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Hoford & Conley ay #3 / no one else to consider ?

coachx

By coachx
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oiatlhawksfan Newbie

oiatlhawksfan

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It's amazing how you guys try to bash everybody, just to make Conley look good, I mean I can understand Wright, but Horford, everything yall said bad about Wright Horford can do, he's big, can shoot 15 footers, can put the ball on the floor, is 6'10, but you guys still find a way to bash him. I wonder if we had the #1 pick, and had a chance to get Oden, you Conley supporter would probably be bashing him to.

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oiatlhawksfan Newbie

oiatlhawksfan

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Wilcox is a pure athlete, Horford is a post player bad comparison! We need post scorers, and Horford brings that, we can get a PG at 11, but what we can't get is a post player as good as Horford.

Name a player that resembles Horford more than Wilcox. Wilcox likes to float on the perimeter also, but when he's in the post his game is very similar to Horford's. Let's not act like Horford is Tim Duncan. His game is based on his athleticism, just like Wilcox.

I'll stop when you guys stop think Conley's the next Chris Paul, or better than Deron Williams when he came out.

Al Jefferson is a better comparison.
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AtLaS Mentor

AtLaS

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Horfords college numbers are weak compared to Shelden's and we saw what happened to Shelden.

Ex that's a horrible comparison and you know it.

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There are plenty of full sized centers who should be available, Seatle has 3, Prz, Haywood, Daly could probably be had. I have listed them a few times already.

I've always liked Daly and would still love to get him, but I don't see our ownership wanting to pay him 11 million a year. Horford will be 10x better than Heywood and Pryz, neither of whom are worth the #11 pick. If we trade the #11 for one of those 2, we better unload Speedy.

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Bottom line is that Horford isn't a center. He is basically the same size as Smith without the crazy vertical.

I'd probably rather get Conley as well, but there are many examples of successful Horford-sized athletes that play center in the NBA.

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Lascar78 Newbie

Lascar78

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way to avoid the question. Who does Horford resemble the most if he's nothing like Wilcox?

You need to learn how to read. I'm not bashing Horford. Look at what I said

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I REALLY like Horford, and he is made to shine in the NBA. But he is a PF through and through and we don't need another one.

It's not about whether Horford can play, it's about whether we have room / need for him when there is a desperate need that we can fill.

Our future at PF: Josh Smith, Shelden Williams, Marvin (part time), Solomon Jones (part time).

Our future at PG: *crickets*

That is why I take the best damn PG.

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Lascar78 Newbie

Lascar78

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I'll stop when you guys stop think Conley's the next Chris Paul, or better than Deron Williams when he came out.

Who is this "you guys"? I don't think that Conley's the next Chris Paul or better than Deron. I think he is the best PG in this draft and can be our long time starter.

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Lascar78 Newbie

Lascar78

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Lascar, I have a question for you because you know BK a little and go down there a lot.

Do you honestly believe the stuff about Wright be a strong candidate for us at 3?

If you had to bet your life, who would you bet BK would take?

First of all I don't know BK that much and the last time I talked to him was the last season ticket holders' meeting in 05-06. So I have no inside scoop.

My gut feeling is that BK understands that we need a PG BADLY. I think we will definitely draft a PG, but he might think that Critt at 11 is the best bet and allows us to take a top talent at 3. I would not be surprised by Horford/Critt, Conley/Noah (or Hawes), or Yi/Critt. I think he might love B Wright's game but isn't foolish enough to draft a pure project like that. He's looking to fill needs now, as shown by the Shelden pick. The ownership wants him to fill needs.

Honestly, I'm assuming that there's a 0% chance of us taking Wright, but if we do I'm going to blow up somewhere.

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coachx Newbie

coachx

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Wilcox is a pure athlete, Horford is a post player bad comparison! We need post scorers, and Horford brings that, we can get a PG at 11, but what we can't get is a post player as good as Horford.

Name a player that resembles Horford more than Wilcox. Wilcox likes to float on the perimeter also, but when he's in the post his game is very similar to Horford's. Let's not act like Horford is Tim Duncan. His game is based on his athleticism, just like Wilcox.

Carlos Boozer. Only Boozer is probably slightly shorter and slightly slower and less athletic. Hoford is better shot blocker than Boozer which will alow him to play center. Bozzer is the guy that plays vs. the Tim Duncan's of the world, not Okur. Okur just hangs out around the perimeter so Boozer is essential their center with AK47 being their shot blocker.

Hmmmmm.... AK47 / Boozer is awful close to Hoford / Smith.
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exodus Newbie

exodus

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but there are many examples of successful Horford-sized athletes that play center in the NBA.

Such as?

Amare has a standing reach of 9'1" and plays on a fast break team and has a higher vert. Ben Wallace bench presses 400 pounds. Horford isn't comparable to either.

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Lascar78 Newbie

Lascar78

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Carlos Boozer. Only Boozer is probably slightly shorter and slightly slower and less athletic. Hoford is better shot blocker than Boozer which will alow him to play center. Bozzer is the guy that plays vs. the Tim Duncan's of the world, not Okur. Okur just hangs out around the perimeter so Boozer is essential their center with AK47 being their shot blocker.

Hmmmmm.... AK47 / Boozer is awful close to Hoford / Smith.

I might agree on Boozer when he first came into the league. Now he actually does most of his damage from the perimeter hitting those high arching jumpers. But anyhow, you're making my point, which is that just like Boozer, Horford is a PF. He plays 90% at the PF, and 10% at C when Okur needs a breather. Horford will be the same. If you absolutely have to put him at C for a quick spell, you can, but he's a PF through and through.

Remove Deron from the Jazz and put Boozer at C, and you'll see quite different results.

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exodus Newbie

exodus

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Chris Bosh 6'10 235

Theo Ratliff was solid and he was 6'10

Okafor 6'10 255

AL jefferson 6'10 246

just to name a few.

Name me a 19 year old PG, who couldn't shoot and has been successful in the NBA, without and superstars playing with him.

Bosh got killed playing center. They didn't start winning until they got Rasho.

Ratliff had a longer reach, higher vertical.

Okafor and Jefferson has standing reaches 3 inches higher than Horford.

Try again.

As far as 19 yr old pgs there just haven't been many in general. However Conley is a natural pg. Horford is a natural 4 that you are trying to turn into a c to justify picking him.

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Lascar78 Newbie

Lascar78

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Chris Bosh 6'10 235

Raps were bad when Bosh tried playing C, improved when he moved to PF. Also I am amazed that these teams with undersized Centers are not doing so well! What a stunning development! I mean sure the Raps got it together with the new coach when Bosh went back to PF, but overall the Bobcats, Celtics, and Raps might have the worst combined record over the past couple of years of any teams other than us.

Meanwhile teams with guys like Zydrunas and Duncan/Elson are in the finals. Shocking!

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Name me a 19 year old PG, who couldn't shoot and has been successful in the NBA, without and superstars playing with him.

Virtually no players are successful without stars around them. However Tony Parker was the youngest PG to lead a team to a championship, and much like Conley he was a lightning fast guy with no outside shot.

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coachx Newbie

coachx

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Chris Bosh 6'10 235

[/indent]

Raps were bad when Bosh tried playing C, improved when he moved to PF. Also I am amazed that these teams with undersized Centers are not doing so well! What a stunning development! I mean sure the Raps got it together with the new coach when Bosh went back to PF, but overall the Bobcats, Celtics, and Raps might have the worst combined record over the past couple of years of any teams other than us.

Meanwhile teams with guys like Zydrunas and Duncan/Elson are in the finals. Shocking!

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Lascar78 Newbie

Lascar78

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We can debate this to death, I'll leave it at this. I feel 100% confident that Horford is a pure PF in the NBA. A typical, tough, post-loving PF. That's why they call them POWER forwards, before some of them started falling in love with the perimeter. I'm sure Karl Malone could have bullied a lot of centers too, but he was a PF. I know Horford would be a better C than Zaza, but that tells me nothing.

I believe we can get the long term solution to successfully start at PG at #3 in Conley.

I don't believe we can get the long term solution to successfully start at C at #3 in Horford or anyone else.

I don't draft a guy #3 when it leaves me only with the options of:

-having him compete with 4 of our 5 most talented young guys for forward minutes

-playing him out of position

If you draft Horford, you MUST trade some of our other young forwards.

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coachx Newbie

coachx

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Carlos Boozer. Only Boozer is probably slightly shorter and slightly slower and less athletic. Hoford is better shot blocker than Boozer which will alow him to play center. Bozzer is the guy that plays vs. the Tim Duncan's of the world, not Okur. Okur just hangs out around the perimeter so Boozer is essential their center with AK47 being their shot blocker.

Since Boozer isn't a shotblocker, saying that Horford is better doesn't say much at all. And Boozer was not the one playing Duncan, it was Okur. The whole series when Okur wasn't in foul trouble he handled Duncan the best I think I have ever seen someone play him because he used his body and played great position defense.

Then it took Okur all of 2 minutes to get in and stay in foul trouble b/c every time I looked it was Boozer on Duncan.
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