Why trading Josh Smith instead of Chills may be OK

[NJHAWK]

John Hollinger of espn wrote what we all talked about yesterday in trying to get BK to go after Kidd. We all talked about Chills and expireings for Kidd and also I talked about trying to replace Portland in the 3 way deal with NJ and Dallas to make a run at Devin Harris. After thinking about this for a little while I have come to the realization that IF NJ doesnt bite for Chills and expireings then I would offer Smoove. How about Smoove, Lue, AJ, LO Speedy and ZazA for Kidd and Maglore or even Jason Collins if NJ doesnt believe they can get Speedys deal wiped off after this year. I do have some logical reasons for this and I will post them after I get back from picking up the kiddies at school. lol

[NJHAWK]

OK here it goes. I think J Kidd would be huge for us and even if we trade Smoove we still have JJ/Chills and Marv as a core to play with him. Also if we get either Maglore or Collins there is a chance that one of them could be an effective center so we can move Al to PF. I really dont see us missing Lue, Lo or ZaZA at all. AJ is a nice player but we would have Kidd and have Law to back him up while hopefully getting some tips from Kidd. I know we miss alot if we trade Smoove but some of those things we miss will be good for us. He is playing pf but he never boxes out. He still takes jumpers because everyone leaves him open and if he is on the court with Kidd thats 2 guys that teams are gonna leave open to prove they can shoot. Kidd can sometimes but Smoove cannot. Chills while not nearly as talented as Smoove is just as good finishing on the fast breaks, no thunder dunks but the ball still gets to the hole. He also takes smarter shots and holds his own on the offensive boards. I will miss those dunks and those great game changing blocks but I think we will be better after this trade. Last but not least salary wise it will be easier to keep Chills if we get Kidd without going over the cap, espec. if Speedy is in the deal and we get Maglore. Let Nj pay Smoove close to a max deal or maybe even the max depending on who clears cap space at the deadline.

[PureGreatness]

smith is not gonna get traded. kidd dont wanna go somewhere that has a phucked up management.

[GST]

Kidd is on the edge of retirement, and from Maglorie's stats this year, it looks like he has already retired. Both of these players' FG% is in the 30s. I am not against trading Smoove, but not for these guys.

[prolific25]

Trading Smith for Kidd would look like trading 23 year old Tyson Chandler to make room for the 32 year old Ben Wallace. New Jersey on paper looks similar to us(two scoring wings two young athletic bigs)yet they still suck. Part of that reason is because Kidd has gotten noticeably slower defensively every year since the knee surgery and his scoring numbers are similar to that of Chris Duhon's. I've got a great idea...why not try to trade for Andre Miller and actually keep Josh Smith?

[Diesel]

He's too old and makes too much money and we have no picks.

If we trade for a PG, at least go after one that's young... and try to keep Smoove.

I think PTL will give us either Blake or Sergio for the right price.

I think Sea will give us Watson for probably ending contracts.

That's the deal we should make.

[NJHAWK]

I hear your logic. Kidd however still avr almost a triple double. Kidd avr the same amount of rebounds as Smoove, as our starting pf. He avr as many assist as our starting point and shooting guard put together. Maybe Im just too dam frustrated to think rationally here but if we stay the corse and give Smoove close to the max we will still be the same old Hawks. If we get Kidd we will be energized for a couple of years and maybe can build off of that. Maybe we will actually win alot and the dam arena will be full and the Spirit group will put that back into the team. As for Maglore of Collins I think there is a chance those guys can still be effective. They dont get playing time because NJ is developing younger bigs. Hey if there is a better trade out there I am all for it but I dont know what point we could get better than Kidd, I really dont.

[gsuteke]

agreed.

If the Hawks were making "now" moves how come we had to sit through the last 3 Craptacular years?

They need to tweak the roster to add a Point ala Brevin Knight (just an example off the top of my head because he's not a bank breaker) and some shooters.

[Atlantaholic]

New Jersey is doing great with Kidd right?

Like they must have a better record than us correct?

Because if they don't (which they don't) how in god's name to you rationalize the move?

New Jersey Lineup

Kidd

Carter

Jefferson

Boone

?Who cares

Our Lineup with Kidd

Kidd

JJ

Marv

Horf

Zaza

So far this year, Carter is better than JJ, Jefferson is on a whole other planet in comparison to Marvin, Boone is recently playing Just as good as Horford, and Zaza is probably worse than any scrub that suits up for Jersey at Center... Not to mention that their Coach is someone whose last name is not Woody.

Why is New Jersey like three games behind us? How will we become better than we currently are when we will have an UNARGUABLY weaker roster than New Jersey currently has?

Just some absurdly logical questions.

[NJHAWK]

It could be as simple as its time for a change in NJ. They have always been a good squad with Kidd until recently. They have always been alot better than us and seem to have had no trouble beating our ayss this year. Maybe they dont like each other, maybe Kidd knows Vince juat dont give a shyyt. Maybe they play no defense. Sometimes a player needs a change to be re- energized. Maybe that happens for Kidd here.

[Iman]

The most likely way we ever contend for a championship is if Smoove, Marvin, and Horford all live up to their potential, I'd only trade one of them for someone with equal potential at this point. We might be as good for now with Jason Kidd and Childress as we would with JKidd and Smoove, but in the longterm it seriously kills our potential.

I also wonder if NJ would want Childress. I think they might rather have Acie, Shelden, and a pick. I'd do that but make them throw in Marcus Williams and then follow-up with a move of Chillz for new starting future PG.

I think we'd be shocked how good the Hawks would be with JKidd. I think we'd easily move up outta the 7th playoff seed and probably win one round. In my mind, the JJ/Marvin combo is equal to if not better than Jefferson/Carter, especially when you factor in defense. Smoove and Horford are perfectly suited for a JKidd type team. If JKidd stayed injury free, I could see even see us scaring the top teams by next year. The problem would be finding that next PG to replace JKidd. That's why I'd also move Chillz, plus we'd have a hard time affording him with JKidd's contract.

Would NJ take Acie, Shelden, and our 2010 unrestricted 1st rounder (and Speedy, etc) for JKidd and Marcus Williams? Maybe Acie and Chillz? Then maybe we could trade ZaZa and Salim for a Portland point?

Sounds tricky, I bet management would nix it also. We'll be lucky if we get Ridnour from Seattle or something like that.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

This board amazes me sometims.

All you saw for the last 2 years on this board is . . ."we need a PASS-FIRST PG"

Now, that the ULTIMATE pass-first PG is on the market, people don't want him because he's "getting old and he costs too much".

Didn't this board say the exact same thing about Iverson 2 years ago? Talking about he's on the decline

Amd let me inform people that New Jersey does NOT have a better roster than us. If they are better than us, they are better ONLY because they have Kidd, and we don't. Give them AJ and take off Kidd, and Jersey MIGHT have 11 wins right now. If we had Kidd, we would be over .500 and praising "The Beard" for his solid coaching.

But NJHAWK, I disagree on one thing. You don't trade Smoove to get Kidd, if they won't take Chill + expirings. You trade Marvin instead.

Smoove, with Kidd as his PG, transforms into an absolute DEMON offensively. He would make the game so much easier for Smoove, that it wouldn't be funny. I think someone else referred to this, but think of how Paul has turned Tyson Chandler into a legit offensive threat.

With Marvin gone, Smoove could see his PPG skyrocket to around 23 a game. And life would be soooooooo much easier for JJ. He wouldn't have to work nearly as hard for his points.

Sure, Kidd has never been a good shooter. But the amount of points he creates is on the same level as a Nash or a Paul.

His 2nd best asset to me, is his rebounding ability. if he grabs a defensive rebound, he instantly starts a fast break. And guess who loves to run the floor.

For all of you uptempo fiends, Kidd is your guy. Oh I forgot . . you guys would rather cheap, scrub PGs like a Brevin Knight, Ridnour, or a Duhon running the show.

Some of you cats continuousy blast the ASG for doing nothing, yet, you wouldn't take a chance to do a deal like this? All that talk about . . (( crying )) I want to root for a win-nerrrrrrr . . I want the Hawks to win championshipssssss . .

Yet, some of you blink on a deal like this, and would ratlher settle for an All-District PG to run the Hawks, instead of a current All-Star and future hall of famer to run the squad?

GTFOH !!!!

But as soon as a team like Cleveland, or the Lakers acquire Kidd, everyone will be like . . "see, the ASG doesn't care about the Hawks. They're too cheap".

Lineup:

Kidd

JJ

Smoove

Horford

Zaza

Or how about this lineup:

Law

Kidd

JJ

Smoove

Horford

If we trade Marvin, we keep Chill . . and vice versa. Then you tell Shelden or Zaza, Solo, West. and Salim to "man up" and contribute.

If it pays off, we make the playoffs damn interesting for the next 2 years.

If it doesn't, at least you tried to go for it, and you only lost Marvin and Chill in the proocess.

Oh, and if you realy trust the kids, you even consider dealing JJ and some of the expiringd for Kidd and a pick. But we have to pair up Kidd with Smoove, to give us that dynamic threat.

I'm with you NJHAWK. We have enough parts here to offer Jersey, without going "all-in". That's exactly what Denver did with Iverson. And while it hasn't paid off in the form of a title, they're at least in the conversation.

[TexasPete]

Putting Josh Smith in a deal for a 35 year old PG is about as stupid an idea as I have ever heard on this site.

And I have read some of Diesel's trade threads.

[NJHAWK]

Im not saying trade Smoove instead of Chills. Im saying if Chills doesnt get it done { which I dont think it will } then just go for it and trade Smoove. We would all love to see Smoove and Kidd on fast breaks together but Chills is just as good a finisher as Smoove. Marv is pretty good finishing a break as well. The reason I would keep MARV is he will get a shyyt load of wide open shots and he is pretty close to automatic. If we have Smoove out there Kidd will get him open shots but it will just be a brick. Even Chills is a better jump shooter WHEN WIDE OPEN. If we trade Marv instead of Smoove for Kidd we have too many guys who cant shoot and JJ will be the only shooter left out there. Teams will dare Kidd and Smoove to shoot. I will miss the flashy Dunks and great blocks but I will not miss the bricks, bad man to man defense, 1 on 3 circus shows and complete disregard for boxing your man out and getting a defensive rebound. Smoove has all kinds of potential but after this year we no longer get him on the cheap. In this league potential gets you paid higher than almost anything else. I still dont see Smoove being worth the max. I do see some team out there figureing out a way to offer it to him.