Agree or Disagree 4.

[DJlaysitup]

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...I have never liked Camby as a prospect for our center. Just to damn skinny...

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Personally, I have no problem with skinny but strong and athletic centers if they are 7-footers....especially if you have strong guys around them. In the future a frontline of Noah-Shelden-Smoove shouldn't have much trouble in the paint. That's in the future. Noah will not come in and be our starting center IMO...nor would Horford. Zaza will keep the position for a couple years unless we make a veteran upgrade.

Does anybody even know if Horford wants to play center in the NBA? He may prefer to be a PF.

[Buzzard]

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In the future a frontline of Noah-Shelden-Smoove shouldn't have much trouble in the paint.

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Then JJ and whoever we have playing the point is going to have to put up 50 pts a game because those three are going to be doing good if they can account for 35...

Give me Horford, MWill, and Smoove. More agile and and explosive...

[Diesel]

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The only proof I can offer is the games he played and where he played them at=center. While Noah was drawing the easier assignment at the 4.

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Yes, he played in the center of their zone YET Noah got more blocks, more steals, and almost as many defensive rebounds as he?? If you don't know much about basketball Buzzard, when you sit in the center of the zone, you should have more blocks & rebounds than somebody playing wing UNLESS the somebody playing wing is a phenomenal help defender.

The origin of this "debate" that you have entered into was asking who is a better defender than Noah aside from Oden. I got answers like COnley Jr, Brewer, and Horford. Now, I should have specified position but seeing that Horford plays interchangeably at the center of the zone or Pf, then this is the comparison. And somebody went on to say "Easily Horford". Come on, is it that Jaywalker just comes here and says it and you guys drink the kool-aid in believing? No offense to Jay, I admire him, but I watch too much college basketball to be led astray in believing that Horford is a great defensive player or a great offensive specimen. Horford will be another bad pick if we took him 3rd.

[Buzzard]

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who is a better defender than Noah aside from Oden

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Diesel you have to do the comparison by position. Oden is the best defender in this draft at the center position. I think Horford is the 2nd best defender at the center position.

Noah might be the best defender at the pf position but no way is he a better defender than Horford at the center position...

[Diesel]

That might be.

But at the same time, I don't think Horford's defense at Center will translate into the pros, whereas I believe Noah's defense will translate better.

[coachx]

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Joakim Noah:

Blocks Last 2 years: 95, 77.

Steals Last 2 years: 44, 45.

Defensive rebs Last 2 years: 193, 235.

Offensive rebs Last 2 years: 85, 102.

Al Horford:

Blocks Last 2 years: 68, 70.

Steals Last 2 years: 40, 28.

Defensive rebs Last 2 years: 209, 264.

Offensive rebs Last 2 years: 86, 96.

It's a shame that people believe that Al Horford is a better defensive player than Joakim Noah. The truth is that in defensive categories, Joakim Noah trumps Horford badly... The numbers prove it.

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Stat line do not tell the whole story.

Hoford is the better position defender. He can bange with the big strong guys in the post.

His standing reach is taller then Noah.

No dont they are both good post defenders.

This is what matters to the Hawks. Which player will mesh the best with Josh Smith. In my opinion that is Hoford b/c he can body up the opppositions best post scorer and let Smoove come over for help defense.

[DavidSomerset]

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No my problem is wasting the 3rd pick of the draft.

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You don't want to waste the #3 pick, but you advocate taking Yi??!?!!?!?

That'd be the biggest waste of the #3 pick!!

[gsuteke]

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No my problem is wasting the 3rd pick of the draft.

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You don't want to waste the #3 pick, but you advocate taking Yi??!?!!?!?

That'd be the biggest waste of the #3 pick!!

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[AtLaS]

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Joakim Noah:

Blocks Last 2 years: 95, 77.

Steals Last 2 years: 44, 45.

Defensive rebs Last 2 years: 193, 235.

Offensive rebs Last 2 years: 85, 102.

Al Horford:

Blocks Last 2 years: 68, 70.

Steals Last 2 years: 40, 28.

Defensive rebs Last 2 years: 209, 264.

Offensive rebs Last 2 years: 86, 96.

It's a shame that people believe that Al Horford is a better defensive player than Joakim Noah. The truth is that in defensive categories, Joakim Noah trumps Horford badly... The numbers prove it.

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Stat line do not tell the whole story.

Hoford is the better position defender. He can bange with the big strong guys in the post.

His standing reach is taller then Noah.

No dont they are both good post defenders.

This is what matters to the Hawks. Which player will mesh the best with Josh Smith. In my opinion that is Hoford b/c he can body up the opppositions best post scorer and let Smoove come over for help defense.

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Not only that, it's funny that Diesel uses the stats from the last "2 years" instead of what happened this past year. He's one of the biggest Acie Law fans on this board, but if you used Acie's last 2 years stats (Acie was horrible until his senior year) he would discredit them.

[Diesel]

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Stat line do not tell the whole story.

Hoford is the better position defender. He can bange with the big strong guys in the post.

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This being the case, we have a guy named Shelden who can already do that.

Statlines, might not tell the whole story, but they tell a lot. Namely, Noah is on the wing, but he still blocks more shots than Horford... He still gets more steals than Horford... He still gets more offensive rebounds than Horford and he gets almost as many defensive rebounds as Horford. I don't know how much weight Noah can put on his frame, but it's evident to anybody who has watched Florida that Noah has better footwork than Horford. Horford may be stronger, but strength isn't enough to qualify one for 3rd pick in this draft.

[Diesel]

Were they not the NCAA champions for the last 2 years?

If I wanted to make Horford look bad purposely I would have used stats from the last 3 yrs. Think about it.. back when Horford was a 5.5, 6.5 guy. I took stats from when these guys were at an elite level...

[AtLaS]

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Were they not the NCAA champions for the last 2 years?

If I wanted to make Horford look bad purposely I would have used stats from the last 3 yrs. Think about it.. back when Horford was a 5.5, 6.5 guy. I took stats from when these guys were at an elite level...

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Horford had less points, rebounds, assists, FGA, FT%, and slightly less blocks last season. Everyone knows Noah had a great year last year, and especially in the tourney. Noah actually regressed this season while Horford improved and became undoubtedly the better overall player.

My only point is that I could probably compare Dominic James' last 2 years of stats compared to Acie's last 2 years, and Dominic would probably look better, or at least as good.

I just don't think looking at past season's stats tells a good story of a players performance because players improve every year, and we should only evaluate the most recent production.

[Diesel]

It's 2 championship seasons...

So basically what you're saying is that you want to focus on only the good about Horford.

Now let me ask you, do you think Noah really regressed, or did his role change?

OK, sense you want to look at it that way.

Noah still had MORE BLOCKS, MORE STEALS, MORE OFFENSIVE REBOUNDS in a year when he had regressed...

There.

[AtLaS]

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Noah still had MORE BLOCKS, MORE STEALS, MORE OFFENSIVE REBOUNDS in a year when he had regressed...

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They had the same amount of blocks, and Horford was the better rebounder. Noah had .4 more steals, which really isn't even that important for a big man, and that difference is miniscule.