Bibby's game: shoot or pass

[exodus]

I think Bibby's game can be summed up fairly easily. He is a shooter with a quick trigger and no conscience. That is different from being a chucker which i will get to later.

I had heard years ago that Bibby was almost unbeatable in shooting drills. We all remember his clutch shooting in the playoffs. But i don't think he really sees himself as a clutch shooter. I think he just sees himself as a shooter, period. If a shot is there he will take it. He doesn't care what the situation is.

He doesn't care if it early in the clock or late.

He doesn't care if it is early in the game or crunch time.

he doesn't care if he made his last 5 shots or missed his last 5.

If he sees daylight it is going up.

The funny thing is that i don't get the impression that he is really looking to shoot. I think he just tries to run the play and just shoots when an opportunity is available. A chucker takes shots he can't make (Smith shooting 3s) or tries to create opportunities for himself when there is nothing there. We all remember Lue dribbling around for 10 seconds and then putting up a fadeaway at the end of the clock.

Bibby rarely takes a guy 1 on 1. I don't get the feeling that he is looking for his own shot when he is dribbling. He has to dribble since he is the pg but i don't get the impression that he likes to do it much. I think this may go back to those great Sactown teams. There wasn't a lot of holding the ball or dribbling in their offense. Their philosophy seemed to be that if you get the ball shoot or pass, shoot or pass, shoot or pass.

I think that mentality is definitely needed here. I like JJ a lot but he does tend to overdribble at times. Smith REALLY overdribbles.

Before he came we obviously needed help at the point and more perimeter shooting. He brings both but i think that his shoot or pass mentality is also something that is having a big effect on the offense.

[Johnnybravo4]

Why does everyone berate Josh Smith on his 3 point shooting? He shoots 25%, which is bad, but it isn't 10%. He usually shoots the 3 because he's wide open. You have to take the shot when you are standing there alone and your man is standing in the paint waiting to take a charge if you try to drive the ball. You have to take an outside shot to keep your man honest.

[exodus]

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Why does everyone berate Josh Smith on his 3 point shooting? He shoots 25%, which is bad, but it isn't 10%. He usually shoots the 3 because he's wide open. You have to take the shot when you are standing there alone and your man is standing in the paint waiting to take a charge if you try to drive the ball. You have to take an outside shot to keep your man honest.

Do you see Amare or Boozer taking 3s? No, and they are much better jump shooters than Smith.

Smith has taken more 3s this year than those two have combined in their careers. Just look at how horrible Smiths 3 pt shooting is relative to the rest of the league.

http://www.82games.com/FGSORT2.HTM

[coachx]

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Bibby rarely takes a guy 1 on 1. I don't get the feeling that he is looking for his own shot when he is dribbling. He has to dribble since he is the pg but i don't get the impression that he likes to do it much. I think this may go back to those great Sactown teams. There wasn't a lot of holding the ball or dribbling in their offense. Their philosophy seemed to be that if you get the ball shoot or pass, shoot or pass, shoot or pass.

I think that mentality is definitely needed here. I like JJ a lot but he does tend to overdribble at times. Smith REALLY overdribbles.

Before he came we obviously needed help at the point and more perimeter shooting. He brings both but i think that his shoot or pass mentality is also something that is having a big effect on the offense.

Good points Ex !

Quick ball movement is working pretty well for Alderman in Houston too. After all they just had the 2nd longest win streak in the history of the NBA.

This is definately a major area of improvement that can only be captitalized upon if you have good shooters. Bibby and JJ are knocking them down and so is Marvin from midrange. Even Chills is knocking down some open 3's as of late (product of the quick ball movement.)

The amount of isolation plays (prior to Bibby) would make you sick. It was very "rec league." Bibby does not put up with that crap. He alwayse has our guys in a play now.....early in the clock. If his teamates are not moving, picking, screening, or cutting on Q, then you seem him point and direct. AJ would get us into sets quick too but he would cave into both Smith and JJ "iso" play call and clear out demands too much. Bibby "don't play that."

[PureGreatness]

i agree with johnnybravo. it isnt like smith take 4 three pointers a game its more 1.3(im guessing). and smith is not a chucker.

[exodus]

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i agree with johnnybravo. it isnt like smith take 4 three pointers a game its more 1.3(im guessing). and smith is not a chucker.

There is nobody in the NBA that takes as many jumpers as Smith and shoots them worse.

[JackB1]

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I think Bibby's game can be summed up fairly easily. He is a shooter with a quick trigger and no conscience. That is different from being a chucker which i will get to later.

I had heard years ago that Bibby was almost unbeatable in shooting drills. We all remember his clutch shooting in the playoffs. But i don't think he really sees himself as a clutch shooter. I think he just sees himself as a shooter, period. If a shot is there he will take it. He doesn't care what the situation is.

He doesn't care if it early in the clock or late.

He doesn't care if it is early in the game or crunch time.

he doesn't care if he made his last 5 shots or missed his last 5.

If he sees daylight it is going up.

The funny thing is that i don't get the impression that he is really looking to shoot. I think he just tries to run the play and just shoots when an opportunity is available. A chucker takes shots he can't make (Smith shooting 3s) or tries to create opportunities for himself when there is nothing there. We all remember Lue dribbling around for 10 seconds and then putting up a fadeaway at the end of the clock.

Bibby rarely takes a guy 1 on 1. I don't get the feeling that he is looking for his own shot when he is dribbling. He has to dribble since he is the pg but i don't get the impression that he likes to do it much. I think this may go back to those great Sactown teams. There wasn't a lot of holding the ball or dribbling in their offense. Their philosophy seemed to be that if you get the ball shoot or pass, shoot or pass, shoot or pass.

I think that mentality is definitely needed here. I like JJ a lot but he does tend to overdribble at times. Smith REALLY overdribbles.

Before he came we obviously needed help at the point and more perimeter shooting. He brings both but i think that his shoot or pass mentality is also something that is having a big effect on the offense.

Great observations Ex........the KEY is that IF there is a shot available, Bibby doesn't hesitate and takes it...if not he passes or runs a play. He won't force anything. Acie needs to learn from him. Acie needs to be confident and if a open/makeable shot is there, don't hesitate and go for it. Joe should learn from Bibby how to not force shots and stop playing so much one on one.

[Admin]

Very good assessment Ex and I have to agree with you on all of your points. I would love to see us run that Princeton style offense like Sacramento used to run in their glory years.

Regarding Bibby I really don't think I could be happier with him. I know he is only average defensively but he makes the rest of our players so much better offensively and he is the best offensive PG we have had that I can remember.

[thefloydian]

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Why does everyone berate Josh Smith on his 3 point shooting? He shoots 25%, which is bad, but it isn't 10%. He usually shoots the 3 because he's wide open. You have to take the shot when you are standing there alone and your man is standing in the paint waiting to take a charge if you try to drive the ball. You have to take an outside shot to keep your man honest.

25% is very bad. I don't think you'll find more than maybe one other guy who takes as many 3s as Smith with that poor a percentage.

[JackB1]

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Why does everyone berate Josh Smith on his 3 point shooting? He shoots 25%, which is bad, but it isn't 10%. He usually shoots the 3 because he's wide open. You have to take the shot when you are standing there alone and your man is standing in the paint waiting to take a charge if you try to drive the ball. You have to take an outside shot to keep your man honest.

25% is very bad. I don't think you'll find more than maybe one other guy who takes as many 3s as Smith with that poor a percentage.

Woody should bench Smoove IMMEDIATELY after taking a bad 3 (when the clock isn't winding down). That would stop him. Unfortunately all Woody does is give him a funny look when Josh comes back to the bench, which Josh just ignores. It's like a little kid that knows exactly what he can get away with with his parents. Josh is basically still a "kid" and needs to be treated like one until he shows some smarts. Woody isn't realizing this.

[exodus]

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Very good assessment Ex and I have to agree with you on all of your points. I would love to see us run that Princeton style offense like Sacramento used to run in their glory years.

Regarding Bibby I really don't think I could be happier with him. I know he is only average defensively but he makes the rest of our players so much better offensively and he is the best offensive PG we have had that I can remember.

I thought the trade was a very good move EVEN IF Bibby turned out to be washed up. We didn't give up much so it was worth a shot and fortunately Bibby has been a big help. We just have to hope he stays healthy.

As far as his defense goes i am basically giving him a pass this year since he got hurt his first game and is playing too many minutes on a new team. he at least seems to try on defense which makes him better than Lue automatically.

The only thing that has bugged me about his game is that he throws some really dumb passes at times.

[thefloydian]

If you're waiting on Bibby's defense to pick up, I think you're probably going to be disappointed, but I think his benefits outweigh his lack of defensive ability.

I agree on the strange passes. This team should never throw a lob/outlet pass. I think they're batting about .100 on them for the season.

[Diesel]

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I think Bibby's game can be summed up fairly easily. He is a shooter with a quick trigger and no conscience. That is different from being a chucker which i will get to later.

I had heard years ago that Bibby was almost unbeatable in shooting drills. We all remember his clutch shooting in the playoffs. But i don't think he really sees himself as a clutch shooter. I think he just sees himself as a shooter, period. If a shot is there he will take it. He doesn't care what the situation is.

He doesn't care if it early in the clock or late.

He doesn't care if it is early in the game or crunch time.

he doesn't care if he made his last 5 shots or missed his last 5.

If he sees daylight it is going up.

The funny thing is that i don't get the impression that he is really looking to shoot. I think he just tries to run the play and just shoots when an opportunity is available. A chucker takes shots he can't make (Smith shooting 3s) or tries to create opportunities for himself when there is nothing there. We all remember Lue dribbling around for 10 seconds and then putting up a fadeaway at the end of the clock.

Bibby rarely takes a guy 1 on 1. I don't get the feeling that he is looking for his own shot when he is dribbling. He has to dribble since he is the pg but i don't get the impression that he likes to do it much. I think this may go back to those great Sactown teams. There wasn't a lot of holding the ball or dribbling in their offense. Their philosophy seemed to be that if you get the ball shoot or pass, shoot or pass, shoot or pass.

I think that mentality is definitely needed here. I like JJ a lot but he does tend to overdribble at times. Smith REALLY overdribbles.

Before he came we obviously needed help at the point and more perimeter shooting. He brings both but i think that his shoot or pass mentality is also something that is having a big effect on the offense.

Bibby is a coaches son.

He's smarter and better trained than most players.

BUT

IN the actual play...

He's Ty Lue with a better PG game.

That means, he is a chucker (there's no difference) but he knows how to run an offense.

I think being a coaches son, he does have a small bit of conscious which allows him to play team ball at least 25-30% of the time. However, a lot of times, we use him for his chucking skills the same way we used Lue. We bring the ball up with either JJ or Chillz and we find Bibby and Bibby decides to either pass to a cutter or chuck up a shot.

[exodus]

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He's Ty Lue with a better PG game.

That means, he is a chucker (there's no difference) but he knows how to run an offense.

I don't buy the chucker argument. Lue was constantly trying to beat guys one on one off the dribble while the rest of the team stood around and watched.

Bibby rarely goes one on one. He takes shots when they are there and with his quick release he doesn't need much space.

[vdunkndunk]

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Why does everyone berate Josh Smith on his 3 point shooting? He shoots 25%, which is bad, but it isn't 10%. He usually shoots the 3 because he's wide open. You have to take the shot when you are standing there alone and your man is standing in the paint waiting to take a charge if you try to drive the ball. You have to take an outside shot to keep your man honest.

The reason it's good to shoot when you're wide open is because you're more likely to make the shot. Since Josh Smith only shoots 25% even when he's open, that reasoning doesn't apply: he's not likely to make the shot if he's open or not. Basically, if he gets the ball on the 3-point line he needs to keep the ball moving or drive it, unless the shotclock is about to expire. There's a reason people don't guard him at the 3-point line: you don't keep people honest just by shooting the ball, you keep them honest by MAKING shots.

[thefloydian]

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Why does everyone berate Josh Smith on his 3 point shooting? He shoots 25%, which is bad, but it isn't 10%. He usually shoots the 3 because he's wide open. You have to take the shot when you are standing there alone and your man is standing in the paint waiting to take a charge if you try to drive the ball. You have to take an outside shot to keep your man honest.

The reason it's good to shoot when you're wide open is because you're more likely to make the shot. Since Josh Smith only shoots 25% even when he's open, that reasoning doesn't apply: he's not likely to make the shot if he's open or not. Basically, if he gets the ball on the 3-point line he needs to keep the ball moving or drive it, unless the shotclock is about to expire. There's a reason people don't guard him at the 3-point line: you don't keep people honest just by shooting the ball, you keep them honest by MAKING shots.

Yeah, no one ever even contests his shot and he still shoots 25%. That should tell you all you need to know.

[dalamchops]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=C3_rTiLPhAc

[thefloydian]

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http://youtube.com/watch?v=C3_rTiLPhAc

One time I was shooting around in a gym and made 10 3's in a row. Why hasn't an NBA team picked me up yet?

[Johnnybravo4]

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Why does everyone berate Josh Smith on his 3 point shooting? He shoots 25%, which is bad, but it isn't 10%. He usually shoots the 3 because he's wide open. You have to take the shot when you are standing there alone and your man is standing in the paint waiting to take a charge if you try to drive the ball. You have to take an outside shot to keep your man honest.

25% is very bad. I don't think you'll find more than maybe one other guy who takes as many 3s as Smith with that poor a percentage.

How bout Dwayne Wade. He shoots 25.8% for his career.

Melo shoots 28/% for his career

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/dwyane_wade/index.html

And in case you were wondering, Josh Smith shoots 26%

[exodus]

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Why does everyone berate Josh Smith on his 3 point shooting? He shoots 25%, which is bad, but it isn't 10%. He usually shoots the 3 because he's wide open. You have to take the shot when you are standing there alone and your man is standing in the paint waiting to take a charge if you try to drive the ball. You have to take an outside shot to keep your man honest.

25% is very bad. I don't think you'll find more than maybe one other guy who takes as many 3s as Smith with that poor a percentage.

How bout Dwayne Wade. He shoots 25.8% for his career.

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/dwyane_wade/index.html

And in case you were wondering, Josh Smith shoots 26%

Smith is shooting 24.4% this season. he shot 25% last season. he has taken 240 3s the last two seasons. At some point you have to realize you aren't a shooter.

Wade is the primary ball handler for the Heat so he will frequently get stuck with the ball at the end of the clock and have to force up a contested 3.