Rank from worst to first all BK's draft decisions

[Guest Walter]

[AtLaS]

I went with MW, SW, JC, Diaw, JS. Now it's looking like the Shelden and JC picks are about equal. Both were made over 2 players (Iggy/Deng and Roy/Foye) who were at the time ranked better, and have proven WHY they were ranked better. However I will say the SW pick was slightly worse since we were already stacked at his position. It's funny BK says he always takes BPA yet he's directly contradicted himself twice in this matter. He takes HIS BPA, not the overwhelming consideration of who the BPA is.

[CBAreject]

I think the mistakes are not so much who he drafted but who he didn't draft.

For example, SJ appears to be a fair choice but I still believe we should've taken Millsap. That was clear at the time, as well, so I think it's a major mistake. The Donta choice appeared to be good, and it would've been fine if he had managed to take Duhon instead of Ivey. Donta may have even developed if he hadn't been the 6th SF on our team.

Childress is a fine player, but clearly we should've taken Iggy or Deng. That was clear at the time, and it is clear now. That's a major mistake that netted us a decent player. Also, Childress' failure to be a primary scoring option made it more likely for us to draft MW to be that guy. If we have Deng or Iggy scoring 15 a game at the 3, I think we're far less likely to draft MW to play that same spot.

This just makes me feel sick, so I'm going to stop talking about it. God help us in the lottery.

[DrReality]

And to think he took Ivey over Chris Duhon? That takes real talent to screw up like that. Unbelievable.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Question:

Why wasn't Diaw listed as BK's worst pick in any of those scenarios?

You're talking about how the player has played for us and/or fit the needs of the team, right?

In the 2 years that Diaw was here, Chill and Marvin easily had a bigger impact as a player than Diaw. You can even very easily argue that Shelden had a bigger impact in his rookie year, than Diaw had in 2 years here. Diaw waw absolutely HORRIBLE as a player here . . just HORRIBLE.

If you'd listed this scenario:

Diaw, Chill, SW, MW, & JS

. . then I would've voted for that one. Otherwise, I have to vote "none of the above" in that section. Listing Diaw as 4th behind Josh Smith, is laughable. Diaw is arguably the most passive Hawk player in its history who never showed a desire to improve while he was here.

2nd round is easy.

Donta, Ivey, SJ, and Salim

As of right now Salim has won/impacted more games in his Hawk career ( even this year ), than any of those 2nd round picks. And in the right lineup, Salim could be a bigger asset for the Hawks, than those other guys. So I have to put Salim as being the better pick right now.

[Guest Walter]

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Question:

Why wasn't Diaw listed as BK's worst pick in any of those scenarios?

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Because relative to draft position (21) he has been better than JC, SW, and MW...that is unless you're a BK apologist.

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You're talking about how the player has played for us and/or fit the needs of the team, right?

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Diaw fit the needs of our team perfectly. HE WAS DRAFTED BEFORE ANY OF THE PLAYERS OTHERWISE MENTIONED! How could he not fit our needs when drafted given we had needs everywhere?!?

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In the 2 years that Diaw was here, Chill and Marvin easily had a bigger impact as a player than Diaw.

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Where's the moron icon? Combine Childress' and MW's draft positions (8) and it's still less than half where Diaw was drafted (21). Diaw isn't far behind these two and offers alot that neither of them do.

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You can even very easily argue that Shelden had a bigger impact in his rookie year, than Diaw had in 2 years here. Diaw waw absolutely HORRIBLE as a player here . . just HORRIBLE.

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MORON ICON!!! Take you pick.

Where were each player drafted? Still, no way "the most NBA-ready player" in SW had a better rookie year given his age, experience, and familiarity with the American game. The simple fact that you have to question whether a 5th pick isn't FAR better than a 21st pick screams [censored] up!

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If you'd listed this scenario:

Diaw, Chill, SW, MW, & JS

. . then I would've voted for that one.

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You're laughable. But oh well. Diaw as a 21st pick produces as well as our HIGH lottery picks.

W

[Popeye]

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Question:

Why wasn't Diaw listed as BK's worst pick in any of those scenarios?

You're talking about how the player has played for us and/or fit the needs of the team, right?

In the 2 years that Diaw was here, Chill and Marvin easily had a bigger impact as a player than Diaw. You can even very easily argue that Shelden had a bigger impact in his rookie year, than Diaw had in 2 years here. Diaw waw absolutely HORRIBLE as a player here . . just HORRIBLE.

If you'd listed this scenario:

Diaw, Chill, SW, MW, & JS

. . then I would've voted for that one. Otherwise, I have to vote "none of the above" in that section. Listing Diaw as 4th behind Josh Smith, is laughable. Diaw is arguably the most passive Hawk player in its history who never showed a desire to improve while he was here.

2nd round is easy.

Donta, Ivey, SJ, and Salim

As of right now Salim has won/impacted more games in his Hawk career ( even this year ), than any of those 2nd round picks. And in the right lineup, Salim could be a bigger asset for the Hawks, than those other guys. So I have to put Salim as being the better pick right now.

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I agree Northcyde, who cares what Diaw is doing for Phx it's what he did with us. He had like no value when we traded him to Phx because he sucked here so bad. He was just a throw in.

[VarsitySlacker]

I did the same thing most of you did, double-taking at Diaw being second best, but think about it. This is not PICK WHICH PLAYERS ARE THE GREATEST HAWKS.

In 2003, BK took Diaw.

Hawks fans wanted: Probably Diaw

The media: Didn't give a [censored].

Player behind him that turned out better: Josh Howard, Leandro Barbosa, Udonis Haslem

In 2004, BK took Childress

Hawks fans wanted: Deng or Iggy

The media wanted: Deng

Players behind him who turned out better: Deng, Iggy, Jefferson, Josh Smith, possibly J.R. Smith, Kevin Martin

In 2004, BK took Smoove

Hawks fans wanted: Smoove

The media (minus Jay Bilas) wanted: Smoove

Players behind him that turned out better: N/A

In 2005, BK took Marvin

Hawks fans wanted: Paul

The media wanted: Marvin

Players behind him that turned out better: Paul, Williams, (debatable: Ellis, Villanueva, Bynum, Jack, Lee)

In 2006, BK took Shelden

Hawks fans wanted: Roy or Foye

The media wanted: Roy or Foye

Players behind him that turned out better: Roye, Foye, Gay, Sergio Rodriguez

In terms of sheer players who would have been better picks, Diaw is second. In terms of franchise-altering players picked after, Diaw is still second. He's not an impressive pick, but at the 21 pick, if you can pick an NBA-caliber-backup, you're doing good. Diaw was more than that.

[Diesel]

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Because relative to draft position (21) he has been better than JC, SW, and MW...that is unless you're a BK apologist.

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I'm not a BK apologist, but this is simply untrue.

Diaw was a whiny little 3 point, 2 rebound brat his whole time here in Atlanta. He was a bad fit and when he made the treasonous statement that he "might" go back to France and play over there for a while, then I knew that we had to get rid of this guy and that he was dead weight (regardless of how I felt about Woody)...

For you to defend the scum is speaking volumes about your true agenda!!

[Diesel]

That night, many of us questioned why we didn't pick Josh Howard.

You fail to remember, that was one of the strongest drafts in the history of drafts.. Hell Barbosa and Howard were behind Diaw... Steve Blake, Kyle Korver, and Zaza were all second rounders in that draft.... There were others who were picked later than Diaw so the whole talent at 21 card cannot be played.

[Guest Walter]

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I agree Northcyde, who cares what Diaw is doing for Phx it's what he did with us. He had like no value when we traded him to Phx because he sucked here so bad. He was just a throw in.

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When was Diaw picked relative to MW, JC, and SW? How was SW any better than Diaw as rookies even? This is inane and moronic to compare a 21st and 2nd, 5th, and 6th picks without considering their draft position. Ronnie Turiaf is just horrible compared to Bynum. Wait? One's a 9 and the other a 27th pick and both were good values at their draft position. Imagine that. You can be a better pick AT YOUR RESPECTIVE DRAFT POSITION without being a better player.

Mind you, Diaw last year averaged 13.3, 6.9, & 6.2 on 53% shooting. Few players in the league could EVER average that and none of them are JC, SW, or MW. Does that mean he's better than they are. SW? YES! JC...50/50. MW. Likely not, but it depends upon if he acquires a personality change. Still, put ALL of those player's draft positions together and you are EIGHT draft positions from where Diaw was drafted.

A LOL to the LOL crowd.

W

[Diesel]

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When was Diaw picked relative to MW, JC, and SW?

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Yeah, I think you need to reinvestigate this question..> WHEN was Diaw picked.

After Diaw was picked, you had guys like Barbosa, Howard, Blake, Green, Zaza, Mo Williams, Kyle Korver, etc.

Diaw's 21 is a lot greater than any other year's 21. Diaw came out in the strongest draft since Shaq's. To say that draft strength doesn't matter is ignorance on your part Walter.

[Guest Walter]

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Because relative to draft position (21) he has been better than JC, SW, and MW...that is unless you're a BK apologist.

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I'm not a BK apologist, but this is simply untrue.

Diaw was a whiny little 3 point, 2 rebound brat his whole time here in Atlanta.

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Diesel, you complained HALF THE SEASON about SW's MPG and how Woody was to blame. Woody certainly did worse to Diaw and Diaw proved him a [censored]-up the next year. So, Woody is at fault regarding "NBA-ready" SW, but not at fault AT ALL with foreign Pt-forward Diaw? Hell, I heard SW whinning about it this year too. Where is your even-handed criticism of the "two whinners"?

BTW, you used to hate Diaw JUST because I liked him the year before he actually entered the draft. It's just been personal and lame of you ever since. SW can't block [censored] and you moan and cry for him and the treatement he's getting from Woody, but Diaw, who had a very good rookie year under Stotts for a foreign player drafted 21st, gets a severe shaft from Woody and you're all silent about Woody and attacking Diaw.

Note: you didn't even dispute the FACTS that VS put up, you just said "not true" and ran from the facts. Next time. Bring an argument with you.

Mind you, Diaw was never worth the deal he got, but the mere fact that a 21st pick got that deal, after Woody [censored] on him, shows you that he was a very good pick at 21.

W

[Guest Walter]

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When was Diaw picked relative to MW, JC, and SW?

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Yeah, I think you need to reinvestigate this question..> WHEN was Diaw picked.

After Diaw was picked, you had guys like Barbosa, Howard, Blake, Green, Zaza, Mo Williams, Kyle Korver, etc.

Diaw's 21 is a lot greater than any other year's 21. Diaw came out in the strongest draft since Shaq's. To say that draft strength doesn't matter is ignorance on your part Walter.

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Name any of the 5 players drafted immediately after Diaw. Can't can you. There wasn't any prospect hot on Diaw's tracks in that draft. Sure, I'd like Howard or Barbosa (28 & 29), but unlike Roy, Paul, Deron, Deng, Foye or Iggy they weren't players that IMMEDIATELY followed the lesser player we got.

Yeah, real strong middle of that draft, Dahntay Jones. Real strong. As if a 21st pick EVER should be compared to a top lottery pick. You are a farce.

W

[Buzzard]

Diaw, Chill, SW, MW, & JS

I agree 100%. You have to realize this is a Walter poll. No way MW is ever going to be allowed to get votes as BK's 2nd best pick. No way in hell....

[Diesel]

What does it matter if they immediately followed Diaw?? That's some real BS you picking up there Walter... Your hands are dirty.

The fact of the matter is this, these guys were picked after Diaw. Period. ON draft night, you wasn't a squawker but many of us wanted Howard (ACC Player of the year). To say that Diaw was the best possible pick at 21 is BS and you know it. Especially when there's a gang of guys late first and 2nd round that was better.

[Diesel]

You make this long diatribe about me not treating Diaw and Shelden the same... Let me show you again what I said earlier in this thread..

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Diaw was a whiny little 3 point, 2 rebound brat his whole time here in Atlanta. He was a bad fit and when he made the treasonous statement that he "might" go back to France and play over there for a while, then I knew that we had to get rid of this guy and that he was dead weight

(regardless of how I felt about Woody)

...

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What's wrong Walter, there were no RIF programs in Pigpicken NC when you grew up? I understand that Diaw was misused here. I understand that much of the fault was Woody's... But the fact that he threatened to walk out on his contract and go back to France made him expendable in my eyes. I would feel the same way about Shelden if he threatened to drop out of his contract and go back to Duke and assistant coach. I would feel the same about JJ if he threatened to sit out the rest of his contract and claim injury. Your illiterate a-- is hugging the nuts of a guy who claimed that he didn't want to play for our great franchise and would sabatoge our future by leaving. I was glad when we traded Diaw and there was NO looking back. Walter quit talking about how beautiful and Nice the girl was who dumped you on prom night and left with the QB of the team.

[Guest Walter]

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What does it matter if they immediately followed Diaw??...The fact of the matter is this, these guys were picked after Diaw. Period.

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Uh, that's my point. Diaw was picked a year earlier than Chill and JS, so to suggest Diaw shouldn't have been drafted because of our Sf log jam was idiotic. We didn't have a Sf log jam when we drafted Diaw. He WAS a need pick.

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ON draft night, you wasn't a squawker but many of us wanted Howard (ACC Player of the year).

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"By many of us" you don't seem to include yourself. Diesel, the master of the 3rd person, doesn't include himself when he has a chance?!? Not a chance. Diesel, I even wanted Howard and said so. In fact, we thought the same regarding him. Here is your thought on him:

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I think Howard is good if we want a SF. I don't think he has the speed, Shot, or ball handling of a SG. Because of that, I label him as late first, early Second.

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I too thought we should get Howard with our early 2nd rd pick. Didn't happen. I also pushed hard to trade up for Wade. Man, I wish we had managed that. I thought a JT, Wade backcourt would have been special. Oh well.

Here was my notion on Howard BTW.

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Depending upon who Big Hog was traded for, Josh Howard. Don't forget foreign player bargains.

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By foreign player bargains I was including Diaw.

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To say that Diaw was the best possible pick at 21 is BS and you know it. Especially when there's a gang of guys late first and 2nd round that was better.

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I never said he was the best possible pick. I said he at his relative position was a better pick than MW, JC, or SW at their relative position. 6 duds were passed following Diaw. 6 studs were passed immediately following Chill, JS, MW. How hard is that to comprehend?

W

[Guest Walter]

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What's wrong Walter, there were no RIF programs in Pigpicken NC when you grew up? I understand that Diaw was misused here. I understand that much of the fault was Woody's... But the fact that he threatened to walk out on his contract and go back to France made him expendable in my eyes.

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I guess we should expend him too. SW also. Certainly what was done to Diaw was worse than whta was done to either player.

W

[Diesel]

Two totally different issues.

I'm saying that Diaw was picked in a year that the draft was much stronger than these other guys (Shelden, Chillz). You harp on who BK didn't pick in years of a weaker draft. However, you look at it a totally different way in a strong draft? Why are you so inconsistent? Don't answer, I know why... You have an agenda..

Then you go into your ad hominem when somebody disagrees with your agenda on a logical basis...

Thanks for playing Walter...

Your game is over.