Paul Milsap is just better than Shelden Williams..

[gsuteke]

As long as the Hawks get Indy's pick I can see a little light at the end of the tunnel.

[gutz]

TexasPeter and Walter just have no clue man. They actually think they know basketball. It's hilarious. I agree with everything you said in your post about Shelden and ESPECIALLY MILLSAP. He is very soft and marshmellow like. Puffy face and weak! Millsap will NEVER start on any team in the NBA. Shelden could actually start for any team just not the Hawks because we already have 100 forwards. Again that is BK's fault not Shelden.

[gsuteke]

How can you "ignore" and respond directly [Re: gsuteke]

#215034 - 05/14/07 12:37 PM Edit Reply Quote

*** You are ignoring this user ***

Edited by Walter (05/14/07 12:39 PM)

read it again Captain Spam. you'll figure it out.

[coachx]

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if Gutz had seen the Hawks play let's say 25 times do you realize that you would have had to have watched 304 seasons of Hawks basketball for that statement to be true?

Shelden's PT was a Woodson issue over a Shelden issue. he looked like he was every bit of a 5th pick early on.

It's too soon to write off the Shelden selection as a mistake. give him a couple of years in the league to show a legitimate sample size to base an opinion on.

Now Marvin Williams........ that sucker better show us something next year. The honeymoon is over.

I would like to see a thread predicated on the subject of team building. it seems like there's alot of player bashing going on around here.

let's examine some of the cause and effect scenarios of these individual decisions, like trading for Joe Johnson to be the PG. how would that have played out if the Hawks had drafted someone like Paul or Deron?

to be fair and balanced it seems to me that if you are going to complain about a decision such as drafting Marvin over Deron please be fair enough to consider the possibility that the Joe trade may not have been swung as a result.

Subsequently this would have affected last year's draft as SG (Roy) may have been a position that made sense at #5.

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Are you kidding me? Are you suggesting that if "team building" were the standard, we should be somehow grateful for the team building we have done?

Man you are F'd up. "Fair and balanced" my arse. You cannot under any circumstance defend this horrible ownership, GM, and coach under the notion of "team building" They have [censored] up team building more than they have the 3 lottery picks. You can't defend it UNLESS you are captain ASG.

W

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Its the same story every day.

Realize that everyone is entitled to their opinion and everyones opinion is never going to be the same. If you have fun beating your dead horse every day have at it.

No name calling is necessary if some fans choose to believe that injuries plaid a big part in the teams final record. The name calling may make YOU feel better but all the emotion only lessens your leverage.

The majority of the board was expecting 35 to 37 wins last year. The Hawks ended up with 30 wins while having the 2nd most games missed to injury in the league behind only the Clippers. Any coincidence as to why neither team made the playoffs? I don't see how a rational mind gets so bent out of shape.

The PG injuries killed us. JJ and Smoove showed much improvement to their games. Marvin improved marginally. The is reason for optimism.

[Guest Walter]

THAT was Milsap's TENDEX per48.

SW?

19.19.

D@MN that's falling off a cliff.

W

[Popeye]

I think that Shelden will be a good Nba starter at PF, but i don't think it will be with Hawks. A lot of people can't accept that this was Shelden's rookie year. Everybody thought he would be ready from the get go and that's what i thought as well, but he will needs some time.

[Diesel]

I don't think our light has anything to do with the draft. (Unless we can get Oden)...

The way I see it, with 11, we may can affect the team in 2010 but there will be sweeping changes before then.

I think what's more relevant is:

1. Speedy's health and future plans.

2. What can we get for Lo, AJ, and Lue?

3. JJ's health.

4. What will we do with Smoove?

5. Between Marvin, Shelden, and Childress who's going?

[Guest Walter]

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How can you "ignore" and respond directly [Re: gsuteke]

#215034 - 05/14/07 12:37 PM Edit Reply Quote

*** You are ignoring this user ***

Edited by Walter (05/14/07 12:39 PM)

read it again Captain Spam. you'll figure it out.

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No need to start now, particularly when the lame excuses are flowing like a river. You like ignore, so use it. You've so proudly used it in the past. Like a badge of BK and ASG honor. They don't listen to reason so why should you.

W

[Diesel]

I don't think he needs "some time". I think he played well at times... in more than just one quarter or one game. I think more importantly, he will need some better coaching. I honestly think that Woody doesn't really have a system that is suitable for young players. I hear Woody get praise for young player development, however, the truth is how do we know that these guys wouldn't do better under somebody else. Woody's rotations and Matchups are just horrid. Plus, he doesn't play to his teams' strength.

I've been watching Sloan vs. Nellie.

This is a chess matchup. Two coaches who made their teams over acheive and one will make it to the WCF. You have to appluad.

[gsuteke]

I've never ignored anyone. [Re: gsuteke]

#215045 - 05/14/07 12:47 PM Edit Reply Quote

*** You are ignoring this user ***

Eliminating pointless sources of negative energy in one's life makes the world a much more enjoyable place in which to live.

[Packfill]

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Milsap can actually move on the court. He can put the ball on the floor and he has a good mid range jumper.

The point about SW being a better college player is just stupid. Great college players fail in the league all the time. Duke has a track record of busts in the league. At the very least a lot of their players do not reach the hype they had in college.

Milsap was a beast in college. I believe he led the nation in rebounding. He has a motor that SW can only dream about. Sloan would never trade Milsap for SW...NEVER. And since he actually knows what he is doing, unlike around this forsaken franchise, I would take his opinion over BK's or Gutz.

BTW, Gutz, I have seen the Hawks play 1000x more than you have. If SW were any good this lousy team would have played him more. The scrub couldn't even play for the HAWKS!!!

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if Gutz had seen the Hawks play let's say 25 times do you realize that you would have had to have watched 304 seasons of Hawks basketball for that statement to be true?

Shelden's PT was a Woodson issue over a Shelden issue. he looked like he was every bit of a 5th pick early on.

It's too soon to write off the Shelden selection as a mistake. give him a couple of years in the league to show a legitimate sample size to base an opinion on.

Now Marvin Williams........ that sucker better show us something next year. The honeymoon is over.

I would like to see a thread predicated on the subject of team building. it seems like there's alot of player bashing going on around here.

let's examine some of the cause and effect scenarios of these individual decisions, like trading for Joe Johnson to be the PG. how would that have played out if the Hawks had drafted someone like Paul or Deron?

to be fair and balanced it seems to me that if you are going to complain about a decision such as drafting Marvin over Deron please be fair enough to consider the possibility that the Joe trade may not have been swung as a result.

Subsequently this would have affected last year's draft as SG (Roy) may have been a position that made sense at #5.

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I am going to get flamed for this but I honestly don't think the Hawks would be worse off if the JJ trade does not go down.

Basically, if the trade is not contemplated maybe that is enough for BK to pull the trigger on a point guard over Marvin. So pencil in Deron or Paul. That leaves a big hole at shooting guard right? So instead of Sheldon the Hawks pick Roy. A Deron/Roy backcourt has a ton of potential and is preferable to a ?????/JJ backcourt. Yes JJ is the best player mentioned here, but Roy has just as much potential and then when you add in a future all-star like Williams or Deng you are set in the backcourt for years.

Forward is still ably maned by Smoove, Childress, Diaw and whomever else.

[BusBoyIsBack]

Player A will will have a head and shoulders better career than Player B because of their rookie season.

Typical Hawks fan logic.

[Packfill]

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Player A will will have a head and shoulders better career than Player B because of their rookie season.

Typical Hawks fan logic.

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What are you talking about?

[gutz]

Saying that Millsap will have a better career than Shelden based solely on their rookie years is the typical basketball logic of TexasPeter and Walter. Makes tons of sense right?

[Packfill]

I never said that. I do think they are similar players though.

Plus, this is a stupid argument. Utah is getting contributions in the playoffs from a rookie selected in the second round. That is a bargin. Sheldon was a four year starter and a high lottery selection so he ought to be a better from day 1 going forward. Remember, Sheldon was not drafted to be a project - he was adverstised as game ready. Hopefully it was just the injury and poor coaching that limited Sheldon as a rookie.

I don't see how anyone can argue that Utah is not getting better value at this point.

[Johnnybravo4]

Dirk wasn't exactly a stud his first year.

[gutz]

No one is denying Utah is getting good value with Millsap. That is common sense but to say Millsap is CLEARLY better than Shelden like TexasPeter and Walter say is just ridiculous!

[Johnnybravo4]

It is basically our argument against the Bucks with Zaza and Bogut.

[TexasPete]

Gutz and Bus...the blind leading the blind. First, forget the rookie stuff between Milsap and SW. It's not about being one rookie vs. another. It's about productivity on the basketball court. Milsap is more active and plays better defense and that is in addition to putting up better numbers on both ends of the court.

Did you ever notice how guys like Milsap just happen to always be around the ball? SW cannot move well on the court at this level. Milsap moves very well and he plays damn good defense. The dirty little secret why SW didn't play as much is because he can't guard a statue. That isn't going to change, rookie or not, because it is based on a physical limitation. Sorry to burst your bubble.

EDS, you make a great point about the JJ trade. First, we don't even have another SG on the team. People talk about PG? We don't have a backup to JJ. No, Chill is not a SG, that is garbage. There is no true 2 on the hawks except JJ. I would take a Deron/Roy backcourt over a JJ/Lue or JJ/AJ one all day. ALL DAMN DAY!!!

I love JJ. But that Deron and Roy combo would do damage for years. We have ZERO starting PG's and ZERO backup SG's. Damn, who is the jackass that is putting this deal together? Aught to be fired...

[Packfill]

The key here is that Milsap is contributing for a playoff team. Sheldon was a non-factor for a bottom feeder. So as of right now I don't see how you can argue that Milsap hasn't made a more valuable contribution to date.