and #12 pick.

[SmooveTheFuture]

Hate too break the news to you Marvin lovers. Marvin is not worth no where near a 6-8 pick thats laughable. He is worth about a late 1st at best. The guy hasnt lived up to the hype being drafted overall. His value has dropped since he was drafted. I dont even think he would be a top 10 in his own draft class if the draft were redone. Yet alone in this draft being one of the deepest in years maybe ever.

[Packfill]

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Hate too break the news to you Marvin lovers. Marvin is not worth no where near a 6-8 pick thats laughable. He is worth about a late 1st at best. The guy hasnt lived up to the hype being drafted overall. His value has dropped since he was drafted. I dont even think he would be a top 10 in his own draft class if the draft were redone. Yet alone in this draft being one of the deepest in years maybe ever.

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Come on now, while Marvin is definitely not enough to net the #2 pick in this years draft he is enough to get a late lotter pick. Some teams would still prefer him and his two years of experience over a Jeff Green (note I said some teams, not all teams).

[TexasPete]

Marvin would get you more than Sebastian Telfair...Telfair went for the 7th pick. Marvin is younger and has more upside. If you think a dumbass like Kevin McHale or Ainge or Sund wouldnt trade a high lotto pick for Marvin then your high on crack.

Marvin hasn't even had an NBA coach yet, he is only 20, and has a lot of tools. He is basically a college age kid with 2 full years under his belt. He graduated early from HS which means this should of been his soph. year in college. If you dont think that carries more value than anybody other than Oden or Durant you kidding yourself.

[SmooveTheFuture]

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Hate too break the news to you Marvin lovers. Marvin is not worth no where near a 6-8 pick thats laughable. He is worth about a late 1st at best. The guy hasnt lived up to the hype being drafted overall. His value has dropped since he was drafted. I dont even think he would be a top 10 in his own draft class if the draft were redone. Yet alone in this draft being one of the deepest in years maybe ever.

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Come on now, while Marvin is definitely not enough to net the #2 pick in this years draft he is enough to get a late lotter pick. Some teams would still prefer him and his two years of experience over a Jeff Green (note I said some teams, not all teams).

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I disagree what exactly does Marvin do well right now? Shoot the ball at a decent % that is it. He doesnt drive well he doesnt rebound his defense isnt that good. Lottery pick in this draft no way jose.

[Traceman]

There is no doubt in my mind. The dude is still only 19 and he is just now scratching the surface of his talent. I'd take him over anyone not named Oden or Durant in this draft.

Al Horford, arguably the 3rd best prospect in this draft, averaged 11.3/7.6 as a sophomore and 13.2/9.5 as a junior. Marvin averaged 11.3/6.6 as a FRESHMAN. And he came off the bench. I have no doubt that if Marvin were in college last year, he would have put up better numbers at UNC than Horford did at FL and he would be a virtual lock for the #3 pick.