NBA Centers: A Statistical Look

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Here is a statistical snapshot of the centers around the league. I’m using nba.com and 82games.com for these numbers. We’ll look at the 4 statistical categories that are most important at the center spot: scoring, FG%, rebounding, and blocks.

According to nba.com, the guys listed in these first set of numbers almost exclusively played center for their respective teams. Even though some in this list can be considered PFs, they mainly played the C spot. Some big names are omitted in this list, but I’ll get to them later. When I add those guys, it’ll give you a pretty good look at the “centers” around the league, whether they be “true centers” or “power forwards masquerading as centers”. I’ll also give you the center’s measurements, along with the respective stat in each category.

Top 11 in scoring amongst centers per game in the NBA ( courtesy of nba.com )

( 7-6 . . 310 lb ) Yao Ming – 25 ppg

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Tim Duncan – 20 ppg

( 6-11 . . 263 lb ) Mehmet Okur – 17.6 ppg

( 7-1 . . 325 lb ) Shaq – 17.2 ppg

( 7-0 . . 250 lb ) Mark Blount – 12.3 ppg

( 7-0 . . 245 lb ) Andrew Bogut – 12.3 ppg

( 6-11 . . 280 lb ) ZaZa Pachulia – 12.2 ppg ( surprised? )

( 7-3 . . 260 lb ) Z. Ilgauskas – 11.9 ppg

( 6-11 . . 235 lb ) Marcus Camby – 11.2 ppg

( 6-11 . . 250 lb ) Sam Dalembert – 10.7 ppg

( 7-0 . . 265 lb ) Chris Kaman – 10.1 ppg

( NOTE: These are the ONLY guys that scored in double figures of guys who were listed as centers by nba.com in the scoring category. )

Top 10 centers in FG% in the NBA + the FG% of guys in the top 10 in scoring who aren’t in the top 10 FG% overall ( courtesy of nba.com and 82games.com )

I’ll only list the guys who get at least 20 minutes a night at center.

( 6-11 . . 265 lb ) Erick Dampier – 62.6% . . ( 67% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 223 lb ) Mikki Moore – 60.9% . . ( 79% of shots are assisted )

( 7-1. . 325 lb ) Shaq O’Neal – 59.1% . . ( 49% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 240 lb ) Steven Hunter – 57.7% . . ( 71% of shots are assisted )

( 6-10 . . 261 lb ) Alonzo Mourning – 56% FG . . ( 66% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 275 lb ) Andrew Bynum – 55.8% FG . . ( 66% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 263 lb ) Brendan Haywood – 55.8% FG . . ( 51% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 245 lb ) Andrew Bogut – 55.3% FG . . ( 55% of shots are assisted )

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Tim Duncan – 54.6% FG . . ( 46% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 255 lb ) Rasho Nesterovic – 54.6% FG . . ( 78% of shots are assisted )

Top 10 scorers who aren’t in top 10 FG%:

( 6-11 . . 250 lb ) Sam Dalembert – 54.1% FG . . ( 68% of shots are assisted )

( 7-6 . . 310 lb ) Yao Ming – 51.6% FG . . ( 67% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 250 lb ) Mark Blount – 50.9% FG . . ( 83% of shots are assisted )

( 7-3 . . 260 lb ) Z. Ilgauskas – 48.5% FG . . ( 66% of shots are assisted )

( 6-11 . . 280 lb ) ZaZa Pachulia – 47.4% FG . . ( 56% of shots are assisted )

( 6-11 . . 235 lb ) Marcus Camby – 47.3% FG . . ( 60% of shots are assisted )

( 6-11 . . 263 lb ) Mehmet Okur – 46.2% FG . . ( 74% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 265 lb ) Chris Kaman – 45.1% FG . . ( 62% of shots are assisted )

Top 11 rebounding centers per game in NBA ( courtesy of NBA.com )

( 6-11 . . 235 lb ) Marcus Camby – 11.7 per game

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Tim Duncan – 10.6

( 7-6 . . 310 lb ) Yao Ming – 9.4

( 6-11 . . 250 lb ) Sam Dalembert – 8.9

( 7-0 . . 245 lb ) Andrew Bogut – 8.8

( 7-0 . . 265 lb ) Chris Kaman – 7.8

( 7-3 . . 260 lb ) Z. Ilgauskas – 7.7

( 6-11 . . 265 lb ) Erick Dampier – 7.4

( 7-1. . 325 lb ) Shaq O’Neal – 7.4

( 6-11 . . 263 lb ) Mehmet Okur – 7.2

( 6-11 . . 280 lb ) ZaZa Pachulia – 6.9

Top 10 in blocks per game amongst centers in NBA ( courtesy of NBA.com and 82games.com )

( 6-11 . . 235 lb ) Marcus Camby – 3.3 blks . . block rating: 13.8

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Tim Duncan – 2.4 blks . . block rating: 11.3

( 6-10 . . 261 lb ) Alonzo Mourning – 2.3 blks . . block rating: 18.6

( 7-6 . . 310 lb ) Yao Ming – 2.0 blks . . block rating: 8.9

( 6-11 . . 250 lb ) Sam Dalembert – 1.9 blks . . block rating: 10.3

( 7-0 . . 275 lb ) Andrew Bynum – 1.6 blks . . block rating: 10.0

( 7-1 . . 255 lb ) Joel Przybilla – 1.6 blks . . block rating: 18.9

( 7-0 . . 265 lb ) Chris Kaman – 1.55 blks . . block rating: 8.8

( 7-0 . . 280 lb ) DeSagana Diop – 1.4 blks . . block rating: 12.0

( 7-1. . 325 lb ) Shaq O’Neal – 1.4 blks . . block rating: 7.3

NOW . . LET’S LOOK AT SOMETHING ELSE . .

Let’s now add some of the league’s Power Forwards who also see a lot of time at center for their teams. Some of these guys are listed as F/C, instead of being given the distinction of being a “true” center. Guys that I add in each category are in bold

( courtesy of nba.com and 82games.com )

NOTE: 82games.com has a tendency to mess up where a guy plays as far as position. So if I see in their 5-man roster a guy who is out of place, I won’t count him, if they’re giving him a lot of floor time in his “un-natural” position. We all know this is the case with Marvin vs Smoove at Power Forward. Smoove is almost always at the 4, when playing with Marvin. But Elton Brand, for example, played about ½ the time at both PF and C according to 82games.com. When you look at their 5-man units, you’ll see that whenever Brand played C, Thomas and Maggette were the forwards. And they played quite a bit of “small-ball” this year. So I’ll list Brand in this group of PFs who see a lot of time at center. His true time at center is probably closer to 35% - 40%, than the almost split floor time numbers that they give. The rest of these guys easily play ½ of the game at the center spot.

( 7-6 . . 310 lb ) Yao Ming – 25 ppg

( 6-10 . . 230 lb ) Chris Bosh – 22.6 ppg

( 7-0 . . 260 lb ) Pau Gasol – 20.8 ppg

( 6-8 . . 254 lb ) Elton Brand – 20.5 ppg

( 6-10 . . 245 lb ) Amare Stoudamire – 20.4 ppg

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Tim Duncan – 20 ppg

( 6-11 . . 285 lb ) Eddy Curry – 19.5 ppg ( nba.com has him listed as a C/F )

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Jermaine O’Neal – 19.4 ppg

( 6-11 . . 263 lb ) Mehmet Okur – 17.6 ppg

( 6-11 . . 265 lb ) Dwight Howard – 17.6 ppg

Others:

( 7-1 . . 325 lb ) Shaq – 17.2 ppg

( 7-0 . . 250 lb ) Mark Blount – 12.3 ppg

( 7-0 . . 245 lb ) Andrew Bogut – 12.3 ppg

( 6-11 . . 280 lb ) ZaZa Pachulia – 12.2 ppg

( 7-3 . . 260 lb ) Z. Ilgauskas – 11.9 ppg

( 6-11 . . 235 lb ) Marcus Camby – 11.2 ppg

( 6-11 . . 250 lb ) Sam Dalembert – 10.7 ppg

( 7-0 . . 265 lb ) Chris Kaman – 10.1 ppg

Kind of changes things, doesn’t it?

OK, let’s look at FG%. Once again, I’m not listing guys who see limited amount of time. They need to at least get 20 minutes a game.

( 6-11 . . 265 lb ) Erick Dampier – 62.6% . . ( 67% of shots are assisted )

( 7-1 . . 235 lb ) Tyson Chandler – 62.4% FG . . ( 47% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 223 lb ) Mikki Moore – 60.9% . . ( 79% of shots are assisted )

( 6-11 . . 265 lb ) Dwight Howard – 60.3% . . ( 56% of shots are assisted )

( 6-11 . . 245 lb ) Andris Biedrins – 59.9% . . ( 71% of shots are assisted )

( 6-11 . . 270 lb ) Kwame Brown – 59.1% . . ( 63% of shots are assisted )

( 7-1. . 325 lb ) Shaq O’Neal – 59.1% . . ( 49% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 240 lb ) Steven Hunter – 57.7% . . ( 71% of shots are assisted )

( 6-11 . . 285 )Eddy Curry – 57.6% . . ( 65% of shots are assisted )

( 6-10 . . 245 lb ) Amare Stoudamire – 57.5% . . ( 65% of shtos are assisted )

Others:

( 6-10 . . 261 lb ) Alonzo Mourning – 56% FG . . ( 66% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 275 lb ) Andrew Bynum – 55.8% FG . . ( 66% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 263 lb ) Brendan Haywood – 55.8% FG . . ( 51% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 245 lb ) Andrew Bogut – 55.3% FG . . ( 55% of shots are assisted )

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Tim Duncan – 54.6% FG . . ( 46% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 255 lb ) Rasho Nesterovic – 54.6% FG . . ( 78% of shots are assisted )

( 7-0 . . 260 lb ) Pau Gasol – 53.8% FG . . ( 52% of shots are assisted )

Rebounding?

( 7-1 . . 235 lb ) Tyson Chandler – 12.4 per game

( 6-11 . . 265 lb ) Dwight Howard – 12.3

( 6-11 . . 235 lb ) Marcus Camby – 11.7

( 6-10 . . 252 lb ) Emeka Okafor – 11.3

( 6-10 . . 256 lb ) Al Jefferson – 11.0

( 6-10 . . 230 lb ) Chris Bosh – 10.7

( 6-9 . . 240 lb ) Ben Wallace – 10.7

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Tim Duncan – 10.6

( 7-0 . . 260 lb ) Pau Gasol – 9.8

( 6-10 . . 245 lb ) Amare Stoudamire – 9.6

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Jermaine O’Neal – 9.6

Others:

( 7-6 . . 310 lb ) Yao Ming – 9.4

( 6-11 . . 245 lb ) Andris Biedrins – 9.3

( 6-8 . . 254 lb ) Elton Brand – 9.3

( 6-11 . . 250 lb ) Sam Dalembert – 8.9

( 7-0 . . 245 lb ) Andrew Bogut – 8.8

( 7-0 . . 265 lb ) Chris Kaman – 7.8

( 7-3 . . 260 lb ) Z. Ilgauskas – 7.7

( 6-11 . . 265 lb ) Erick Dampier – 7.4

( 7-1. . 325 lb ) Shaq O’Neal – 7.4

OK . . how about blocks?

( 6-11 . . 235 lb ) Marcus Camby – 3.3 blks . . block rating: 13.8

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Jermaine O’Neal – 2.6 blks . . block rating: 12.0

]( 6-10 . . 252 lb ) Emeka Okafor – 2.6 blks . . block rating: 13.1

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Tim Duncan – 2.4 blks . . block rating: 11.3

( 6-10 . . 261 lb ) Alonzo Mourning – 2.3 blks . . block rating: 18.6

( 6-8 . . 254 lb ) Elton Brand – 2.2 blks . . block rating: 8.4

( 7-0 . . 260 lb ) Pau Gasol – 2.1 blks . . block rating: 8.5

( 7-6 . . 310 lb ) Yao Ming – 2.0 blks . . block rating: 8.9

( 6-9 . . 240 lbs ) Ben Wallace – 2.0 blks . . block rating: 8.9

( 6-11 . . 265 lb ) Dwight Howard - 1.9 blks . . block rating: 8.3

( 6-11 . . 250 lb ) Sam Dalembert – 1.9 blks . . block rating: 10.3

Others:

( 7-1 . . 235 lb ) Tyson Chandler – 1.8 blks . . block rating: 7.5

( 6-11 . . 245 lb ) Andris Biedrins – 1.7 blks . . block rating: 7.0

( 7-0 . . 275 lb ) Andrew Bynum – 1.6 blks . . block rating: 10.0

( 7-1 . . 255 lb ) Joel Przybilla – 1.6 blks . . block rating: 18.9

( 7-0 . . 265 lb ) Chris Kaman – 1.55 blks . . block rating: 8.8

( 6-10 . . 256 lb ) Al Jefferson – 1.5 blks . . block rating: 7.2

( 7-1. . 325 lb ) Shaq O’Neal – 1.4 blks . . block rating: 7.3

Now you have a pretty good snapshot of the guys around the league . . except for one thing. How do they defend as far as limiting guys in the post? The only way we can look at this, is to use the stats that 82games.com gives us, about how an opponent shoots against another person. Since most of these players play either the 4 or the 5 spot, we can look at what guys give up on a per 48 minute basis.

I’ll look at the top guys who play center in this league, either full time or part time, and see how they defend the position, as far as eFG ( effective Field Goal %, which combines both regular and 3 point shots ) and iFG ( inside/close to basket FG% ) goes. The percentage numbers for guys who play both the 4 and the 5 may be off ( because of the mistakes that 82games.com may make in determining what position a guy is playing at that moment ), but they do give you an indication of how they defend at that position.

( 7-6 . . 310 lb ) Yao Ming: eFG – 44% . . iFG – 46%

( 6-10 . . 230 lb ) Chris Bosh: ( center only ) eFG – 52% . . iFG – 62%

( 7-0 . . 260 lb ) Pau Gasol: eFG – 54% . . iFG – 57%

( 6-8 . . 254 lb ) Elton Brand: ( center only ) eFG – 52% . . iFG – 56%

( 6-10 . . 245 lb ) Amare Stoudamire: eFG - 58% . . iFG – 54%

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Tim Duncan: ( center only ) eFG – 56% . . iFG – 52%

( 6-11 . . 285 lb ) Eddy Curry: ( center only ) eFG – 54% . . iFG – 52%

( 6-11 . . 260 lb ) Jermaine O’Neal: ( center only ) eFG – 47% . . iFG – 57%

( 6-11 . . 263 lb ) Mehmet Okur: eFG – 53% . . iFG – 61%

( 6-11 . . 265 lb ) Dwight Howard: eFG – 47% . . iFG – 54%

( 7-1 . . 325 lb ) Shaq O'Neal: eFG – 51% . . iFG – 51%

( 6-10 . . 256 lb ) Al Jefferson: ( center only ) eFG – 56% . . iFG – 58%

( 7-1 . . 235 lb ) Tyson Chandler: eFG – 54% . . iFG – 52%

( 7-0 . . 265 lb ) Chris Kaman: eFG – 49% . . iFG – 53%

( 6-11 . . 245 lb ) Andris Biedrins: eFG – 52% . . iFG – 55%

( 6-11 . . 250 lb ) Sam Dalembert: eFG - 51% . . iFG: 59%

( 6-9 . . 240 lbs ) Ben Wallace: eFG - 50% . . iFG: 57%

( 6-11 . . 235 lb ) Marcus Camby: eFG – 51% . . iFG: 60%

( 6-10 . . 252 lb ) Emeka Okafor: ( center only ) eFG – 50% . . iFG: 64% ( surprised? )

( 7-0 . . 245 lb ) Andrew Bogut: ( center only ) eFG – 55% . . iFG – 57%

( 7-3 . . 260 lb ) Z. Ilgauskas: eFG - 50% . . iFG – 55%

( 7-0 . . 275 lb ) Andrew Bynum: eFG – 51% . . iFG – 53%

( 6-11 . . 280 lb ) ZaZa Pachulia: eFG – 50% . . iFG – 63% ( not shocked by that at all )

( 7-0 . . 250 lb ) Mark Blount: eFG – 54% . . iFG – 56%

( 6-11 . . 265 lb ) Erick Dampier: eFG – 49% . . iFG - 57%

[Packfill]

Well done but I am not sure what the point of this post is.

Interestingly, the only guys appearing on that list who are close in dimensions to Horford are Bosh, Amare, Okafor and Brand.

[AtLaS]

I would assume it's to show that only a select few centers in the NBA will have a distinct advantage over Horford. Most of the ones who are bigger have no offensive game to speak of, and Horford is strong enough to keep many out of the lane.

[Vafan]

I thought Bosh was a seven footer. Anyways, Horford is closer to Brand and Okafor in size. Amare is taller, longer reach, and much more athletic. But, Brand has Kaman. Out of the draftees, I want Roy Hibbert the most. I wished he had stay in the draft. Hibbert and Law would have been the best choice.

[BossTweed]

I'm surprised that the iFG% for Eddy Curry was so low (52%) and for Marcus Camby was so high (60%).

Interesting stats though.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

I think these numbers tell us a few things:

1) Most of the guys who are impact players on the low post, aren't your prototypical "back-to-the-basket" centers at all. They are guys who can do both face the basket, and back you down. Most of these guys are 6-10 or 6-11, and they tend to be your more dynamic scorers, rebounders, and shot blockers.

2) Bigger guys do tend to be better inside defenders, but not necessarily better rebounders. The big guys act as space eaters, preventing easy shots. On the offensive end though, they can be a liability. Of course, this isn't the case for Yao and Shaq.

3) The ideal size for today's NBA Center, probably should be 6-11 . . 260 . . and VERY athletic. Ironically, that's Tim Duncan's size.

4) 6-10 centers tend to be much better offensive players, than 7-0 centers. The majority of 7 footers in the league aren't impact players at all. They're role players.

When people make the case for Horford playing center, you have to understand that the Hawks had a hell of a time defending the post. Sorry centers looked great against us.

Here are the eFG and the iFG numbers for Lorenzen, Shelden, and Solomon. You saw ZaZa's numbers in the previous post. WARNING . . THIS IS NOT PRETTY.

Lorenzen Wright: eFG – 51% . . iFG – 65%

He has the knowledge to play the position, but has obviously lost some athleticism. He's not active at all on the boards and is a liability on both ends of the court.

Solomon Jones: ( center only ) eFG – 57% . . iFG – 62%

A great shot blocker, but way too thin and weak to be a viable option at center right now. He's a pretty good weak side defender though, because of his athleticism.

Shelden Williams: ( center only ) eFG – 56% . . iFG – 65%

Scary numbers for Shelden, and illustrates why we had to address the position with Horford. The ONLY defense Shelden can lean on right now, was that his shoulder was hurt for a good chunk of the season. Otherwise, he was just as horrid as the others. He has to get better if he wants to play center. The only thing that saves him right now, is that he's a great rebounder. Otherwise, he can only play center if we're in a zone defense.

Right now, Horford is listed at 6-10 . . 245 lb. You figure that he'll have to add at least 10 - 15 pounds of more muscle to his frame, to effectively play center for an extended period of time. It may not happen by the time this season starts, but he'll be able to do it fairly quickly.

Horford could easily be in that 6-10 . . 260 range by the start of the 2008 season. This will at least put him in a position to be a very good low post scoring option, and a good defensive option in the middle.

He has the offensive skills to be a potent low post threat. He's also a smart player on both ends of the floor. I think he's going to prove right away that he's our best option at the 5. But he'll need the other guys to spell him at times, until he can adjust to playing there possibly full-time.

In other words, expect the Hawks to play a lot of zone this year, but be very active in it. They'll use their athleticism and length to cause havoc on the defensive end . . or at least try to. Horford should free up Smith to do even more weak side shot blocking.

[exodus]

That was a lot of work for....actually i am not sure what it was for.

It boils down to one simple question. Is our goal to win a title? If the answer is no then by all means Horford is fine at center.

But if the answer is yes then we will have to get a center who can effectively defend the top centers in the league. There is no way around it.

[Vafan]

Why do people keep listing Horford at 6'10? He was measured at a shade under 6'9.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Quote:

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Well done but I am not sure what the point of this post is.

Interestingly, the only guys appearing on that list who are close in dimensions to Horford are Bosh, Amare, Okafor and Brand.

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There are a lot of people on this board that want a certain type of center. But I don't think they know what they want at all. You just can't name a height and size, and think that's all we need in the middle. We need somebody with some skill who can score on the block and defend it.

I just gave those numbers to really give an idea of the types of centers in this league. You have a few elite guys. A lot of mediocre guys. And straight up bums.

It pains me when I see that we should trade ( insert the forward you hate here ) for Brendan Haywood or Joel Przybilla. Those guys are bums. There's no way we should trade a forward we chose as a lottery pick, for a perennial backup center. We're almost better off going with 2 PFs that bring different things to the table, like a Smoove and Horford.

When you add Marvin to the frontline . . we go 6-9 . . 6-9 . . 6-10. And every single one of those guys are great athletes. Now, it's up to Smoove and Marvin to really start using their heads when they play defense, and not just rely on their athletic ability. If they start playing smart, we're going to be much better off.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Quote:

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I thought Bosh was a seven footer. Anyways, Horford is closer to Brand and Okafor in size. Amare is taller, longer reach, and much more athletic. But, Brand has Kaman. Out of the draftees, I want Roy Hibbert the most. I wished he had stay in the draft. Hibbert and Law would have been the best choice.

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I agree. That was my preference from Day 1. But as soon as Hibbert dropped out, I was on the Horford bandwagon because we had to address the middle.

[AtLaS]

Quote:

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Why do people keep listing Horford at 6'10? He was measured at a shade under 6'9.

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Because he's 6'9.75" in shoes, which is basically 6'10. Every player in the league is listed at their height IN shoes, not without. Josh Smith is listed at 6'9 and he measured at 6'7 without shoes.

[LongTimeHawksFan]

I still don't understand why people from the Hawks didn't jump at Hibbert and guarantee him the #3 spot. He said he was backing out of the draft because he didn't want to be selected at #8 or around there. It just doesn't add up to me. I know I would have been on the phone immediately with his agent when I heard that!!! Hibbert and Law would have been perfect!

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Quote:

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Why do people keep listing Horford at 6'10? He was measured at a shade under 6'9.

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http://www.nba.com/draft2007/profiles/AlHorford.html

The question should be . . why do people like you keep saying that he's 6-9? He measured out to be 6-9 3/4.

Last time I checked, you don't round off 3/4 downward . . you round upward. Now if he were 6-9 1/4 . . he'd be listed as 6-9.

[Vafan]

Here are his combine numbers:

6'8.75" 6'9.75" 246 7'0.75" 8'11"

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Quote:

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That was a lot of work for....actually i am not sure what it was for.

It boils down to one simple question. Is our goal to win a title? If the answer is no then by all means Horford is fine at center.

But if the answer is yes then we will have to get a center who can effectively defend the top centers in the league. There is no way around it.

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And Ex . . that's part of the reason why I did this. Go find us a DEFENSIVE CENTER who can also play offense . . that's also available for us to get? Who out of this list of centers do you want? And are they available for us to get? And please don't trade one of our forwards for a stiff who's averaging 6 points, 5 rebounds, and 17 minutes a game. That doesn't help us at all.

The thing is this. The history of this league as shown that if a good big man goes up against another, neither are going to shut the other one down. It all comes down to who can play better on the offensive end and rebound the basketball.

I could live with ZaZa at center, even with his deficiencies, if he were also a guy who could shoot 57% FG and grab us 10 - 12 rebounds a night. But he can't do that.

So we have to get someone who may be capable of doing that, even if he does have problem defending the post. That's why I was for trading for Gasol. He's an average to below average defender, but he's a very good offensive player. We have to be able to cancel the great low post players out, with great low post play of our own.

Horford gives us our best chance at doing that right now.

All I want from him this year, is 12 ppg . . 8 rebs . . 55% FG . . 1.3 blks. If we can get that from him this year, along with people like Smoove and Marvin improving, we're definitely in the playoffs.

But you can't just put a stiff in the middle, with no one around him that can get it done on the offensive end on the block, and expect to make the playoffs either. Stiffs only play with dominant low post players at PF. Gasol has one. So does Duncan and KG.

I'm banking on Horford being able to keep people honest on offense, while providing adequate defense in the middle. I'll definitely take that for now.

And as far as this "championship talk" . .lol. Ish, we have to make the playoffs first, before anybody starts talking about building a "championship team".

[TheNorthCydeRises]

Quote:

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Here are his combine numbers:

6'8.75" 6'9.75" 246 7'0.75" 8'11"

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LOL . . that's what I said. He's 6-9 3/4.

Come on van . . this isn't some 3rd world basketball league in which people play without shoes on. We play with shoes on.

So if he's 6'9.75 . . that rounds up to being 6'10.

That's not hard to understand.

[Joker]

Quote:

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Quote:

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That was a lot of work for....actually i am not sure what it was for.

It boils down to one simple question. Is our goal to win a title? If the answer is no then by all means Horford is fine at center.

But if the answer is yes then we will have to get a center who can effectively defend the top centers in the league. There is no way around it.

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And Ex . . that's part of the reason why I did this. Go find us a DEFENSIVE CENTER who can also play offense . . that's also available for us to get? Who out of this list of centers do you want? And are they available for us to get? And please don't trade one of our forwards for a stiff who's averaging 6 points, 5 rebounds, and 17 minutes a game. That doesn't help us at all.

The thing is this. The history of this league as shown that if a good big man goes up against another, neither are going to shut the other one down. It all comes down to who can play better on the offensive end and rebound the basketball.

I could live with ZaZa at center, even with his deficiencies, if he were also a guy who could shoot 57% FG and grab us 10 - 12 rebounds a night. But he can't do that.

So we have to get someone who may be capable of doing that, even if he does have problem defending the post. That's why I was for trading for Gasol. He's an average to below average defender, but he's a very good offensive player. We have to be able to cancel the great low post players out, with great low post play of our own.

Horford gives us our best chance at doing that right now.

All I want from him this year, is 12 ppg . . 8 rebs . . 55% FG . . 1.3 blks. If we can get that from him this year, along with people like Smoove and Marvin improving, we're definitely in the playoffs.

But you can't just put a stiff in the middle, with no one around him that can get it done on the offensive end on the block, and expect to make the playoffs either. Stiffs only play with dominant low post players at PF. Gasol has one. So does Duncan and KG.

I'm banking on Horford being able to keep people honest on offense, while providing adequate defense in the middle. I'll definitely take that for now.

And as far as this "championship talk" . .lol. Ish, we have to make the playoffs first, before anybody starts talking about building a "championship team".

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I'm glad you make this thread, alot of people don't like Zaza becuase he looks retarded when in the game, but in reality, he is a average Center, sometimes below average, most times a legit and solid backup. People want something that's not really abiliable to the Hawks or create BS to hide a player that they like when he makes it much harder for the rest of the players to play there game.

[Sothron]

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That was a lot of work for....actually i am not sure what it was for.

It boils down to one simple question. Is our goal to win a title? If the answer is no then by all means Horford is fine at center.

But if the answer is yes then we will have to get a center who can effectively defend the top centers in the league. There is no way around it.

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Perhaps we should qualify for the playoffs first before we worry about one defensive big away for a title? Horford was the best player in the draft after the big two and we got him. I'm happy with that.

[exodus]

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Go find us a DEFENSIVE CENTER who can also play offense

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We don't need a defensive center who can play offense, we need a defensive center PERIOD. We need someone who can effectively guard someone like Duncan, Howard or JO. We don't have anyone like that.

We have enough guys who can score. Now we have Horford who is supposed to be a good post scorer (although i have my doubts).

But in terms of playoff basketball defense > offense . The reason is simple. Defense can be played well every day. The same isn't true on offense because even the best shooters have off nights.

[Joker]

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Quote:

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That was a lot of work for....actually i am not sure what it was for.

It boils down to one simple question. Is our goal to win a title? If the answer is no then by all means Horford is fine at center.

But if the answer is yes then we will have to get a center who can effectively defend the top centers in the league. There is no way around it.

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Perhaps we should qualify for the playoffs first before we worry about one defensive big away for a title? Horford was the best player in the draft after the big two and we got him. I'm happy with that.

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Are you happy with the fact the Hawks are still the worst team in the league and I said that wasn't going to change no matter who the Hawks drafted.