These owners don't care for the fans...period

[Guest Walter]

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I think from now on, I'll write all of my posts in

red.

It'll be my way of separating myself from the crybaby masses.

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Great. I'll know inaccuracies by color coding and won't even have to read them.

Northcyde, when was the last time you were critical of the current regime without qualification or excuse? It use to be few people agreed this rebuild was on life support. Then more and more. Now even the apologists claim the witness the incompetence but make some excuse for it, apologize for it, or simply overlook it (Lascar with his 45 win projection next year).

W

[Lascar78]

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If the ASG/Mullin/BK signed Claxton expecting him to play only around 55 games then they are purely stupid. Further, if you told them that Speedy would average only 55 games over his contract there is no way they do that deal. Period. My point was that these guys are always backtracking every stupid ass decision that they make and I'm tired of it like 99% of all Hawks fans.

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I disagree. Anyone who's ever heard of Speedy knows he's injury prone. Of course they do the deal knowing he's injury prone because, well, they knew he was injury prone. To say that guys in this position (I'm talking BK for instance - I don't know what Bernie knows) didnt know he was injury prone is absurd. These guys have scouts in foreign countries, pour over pages and pages of medical pages for each potential draftee, and you think they don't know of a medical condition that anyone with any remote interest in the NBA know about? Come on man.

For the 100th time, not everything has to be black and white. The ASG, BK, and Woody may all be incompetent compared to their peers, but they're not complete morons. They got where they are for a reason.

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Woodson is the absolute luckiest coach in the league because his total incompetance is covered over by a huge array of pitiful excuses.

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Agreed.

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And for all of those who think Woody will be gone for sure....think again. Because we may win 35 games in the lousy East next year and these boobs will say we improved.

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I doubt it. The excuse for not paying 2 people will be gone and they will be free to do what they really want. Their goal for this year was 40 wins, 35 might have been the safe mark for Woody with no injuries. There is no way he stays with 35 wins IMO. But who knows.

[AtLaS]

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I think from now on, I'll write all of my posts in

red.

It'll be my way of separating myself from the crybaby masses.

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Great. I'll know inaccuracies by color coding and won't even have to read them.

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LMAO! I literally fell out of my chair laughing at that Walt..

[thesheedera]

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I challenge you to go to the archives and find where Texas Pete and Walter or any one else thought the Speedy move was the wrong move at the time it happened. Only then can you say I told you so or. I honestly can't remember a single person against the move AT THE TIME IT HAPPENED.

Until you prove this was your belief from the beginning your simply a Monday morning quarterback whiner.

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I can't remember who exactly said what, but there were plenty of posters disappointed with the Speedy signing. Some were even furious.

I must admit I was pretty excited about it after watching his season with the Hornets. I thought he was ready to be a solid #1 PG kind of guy. I have SO FAR been incredibly disappointed. When he was healthy he wasn't much of an upgrade over Lue.

[Lascar78]

He wasn't healthy all year.

My opinion of the signing hasn't really changed. We knowingly overpaid and gambled on his health. If his health issues continue, we lose big. If he gets reasonably healthy, he'll be a good fit.

Either way we still need the PG of our future.

For the record there were plenty of people against the signing. I don't remember who, but there were plenty I believe.

[TexasPete]

I'm not sure how BK got to be a GM but despite all of his "expertise" and scouts in foreign countries he has a major penchant for pushing the wrong button. Maybe when the scouts are sitting in the room talking to him BK is looking at the inside of his sphincter muscle.

If the ASG and Bernie Mullin think Woodson is the right guy to coach this team right now, injuries or not, then they have little hope. I don't know how they got to where they are but I can list hundreds of supposedly "smart" people that are totally out of their depth in the professional sports arena.

Finally, if the ASG signed Speedy and expected about 55 games for that kind of cash, in their financial condition, then they are flat out stupid. I would rather hear that they thought he was due for a healthy stint in his career than they thought 55 games was about right. Because 55 games for a career backup doesn't solve the PG problem.

[Lascar78]

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I would rather hear that they thought he was due for a healthy stint in his career than they thought 55 games was about right. Because 55 games for a career backup doesn't solve the PG problem.

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OK, then the next time Bernie (or BK) are giving their standard PC, BS answers in which they just say the right thing and give away no info, don't b!tch about them not telling us what's really going on like you have in the past. You're making it clear now that you'd rather have them lie to you rather than honestly tell you about the thought process.

We had no PG, we had to make a compromise. At that point in time it was

-gamble on Speedy's health knowing he won't play full seasons most years

-get a much less effective PG talent-wise

-go another season with Ivey starting

-trade Childress, Smith or some other young talent to try to get a PG

They chose option A.

I don't see how them knowing the risk that they were taking makes them dumber than not knowing the risk that EVERYONE knew they were taking.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Walt, I just understand how injuries can wreck a season. And when that happens, I have to give some of the people in charge the benefit of the doubt.

The organization can definitely be critized for not getting Chris Paul. But unlike yourself, I completely understand why they chose Marvin.

Like with my Bengals. I didn't blame the organization for the Ki-Jana Carter signing. It was a good pick-up, but we just got unlucky with his injury.

I don't even blame them for the Akili Smith signing. We needed a QB, and he was the best availabe QB left on the board.

The Dan Wilkinson draft pick? You bet. Marshall Faulk was there for the taking, and we passed him over just to get a D-Lineman ( who we did need, but wasn't the guy with the most upside, nor the guy who could make an immeadiate impact )

As far as this year's version of the Hawks, I still say we finish somewhere close to .500, if we were somewhat healthy. It's too easy to say that the Hawks are horrible, when just about the entire core of the team missed 15 or more games this year. No team in the leauge is going to survive that.

In either case, you'll find something to whine about until the Hawks make it to the NBA Finals . . if they ever do that in our lifetime. So it's cool. Continue to whine and cry.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

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You mean by putting yourself in the "Everything is A-OK! Woodson is the NBA's best coach! Knight is the NBA's best GM!" like some of the people are like on here? Please. I'd rather take fans of a team with a realistic view on this franchise than some of you BK-Woodson-ASG apologists that think we should be lucky to have a **** team season after season.

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LOL . . but you guys AREN'T realistic at all. Most of the people on this board know that. If you were realistic, you'd know that when a team suffers the injuries that they did this season, that you're not going to achieve the goals you set at the beginning of the year.

We all want to root for a winner. But when things like that happen, it's not much you can do. Ask Milwaukee. Firing Porter one year, and Stotts this year, when each of those teams were devastated by injuries, isn't a solution to the problem. You just have to hope that people can stay healthy enough to build something.

It's obvious that you guys don't have any patience anymore, and I understand that.

Crying about it won't help the situation though. And it won't help your sanity as a fan.

[Sothron]

I think its more than realistic to expect a team to make the playoffs 8 years after its last appearance. Let alone to not make the monumental blunder that Knight and Woodson make every year in terms of draft selections or in our (lack) of running Woodson's offense.

And I just have to add this recent fad of posting in different colors including white which makes your text illegible is annoying.

[mrhonline]

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And I just have to add this recent fad of posting in different colors including white which makes your text illegible is annoying.

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Hey, we're just trying to find a way of fitting in. We're not willing to join the whinefest, so we have to take a different route of being like the "others."

[TexasPete]

Your totally missing my point. My stance is that his saying they hoped to get 55 games out of Speedy IS TOTAL BS. I don't buy it for a second. I think he and BK were hoping that Speedy would play the season out or close to it. I don't think even BK/Mullin would sign a guy they hoped would play 55 games a year. He isn't the kind of player you need if 55 is all he will play. Plus, 55 games hardly solves the problem at PG. I might sign Chauncey for 55...no way in hell Speedy.

I'm calling more BS on Bernie. I have had 8-10 emails from him just brimming with bullshit. He is not the kind of executive that leads a successful team anymore than BK is the GM we need.

My position is that I'm tired of the spin cycle BS coming from the ASG. The "of course Speedy wasn't playing the whole year, we hoped for 55" is just crap. There isn't a GM in the NBA that would sign a guy like SC hoping for 55 games. This is consistent with the emails and conversations we have had that defend EVERY move these guys have made. Hey, sometimes I make a mistake. Everybody does. But Bernie and the ASG would do everything all over again, every last rotten signing and draft pick. And, this isn't done in public where you might expect it, it is done one on one, man to man, nobody else around. It is done totally off the record. He has defended EVERY MOVE BK has made. I just think the guy is a lying turd and that is why I am done buying tickets. I know they don't care but it was the right move for me.

[mrhonline]

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My stance is that his saying they hoped to get 55 games out of Speedy IS TOTAL BS. I don't buy it for a second. I think he and BK were hoping that Speedy would play the season out or close to it.

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I wholeheartedly agree with this.

[Lascar78]

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My stance is that his saying they hoped to get 55 games out of Speedy IS TOTAL BS. I don't buy it for a second. I think he and BK were hoping that Speedy would play the season out or close to it.

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There is a HUGE difference between hoping and expecting. Of course they hoped he would play the full season. So did I. But I didn't expect him to play the full season for all 4 years. When a guy is injury prone, you expect that it will surface over the course of a long term contract. Some years he will play nearly the whole year, some years he might be virtually worthless if things go wrong.

I don't know about Bernie, but to say that BK expected Speedy to play virtually full seasons over all 4 years is basically calling him a complete moron, which he is not. When a guy has averaged about 55 games a season, that's what you expect. You hope that he plays all games, but you know he probably won't, and he might even miss whole seasons.

Is there a single person here that expected Speedy to not miss major portions of time over his 4 year deal? I doubt it. To say that BK is dumber than anyone here is just ridiculous. He's taken some gambles that have more or less blown up in his face, but he's not that dumb.

I can understand the argument that we should not have paid an injury prone guy that much. Fair enough if you wouldn't have taken the gamble.

But to say that despite what they say, you have a firm belief that they expected this injury prone player to suddenly be injury free for 4 years just seems baseless to me. Unless there is evidence to the contrary, I'm going to assume that BK knew what every single NBA fan knew, that Speedy is injury prone.

I understand you have corresponded with Bernie, and maybe he is a grade A bullsh!tter and that's why this upsets you so much. I don't know as I don't know what else he's said to you. But taking this at face value, I don't see the problem with the statement. When you sign a Speedy Claxton - Marcus Camby type, you're going to get 55 games or so on average. You hope for the best but expect some problems along the way.

Of course that doesn't mean that Bernie isn't full of sh!t in general. I've only really heard him talk once and never listened to Breakfast with Bernie. But I don't see what the big deal is with this statement.

[Guest Walter]

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Walt, I just understand how injuries can wreck a season.

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I don't know how many games Shaq and Wade actually played and strated together but it wasn't many...and just about EVERY team had serious injuries this year.

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And when that happens, I have to give some of the people in charge the benefit of the doubt.

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The benefit of the doubt?!?

I'm sorry, but at this point if your doubt isn't cemented it never will be.

"Benefit of the doubt" started with Childress over Deng and Iggy and SHOULD have ended with MW over CP3 and Deron. There isn't room for faith in GMing. Our injuries while significant cost us only about 4-5 games in the end.

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The organization can definitely be critized for not getting Chris Paul. But unlike yourself, I completely understand why they chose Marvin.

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And you still think it was the right thing to do. Again, you CONTINUE to be WRONG! "Understanding" the most incompetent GM ever (passed on 2, consecutive ROY) and being WRONG does not lend you any credibility, it subtracts from your credibility.

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Like with my Bengals. I didn't blame the organization for the Ki-Jana Carter signing. It was a good pick-up, but we just got unlucky with his injury.

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It's unlucky when a guy tears an ACL. It's incompetent when they sign him only EXPECTING him to play in 66% of the games due to known about, chronic injuries. I didn't know he had CMP, but if I did I would have said NO GO! You know how easy it is to see CMP? A knee x-ray. Standard part of a team physical (at least the ones I've seen).

I don't even blame them for the Akili Smith signing. We needed a QB, and he was the best availabe QB left on the board.

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As far as this year's version of the Hawks, I still say we finish somewhere close to .500, if we were somewhat healthy.

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Whatever. You have no credibility on this issue. You've been wrong too many times. It's like listening to a revisionist history course.

W