BK had most 4 year draft capitol of any GM...EVER?

[exodus]

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I'm begging.

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LOL

Remember it is the offseason and nothing is going on. Nothing is likely to happen with the Hawks for months.

It is pretty funny to me that Walter is trying to differentiate between "used" draft picks and unused draft picks.

The 2nd pick of the 2005 draft only existed as a pick BEFORE it was used but i don't think Walter understands this.

[AHF]

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The rights to future picks are capital whether they are traded or not, whether the pick has been used or not.

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AHF, should you contractually agree to send me your next pay check for a Joe Johnson rookie card, wouldn't you agree that it, the paycheck itself, is no longer YOUR capital?

Yes the rights to already traded, future picks are capital, however, they are capital for the other team (i.e. Pheonix). This is just comically lame AHF. You know better.

W

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You are still not getting this.

According to me, my paycheck IS part of my capital.

It doesn't matter if you spend the paycheck, trade it for a card, buy a car with it, etc.

That is the capital you were working with. What you did with it is a separate analysis.

My future paychecks are also part of my existing capital. I can leverage those for a cash advance or a loan, I can promise portions of future paychecks in exchange for a car, I can put some portion of that paycheck into a tax-deffered investment account. I can simply wait and collect the check.

What I do with the future paycheck doesn't matter. It is part of the capital at my disposal.

Someone else with the exact same income as me has the exact same capital as me and in terms of our relative capital it is the same whether one of us chooses to exchange our rights to future paychecks for a car, to defer some of that compensation for greater $$ on the backend, or to simply collect those future paychecks when they are paid.

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Walter - I am asking you again to start acting like an adult and drop the "comically lame" and other condescending remarks from your posts. I have never put anyone on ignore on this site and I hope that is never necessary. However, your continuation of this behavior is becoming personally insulting because you are smart enough that you are doing it on purpose and not simply as an off the cuff remark. Please knock off the condescension.

[Guest Walter]

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It is pretty funny to me that Walter is trying to differentiate between "used" draft picks and unused draft picks.

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The prefix "un" = "opposite" yet you argue that one shouldn't "differentiate" them when you can't tell the difference between them. Get a clue.

W

[Guest Walter]

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This "used draft capital" nonsense is just a figment of your imagination. The picks only existed BEFORE they were used which is why your thread title is in the past, and not present, tense. You are talking about the picks BK had BEFORE he used them.

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The 2008 pick still exists. While we traded it (used it) it continues to exist as capital FOR PHEONIX.

Only Pheonix can trade away their draft capital into (poof) nonexistence (see their most recent trade).

Ex, you are arguing precisely what I have stated, that FOR US the 2008 pick no longer exists. It is FOR US used capital. You're just too thick to see that you have restated my point with some odd choice of wordage. Welcome to my side of the argument.

W

[exodus]

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It is pretty funny to me that Walter is trying to differentiate between "used" draft picks and unused draft picks.

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The prefix "un" = "opposite" yet you argue that one shouldn't "differentiate" them when you can't tell the difference between them. Get a clue.

W

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Where are BK's "used" draft picks now? Do you think he keeps them in self storage? Maybe he should try to sell them on Ebay to and give the proceeds to the owners to help them out.

The only way you can compare the value of draft picks is to compare them BEFORE THEY ARE USED.

If you compare them after they are used then you are comparing players, not picks.

[gsuteke]

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The rights to future picks are capital whether they are traded or not, whether the pick has been used or not.

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AHF, should you contractually agree to send me your next pay check for a Joe Johnson rookie card, wouldn't you agree that it, the paycheck itself, is no longer YOUR capital?

Yes the rights to already traded, future picks are capital, however, they are capital for the other team (i.e. Pheonix). This is just comically lame AHF. You know better.

W

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You are still not getting this.

According to me, my paycheck IS part of my capital.

It doesn't matter if you spend the paycheck, trade it for a card, buy a car with it, etc.

That is the capital you were working with. What you did with it is a separate analysis.

My future paychecks are also part of my existing capital. I can leverage those for a cash advance or a loan, I can promise portions of future paychecks in exchange for a car, I can put some portion of that paycheck into a tax-deffered investment account. I can simply wait and collect the check.

What I do with the future paycheck doesn't matter. It is part of the capital at my disposal.

Someone else with the exact same income as me has the exact same capital as me and in terms of our relative capital it is the same whether one of us chooses to exchange our rights to future paychecks for a car, to defer some of that compensation for greater $$ on the backend, or to simply collect those future paychecks when they are paid.

* * *

Walter - I am asking you again to start acting like an adult and drop the "comically lame" and other condescending remarks from your posts. I have never put anyone on ignore on this site and I hope that is never necessary. However, your continuation of this behavior is becoming personally insulting because you are smart enough that you are doing it on purpose and not simply as an off the cuff remark. Please knock off the condescension.

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modus operandi

[exodus]

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The 2008 pick still exists. While we traded it (used it) it continues to exist as capital FOR PHEONIX.

Only Pheonix can trade away their draft capital into (poof) nonexistence (see their most recent trade).

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So what happens when they use it to pick a player? Does it go to draft pick heaven? Do you think it goes to Area 51?

The only way you can compare the picks between two teams is to compare them before they are used.

[Guest Walter]

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You are still not getting this.

According to me, my paycheck IS part of my capital.

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The hypothetical is IF you contractually traded you next paycheck to me for a Joe Johnson card is that paycheck STILL a part of your capital. No. The card is. You traded away the check for the card. The check WAS your capital. Now it is not. Contractually, that card is yours, NOT the paycheck.

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It doesn't matter if you spend the paycheck, trade it for a card, buy a car with it, etc.

That is the capital you were working with. What you did with it is a separate analysis.

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Note: "...WERE working with". Notice the PAST TENSE form of "is" that you yourself use.

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My future paychecks are also part of my existing capital. I can leverage those for a cash advance or a loan, I can promise portions of future paychecks in exchange for a car, I can put some portion of that paycheck into a tax-deffered investment account.

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Sure you can, but once you do so IT no longer is your capital. The Joe Johnson card would be, but the paycheck you mortgaged for it WOULD NOT!

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I can simply wait and collect the check.

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Which isn't what we did with the 2008 pick now is it?

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What I do with the future paycheck doesn't matter. It is part of the capital at my disposal.

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Even you admit it matters by using "were" to describe the capital prior to your using it. It absolutely does matter whether you USE your capital as to whether or not you still have your capital. Double duh.

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Walter - I am asking you again to start acting like an adult and drop the "comically lame" and other condescending remarks from your posts. I have never put anyone on ignore on this site and I hope that is never necessary. However, your continuation of this behavior is becoming personally insulting because you are smart enough that you are doing it on purpose and not simply as an off the cuff remark. Please knock off the condescension.

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AHF, you are wrong on this one. You know it. That isn't condescention. That is point and fact. It isn't often one can say this about you, but you are in this case. It's a small issue and both of you guys are wrong but you and Ex continue to argue MY POINT without even realizing it.

Example 1)

Exodus

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You are talking about the picks BK had BEFORE he used them.

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Precisely my point. Ex is arguing precisely what I have stated, that FOR US the 2008 pick no longer exists. It is FOR US used capital. That isn't the case with Portland's 2008 pick.

Example 2)

AHF

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"That is the capital you

were

working with."

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Precisely my point, again. The 2008 pick for us is capital we WERE working with. The 2008 pick for Portland is capital they ARE working with.

W

[Guest Walter]

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Where are BK's "used" draft picks now?

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Regarding the (now) 2008 pick previously traded to Pheonix as part of the deal for JJ...

...you can answer your question now can't you?

W

[exodus]

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Where are BK's "used" draft picks now?

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Regarding the (now) 2008 pick previously traded to Pheonix as part of the deal for JJ...

...you can answer your question now can't you?

W

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I don't need to because you just answered your own question and don't even realize it. Our 2008 pick turned into a player just like all the rest of our first round picks.

Duh

If you are going to exclude picks that were involved in trades then i guess you have to exclude the 11th pick this past draft and the 17th pick in 2004.

[gsuteke]

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Where are BK's "used" draft picks now?

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Regarding the (now) 2008 pick previously traded to Pheonix as part of the deal for JJ...

...you can answer your question now can't you?

W

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I don't need to because you just answered your own question and don't even realize it. Our 2008 pick turned into a player just like all the rest of our first round picks.

Duh

If you are going to exclude picks that were involved in trades then i guess you have to exclude the 11th pick this past draft and the 17th pick in 2004.

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and to be frank I am very dissapointed in you Ex

[drzachary]

I just wanted to say, "thank you."

Thank you for this thread -- one of the weirdest, most pointless, hilarious threads I've seen. I've got it permanently bookmarked!

[Guest Walter]

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I don't need to because you just answered your own question and don't even realize it. Our 2008 pick turned into a

player

just like all the rest of our first round picks.

Duh

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Originally, at the start of this thread, I INCLUDED the 2008 pick as part of our USED draft capital BECAUSE Joe Johnson is on the team! Hello? Why else would I have included it as part of our USED draft capital?

What in hell are you talking about?

You never have had a point, EX. Except my own.

W

[exodus]

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Where are BK's "used" draft picks now?

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Regarding the (now) 2008 pick previously traded to Pheonix as part of the deal for JJ...

...you can answer your question now can't you?

W

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I don't need to because you just answered your own question and don't even realize it. Our 2008 pick turned into a player just like all the rest of our first round picks.

Duh

If you are going to exclude picks that were involved in trades then i guess you have to exclude the 11th pick this past draft and the 17th pick in 2004.

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and to be frank I am very dissapointed in you Ex

[image]http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l187/gsuteke/captain20obvious.jpg[/image]

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For some reason i haven't been able to post images. Let me try again and see if it works.

[image]http://s56.photobucket.com/albums/g195/tontoz/?action=view&current=the_shining.jpg[/image]

[exodus]

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Why else would I have included it as part of our USED draft capital?

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So show me where JJ's name was in your first post. Come to think of it i didn't see Shelden's name there either, or Marvins....

All i saw were the picks. And the picks only existed BEFORE they were used.

If you are comparing USED draft capital, and used draft capital are players, then by definition you are comparing players not picks.

Hello McFly, anybody home?

[Guest Walter]

...some more.

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I don't need to because you just answered your own question and don't even realize it. Our 2008 pick turned into a

player

just like all the rest of our first round picks.

Duh

If you are going to exclude picks that were involved in trades then i guess you have to exclude the 11th pick this past draft and the 17th pick in 2004.

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and to be frank I am very dissapointed in you Ex

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[Guest Walter]

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So show me where JJ's name was in your first post. Come to think of it i didn't see Shelden's name there either, or Marvins....

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I simply put numbers down to refelct the draft position used. I figured a smart fella like yourself could figure that (#17 = Josh Smith, #2 meant MW, and "2008 pick traded" = JJ) out. I didn't include names for any of the Portland picks either. I was wrong. You couldn't figure it out. What a lame-o.

W

[exodus]

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So show me where JJ's name was in your first post. Come to think of it i didn't see Shelden's name there either, or Marvins....

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I simply put numbers down to refelct the draft position used. I figured a smart fella like yourself could figure that (#17 = Josh Smith, #2 meant MW, and "2008 pick traded" = JJ) out. I didn't include names for any of the Portland picks either. I was wrong. You couldn't figure it out. What a lame-o.

W

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After the pick is "used" it doesn't matter where the player was picked. That only matters before it is used.

[Guest Walter]

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After the pick is "used" it doesn't matter where the player was picked. That only matters before it is used.

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Do you even have a point left. You have retreated so far into my point you are now escaping to somewhere else. Gotta go.

W

[exodus]

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After the pick is "used" it doesn't matter where the player was picked. That only matters before it is used.

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Do you even have a point left. You have retreated so far into my point you are now escaping to somewhere else. Gotta go.

W

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It is still the same story.

Your whole point is that BK has higher draft picks than anyone in the league during that time frame. Your comparison was strictly using the draft picks. And the crux of the argument is that another GM having the same picks would have brought in much more value than BK did.

But when you say "used" that changes the argument entirely because once they are used they become players. And the value of the players is generally different from the value of the picks.

For example Shelen's value