What Will Make You Happy?

[TheTrueSiete]

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i think dolph is on the ASG payroll as a PR guy.

Nope, he's Woody's lapdog!

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[Dsinner]

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i think dolph is on the ASG payroll as a PR guy.

Nope, he's Woody's lapdog!

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Alright, Alright. Dolf wants what we all want and that is what's best for the team. He just believes in a different path. I'm not going to argue about Woody on this thread as I read the OP to be asking what MOVES (trades) we all wanted to see happen.

If we are going to keep Woody then we HAVE to have some big trades go down. I"m talking trades that involve JJ or Smoove. We simply can't keep the same team with the same coaching staff and expect to be that much better of a team. It's just not reasonable to expect this. I personally like our team and would rather change something else but that's for another thread(s).

[AHF]

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i think dolph is on the ASG payroll as a PR guy.

Nope, he's Woody's lapdog!

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Give the personal attacks a rest guys. You can disagree with someone without these types of posts.

[TheTrueSiete]

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i think dolph is on the ASG payroll as a PR guy.

Nope, he's Woody's lapdog!

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Give the personal attacks a rest guys. You can disagree with someone without these types of posts.

You're right... I could just refuse to shake his hand...

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[jhay610]

For the record, my comment was just good-natured teasing. I fully understand that for every member on the squawk there is another idea as to the best course of action for the team.

It was not meant as a personal offense at all.

[Traceman]

but resigning the Joshes and keeping our "core" together would make me happy. Unlike some of you, I think that JJ, Smoove, Marv, Al, Chillz and Acie will ALL improve enough next year to make us a signifcantly better team than we were this year (yes, I think JJ is STILL getting better too). If Bibby gives us solid, consistent production from Day 1, I think an improvement to 45 wins is possible with virtually the same roster we had this year. If we can add a vet big and a vet shooter to the mix, I think we could be even better than that.

This year gave us a taste of what could be with this group. If we keep this core together for two more years, as Smoove, Al, Marvin, Chillz and Acie mature, I think we could be serious contenders for the EC crown at the end of 09/10.

[exodus]

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but resigning the Joshes and keeping our "core" together would make me happy. Unlike some of you, I think that JJ, Smoove, Marv, Al, Chillz and Acie will ALL improve enough next year to make us a signifcantly better team than we were this year (yes, I think JJ is STILL getting better too). If Bibby gives us solid, consistent production from Day 1, I think an improvement to 45 wins is possible with virtually the same roster we had this year. If we can add a vet big and a vet shooter to the mix, I think we could be even better than that.

This year gave us a taste of what could be with this group. If we keep this core together for two more years, as Smoove, Al, Marvin, Chillz and Acie mature, I think we could be serious contenders for the EC crown at the end of 09/10.

Cheap vets? like who?

How has Childress improved over the last 3 years?

JJ can be more consistent but i doubt he can get much better than he is now. Certainly Smith, Al, Acie and Marvin should improve to varying degrees but players reaching their potential is not the rule in the NBA. Many guys fall well short of what their potential is.

If you look at the top players on the contending teams our top players just don't measure up. Just sitting around hoping that we become contenders because our young guys improve by leaps and bounds sounds like wishful thinking to me.

[Traceman]

Gordan Giricek? Primoz Brezec? Fred Jones? I think that some of those guys are going to be looking at playing for the vet minimum before all is said and done. If not the vet minimum then certainly not much more than that.

I think Chillz will improve as he gets stronger. I think he finishes around the basket stronger now than he did as a rookie.

I agree with you about JJ but consistency is what separates the really good ones from the great ones.

As for Smoove, Marv, Chillz, Acie and Al, I don't know that ANY of them will reach their full potential next year but I DO think that ALL of them will be better than they were this year. Some may be only marginally better and some may be markedly better but I don't think any will regress (or even stay the same). I think the taste of the playoffs will motivate them all to come back and do even better this year.

I DO agree that we lack a superstar but I would say that the Pistons lack a superstar as well. They have a lot of really good players though and that is a model I think we can follow. That said, I am certainly not opposed to trading for a superstar if a trade comes along for one that doesn't gut the rest of the team.

[mattlanta]

For me, what I want is simple but not as easy as people would imagine. First, I would definitely want to have both of the Joshes resigned. Smith has developed into the face of this defense, and I think Atlanta would love nothing more than to have him back. Childress, on the other hand, is just one very solid player who plays his role. He does every thing for this team, and having him back this year would certainly keep this team on pace to get over that .500 'hump'.

Secondly, I'm not so sure I really want Woodson back. Sure, the players want him back, but there are so many better options out there. We've been weighing our options, but I think you're right. In the end, I have a strong feeling that it will still be Woodson especially because we haven't really interviewed any coaching candidates yet. If we were to let Woody walk, I'd love nothing more than to sign Flip Saunders. If we do keep him, I agree with what Diesel posted a couple weeks back, we should bring in some assistant coaches who can help take that load off Woody's back.

Certainly, it would be hard to bring in anymore big-time free agents after (if we even) sign both of the Joshes, but I'd still be even more satisfied if we signed another big man to come off the bench. Someone that can play 'Center' for Horf.

[exodus]

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I think Chillz will improve as he gets stronger.

he has been in the league 4 years. We have been saying the same thing each year. What you see is what you get.

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I agree with you about JJ but consistency is what separates the really good ones from the great ones.

JJ can only do so much on his own. He won NBA player of the month in march but we only had a 9-8 record that month.

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I DO agree that we lack a superstar but I would say that the Pistons lack a superstar as well.

Billups is a sure All-Star yearly. Hamilton and Sheed have made it multiple times as did Ben Wallace.

JJ has made it twice and both times just barely.

It is hard to compete against the top teams when their best players are better than our best players and they also have a much stronger bench.

[Traceman]

defending him then so be it. Just because I choose to appreciate the idea that Woody has done some good things with this team over the last few years rather than bash him every second doesn't mean that I am "so used to losing that I don't care anymore."

I LOVE winning. I just don't want to make any rash decisions (trading Marvin, getting rid of Woody if the players want to keep him) that set us back when I see us steadily moving forward.

You, on the other hand, MUST hate Woody because you have to blame him for your boy Acie's inability to stay on the floor as a rookie. You can't accept the fact that Acie was given MANY opportunities to not only be a meaningful part of the rotation but to START and that HE (Acie) was FAR more responsible for his inability to get on the floor than Woody ever was. Acie hurt his wrist and it set him WAY back (as injuries do for many rookies). He came back from the injury and he was tentative ans unsure of himself. He was playing scared and playing not to get hurt. He couldn't buy a shot and as a result, he quit shooting. He was just out there with no confidence. When he FINALLY regained his confidence and started to play better, he got hurt AGAIN. The team was on a playoffs or bust mission and they didn't have time to wait for him. He got left behind. The team went out and got a vet PG in Bibby and now you want him traded! ANYTHING to get your boy Acie on the floor.

You desperately want to trade Marvin too despite the fact that he was FAR better than Acie this season (and he's younger than Acie too). You even went so far as to say after Marvin's injury in Game 6:

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he had a good game but we'd better off without him.because when someone like that is out,someone like Acie gets more minutes and he ususally performs.If he's out or doesn't start,start Acie,Bibby and Joe together.

How RIDICULOUS was that? Acie gave us very little last year and Marv had just come up HUGE in the playoffs and you were saying that it was good he might be out so your boy could play! What a joke.

Heck, 19 year old ROOKIE Marvin was AT LEAST as good as Acie was last year (and arguably better) and we all know that rookie Marvin was not very good. Now does that mean Acie won't get better? OF COURSE NOT! I think he is going to be a fine player. As will Marvin.

[Traceman]

a lot stronger over the next 3-4 years as he turns into a man. He'll likely never be huge but it won't surprise me to see him come in a little more muscular next year. I could be wrong but I won't be surprised.

I think that the help JJ needs can and WILL come from within. I think Al is going to be a beast next year and Smoove could be as well. Marv and Acie busting out could take us to a whole new level.

I think JJ is every bit as good as Billups was (JJ is better now) and I think the combo of Smoove, Horford, Marvin, Chillz, Acie and Bibby can provide JJ with adequate support.

[exodus]

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a lot stronger over the next 3-4 years as he turns into a man. He'll likely never be huge but it won't surprise me to see him come in a little more muscular next year. I could be wrong but I won't be surprised.

How many more years are you going to say this? You are not the norm.

Chillz lifted for 3 years in college and actually did pretty well in the bench at the combine given his size (12 reps of 185). It is a safe bet he has been lifting regularly since he turned pro. he just hasn't made any gains to speak of so it is unlikely that he will make any noticable gains from here.

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I think the combo of Smoove, Horford, Marvin, Chillz, Acie and Bibby can provide JJ with adequate support.

Adequate support = ok results. That is fine if the goal is to be an average team.

[Admin]

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Adequate support = ok results. That is fine if the goal is to be an average team.

That would be a fair statement if you were talking about a group of guys in their late 20's and early 30's but for the most part we are talking about young kids who are still a few years from their peak here, so I think it's a logical argument that they will improve simply by being another year experienced and with another offseason together. Even Childress is probably 2 years from his peaks so he should improve, even if it's the smallest amount, over who he was as a player this year.

[Traceman]

I don't want us to be mediocre either. I truly believe that the talent that is CURRENTLY assembled on this team has a chance to be a real contender in the EC in a couple of years if we add a few pieces going forward. I don't want to see us give up on Smoove, Marv or even Chillz too soon (I think it is safe to say that Al isn't going anywhere) when I think this core can get it done. I don't want to see us do like the Bulls and give up too soon on core guys (Brand, Artest, Chandler, even Curry) only to regret it later.

[exodus]

The Pistons had Wallace at center, a multiple DPOY winner and All-Star. Sheed was a JJ level star in Portland. Hamilton was a good player before the Pistons got him.

We have a long way to go to get like the Pistons. Billups had more than adequate support.

If i was Sund i would look at JJ, Smith ane Horford as the keepers. Everyone else is tradeable although the trade value of some of them is pretty marginal.

[Admin]

I could be wrong but I don't think that Traceman means that he has that type of support this year, but that we will in a few years. Those players, while being better than our supporting cast now, weren't young players at the time so it's not unreasonable to think that once they are no longer young players will be a reasonable supporting cast for a team capable of winning it all.

[exodus]

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I could be wrong but I don't think that Traceman means that he has that type of support this year, but that we will in a few years. Those players, while being better than our supporting cast now, weren't young players at the time

so it's not unreasonable to think that once they are no longer young players will be a reasonable supporting cast for a team capable of winning it all

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This is where i differ. I don't think it is reasonable at all to think our guys will improve so much that we can be title contenders in a few years without major additions.

Hamilton averaged 20 ppg in his third season. Sheed average 15 shooting 56% in his second season.

The Joshs have both played 4 seasons and marvin 3. It is time to stop using age as an excuse for mediocrity.

[Packfill]

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Gordan Giricek? Primoz Brezec? Fred Jones? I think that some of those guys are going to be looking at playing for the vet minimum before all is said and done. If not the vet minimum then certainly not much more than that.

I think Chillz will improve as he gets stronger. I think he finishes around the basket stronger now than he did as a rookie.

I agree with you about JJ but consistency is what separates the really good ones from the great ones.

As for Smoove, Marv, Chillz, Acie and Al, I don't know that ANY of them will reach their full potential next year but I DO think that ALL of them will be better than they were this year. Some may be only marginally better and some may be markedly better but I don't think any will regress (or even stay the same). I think the taste of the playoffs will motivate them all to come back and do even better this year.

I DO agree that we lack a superstar but I would say that the Pistons lack a superstar as well. They have a lot of really good players though and that is a model I think we can follow. That said, I am certainly not opposed to trading for a superstar if a trade comes along for one that doesn't gut the rest of the team.

If the Hawks are going to use the Larry Brown Pistons as a building model then it will be another 4+ years for the teams core players to gain the requisite experience that Brown's veteran team had. Oh, and the Pistons had a hall of fame coach.

[pimp]

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I could be wrong but I don't think that Traceman means that he has that type of support this year, but that we will in a few years. Those players, while being better than our supporting cast now, weren't young players at the time so it's not unreasonable to think that once they are no longer young players will be a reasonable supporting cast for a team capable of winning it all.

With JJ's comments before the season, and after the season, it appears that he doesn't want to wait a few years to see if the young guys improve enough .He will be a FA soon and may want out if we don't makes so changes.