Hey Ex,

[exodus]

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But since you are claiming reach is such a factor in rebounding, and that Horford will have that disadvantage against centers, are you saying Horford will be a poor rebounder at the center position?

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Not a poor one. he is averaging 9.3 in preseason so it would be reasonable to assume he can average that during the season. That would make him the best rebounder we have unless Smith starts boxing out more.

It is not reasonable to think he can average 12 since the only guys doing that have standing reaches significantly higher.

My main concern it always defense. I am sure he will be a big upgrade over Zaza but we need someone else with size to match up with big centers. I just don't see Horford doing it that well since he is at such a disadvantage.

And keep in mind that the goal is to win a title. any team we go against late in the playoffs is likely to have someone significantly bigger than horford in the middle. It just puts us at a disadvantage.

I am not asking for the moon only for a center with size who can play good D for 25 minutes a game even if he sucks on offense.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

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Obviously standing reach helps rebounding,

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Lets look at the top rebounders in the league last year.

Garnett

Chandler

Howard

Boozer

Camby

Okafor

Jefferson

Bosh

Duncan

Ben

I know that Chandler, Jefferson, Okafor and Howard have standing reaches of at least 9'2". It is pretty safe to assume that Duncan, Camby, and Garnett do as well. Boozer and Bosh have a standing reach of 9'1".

No telling what Bens is.

Is standing reach the only factor in rebounding? of course not. However it is obviously a big help.

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Well, why isn't the guy with the BIGGEST standing reach in the league, not on your list of guys?

The funny thing about this list Ex, is that almost all of the guys listed in the top 10, are the same athletic PF/C types, that Horford is. Almost every one. Even as you go down that list, you still see the same thing.

The biggest standing reach guy in the league, Yao Ming, is #18. Dalembert is #20.

You hardly see ANY of thoe 7 foot - 270 pound stiffs that play center for a wide variety of teams across the league, near the top in rebounding. But you do see a lot of 6-9 to 6-11 guys who weight 240 - 265 pounds, near the top.

You're worring about nothing Ex. Horford will be able to step right in and contribute in a big way. And if he gets 30 minutes a game, look for him to pull down 8 - 10 rebounds a night, easily.

All 4 of those guys finished in the top 10 in rebounding. Ahead of Bosh, Chandler, Boozer,

[exodus]

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You're worring about nothing Ex.

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If the goal is to be average then you are right there is nothing to worry about.

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is that almost all of the guys listed in the top 10, are the same athletic PF/C types, that Horford is. Almost every one. Even as you go down that list, you still see the same thing.

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Correct. You see athletic guys with significantly higher reaches than Horford.

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All 4 of those guys finished in the top 10 in rebounding. Ahead of Bosh, Chandler, Boozer,

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[TheNorthCydeRises]

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You're worring about nothing Ex.

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If the goal is to be average then you are right there is nothing to worry about.

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Don't tell me that you're going to be one of those, "not satisfied until we win a title" type fans, are you? The goal this year is to just get in the dance. Once we get in, then we'll see what kind of noise we can make. IF we make the playoffs this year, we can then see what we need to add or tweak.

If the Hawks beat Detroit in the first round, then lose 4 - 1 in the 2nd to Cleveland, the season is DEFINITELY a success.

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is that almost all of the guys listed in the top 10, are the same athletic PF/C types, that Horford is. Almost every one. Even as you go down that list, you still see the same thing.

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Correct. You see athletic guys with significantly higher reaches than Horford.

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Boy . . you sure are putting a lot into that extra 2 - 3 inches. Significant? LOL. So the standing reach of 3 inches, is more of a factor to rebounding, than acutally boxing out your man and sealing him off so that you're in the best possible position to get the rebound? Gotcha . . lol.

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All 4 of those guys finished in the top 10 in rebounding. Ahead of Bosh, Chandler, Boozer,

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I forgot to delete that sentence. I had first went to ESPN's site, to check the NBA stats on rebounding. I was shocked to see names like Shawn Marion, Troy Murphy ( who has a standing reach of 8' - 9.5"), Chris Webber, and Antoine Jamison were in the top 1 of rebounding . . . ahead of guys like Bosh, Chandler, and Boozer. I then double checked nba.com to see if that was right. That was when I noticed that ESPN had listed the 2005 - 06 rebounding leaders, instead of the 06- 07 guys.

[killa3312]

Horford makes up for his lack of reach (which is still above average) against other centers with his desire, hustle, and intelligence. Horford is simply one of the smartest bigs you will ever see out on the court. He understands the game incredibly well and sees the floor with rare vision. Donovan routinely called him the smartest player he's ever coached, and keep in mind he coached bigs like Matt Bonner and David Lee (who are both incredibly intelligent on the basketball court).

Standing reach is overrated when it comes to rebounding. Important for shot blocking? Sure, but an intelligent and savvy player can overcome a disadvantage in reach by simply outsmarting his opponent, and Horford does that routinely. Larry Bird isn't the in HoF because of his freakish athleticism or reach... same with Charles Barkley.

[exodus]

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So the standing reach of 3 inches, is more of a factor to rebounding, than acutally boxing out your man and sealing him off so that you're in the best possible position to get the rebound? Gotcha . . lol.

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So i guess the guys he is going up against don't know how to box out or get position. Horford is the only guy in the league who knows how to do that.

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Don't tell me that you're going to be one of those, "not satisfied until we win a title" type fans, are you?

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No i just want BK to give them a chance and they don't have it now. Even if they do get a defensive center with size who can play D their title hopes will still depend heavily on the development of their young guys. I still think Marvin is the main key.

Keep the strawmen coming.