Woody said to Acie “That’s why I don’t play you” - on camera

[NineOhTheRino]

Sure, let's just keep playing Flip at PG even though he can't distribute at all, shoots about 40% and constantly makes dumb turnovers. Let's not give Acie a longer leash and a chance to improve. If Flip was playing well at PG I would agree with you, but when he's not a good PG and we have a young guy who hasn't been given a legitimate chance I just can't support that.

I'm not saying Acie will succeed, but we should at least see what we have with him considering we desperately need the PG help when Bibby isn't playing.

damn you make a ton of sense. Sure you're on the right mb?

[HawkItus]

AHF and ATLAS

Let me ask you a simple question. Let's say Acie met all your expectations at backup PG. Do you attribute our current record as negative influence of Flip's play? Or let me phrase the question this way. Could I record be drastically affected if Woody treated the Acie situation differently?

[AtLaS]

Let me ask you a simple question. Let's say Acie met all your expectations at backup PG. Do you attribute our current record as negative influence of Flip's play?

Uh, no. Do you think Flip is the answer at backup PG? Because if you do that you obviously don't have lofty expectations. Fact is he's a terrible PG and we might as well give him a shot.

Could I record be drastically affected if Woody treated the Acie situation differently?

Did I say that? And, how could we possibly know? The only thing we do know is that Flip is a terrible PG and we have a young guy who is never given a chance. I'd like to at least see what we have.

The worst was when Acie played great in Boston against Rondo when given a chance and had like 11 points and a few assists in limited minutes on 100% shooting then didn't even play the rest of the series. Even the announcers were commenting on how he was a much better matchup for Rondo.

[NineOhTheRino]

Uh, no. Do you think Flip is the answer at backup PG? Because if you do that you obviously don't have lofty expectations. Fact is he's a terrible PG and we might as well give him a shot.

Did I say that? And, how could we possibly know? The only thing we do know is that Flip is a terrible PG and we have a young guy who is never given a chance. I'd like to at least see what we have.

The worst was when Acie played great in Boston against Rondo when given a chance and had like 11 points and a few assists in limited minutes on 100% shooting then didn't even play the rest of the series. Even the announcers were commenting on how he was a much better matchup for Rondo.

Please stop it with all these sensible posts. You're really starting to scare me man!

[HawkItus]

Uh, no. Do you think Flip is the answer at backup PG? Because if you do that you obviously don't have lofty expectations. Fact is he's a terrible PG and we might as well give him a shot.

You misunderstand. Is our record better or worse because of Flip's play? If Acie was playing and not Flip would we be ahead of Orlando? Could we possibly be worse if Acie was playing more? I think the best you could say is that backup PG has been inconsequential. When we lose it's because our starting 5 either plays bad or is out played. Plain and simple. So I say stop worrying about it. Acie is not why we won't win a championship this year, next year or ever. If we make the playoffs he won't be the difference. If we don't, he won't be the difference.

[AtLaS]

You misunderstand. Is our record better or worse because of Flip's play? If Acie was playing and not Flip would we be ahead of Orlando? Could we possibly be worse if Acie was playing more? I think the best you could say is that backup PG has been inconsequential.

I already answered your question, how do we know if we'd be better off with Acie playing? We don't because he doesn't play. What we do know is that Flip sucks as a point guard, period.

When we lose it's because our starting 5 either plays bad or is out played. Plain and simple. So I say stop worrying about it. Acie is not why we won't win a championship this year, next year or ever.

This is just dumb logic. Actually bench play is one of the biggest reasons teams improve and win championships. OF COURSE Acie won't lead us to a championship, that's not my point at all.

If we make the playoffs he won't be the difference. If we don't, he won't be the difference.

So because he's not the reason we won't win a championship, we might as well just let a bad PG continue playing ahead of someone who was drafted in the lottery and we haven't even given him a chance? That is just dumb Woody logic. Small moves and switches is how teams improve. Again, I don't know that Acie will be a better option than Flip, but since Flip sucks at point guard we might as well give him a chance.

Detroit playing McDyess over Amir Johnson isn't the reason why they won't win a championship, so why do they do it? Because he's a better option, duh..

Edited January 20, 2009 by AtLaS

[HawkItus]

I already answered your question, how do we know if we'd be better off with Acie playing? We don't because he doesn't play. What we do know is that Flip sucks as a point guard, period.

This is just dumb logic. Actually bench play is one of the biggest reasons teams improve and win championships. OF COURSE Acie won't lead us to a championship, that's not my point at all.

So because he's not the reason we won't win a championship, we might as well just let a bad PG continue playing ahead of someone who was drafted in the lottery and we haven't even given him a chance? That is just dumb Woody logic. Small moves and switches is how teams improve. Again, I don't know that Acie will be a better option than Flip, but since Flip sucks at point guard we might as well give him a chance.

Detroit playing McDyess over Amir Johnson isn't the reason why they won't win a championship, so why do they do it? Because he's a better option, duh..

So your saying Flip Murray has lost us games? That's what your prepared to say? His impact has been negative enough to affect our won/loss record?

[thefloydian]

So your saying Flip Murray has lost us games? That's what your prepared to say? His impact has been negative enough to affect our won/loss record?

The argument to play Acie isn't even about whether he or Flip should get minutes, it's that they should both get minutes. That way Joe wouldn't be averaging more mpg than anyone in the league.

[Admin]

The argument to play Acie isn't even about whether he or Flip should get minutes, it's that they should both get minutes. That way Joe wouldn't be averaging more mpg than anyone in the league.

Very true! I can't imagine how Acie could be messing up that bad in practice and in games (according to Woody) to the point where Flip should be getting that many more minutes. There's got to be more to this than meets the eye though since Woody doesn't keep other players that make mistakes on the bench. My guess is that Acie doesn't respond well to the way that Woody criticizes him or Woody doesn't like the way Acie responds and he basically puts him out of his mind until he absolutely needs him.

[crimedog]

Very true! I can't imagine how Acie could be messing up that bad in practice and in games (according to Woody) to the point where Flip should be getting that many more minutes. There's got to be more to this than meets the eye though since Woody doesn't keep other players that make mistakes on the bench. My guess is that Acie doesn't respond well to the way that Woody criticizes him or Woody doesn't like the way Acie responds and he basically puts him out of his mind until he absolutely needs him.

Could just be that Acie doesn't "fit" the team, or at least Woody's vision of it. When Josh did dumb things, we had to keep him in because the D/rebounding he brought. There is a lot of talk about Acie's D, but to be honest its not special at this point in his career. Certainly not to the point where it necessessitates him being in the game... at least in Woody's eyes.

Not saying Woody is right or wrong for not playing the guy, just giving a possible explaination.

[Admin]

Could just be that Acie doesn't "fit" the team, or at least Woody's vision of it. When Josh did dumb things, we had to keep him in because the D/rebounding he brought. There is a lot of talk about Acie's D, but to be honest its not special at this point in his career. Certainly not to the point where it necessessitates him being in the game... at least in Woody's eyes.

Not saying Woody is right or wrong for not playing the guy, just giving a possible explaination.

That's certainly plausible. Acie definitely gets more credit for his defense than he's shown he deserves no doubt about that. He wasn't known as a good defender in college and he hasn't shown that he is one in the NBA either. What he has shown is that he can get into the paint on anyone and that his A/TO ratio is pretty decent and he can generally stay in front of his man on defense better than Bibby. The problem is that he's not a good shooter and he has trouble finishing in the paint. I have no doubt that he can be more productive than he's had the chance to be but you're probably right he doesn't fit the team the way that Woody wants him to. Woody would probably rather have a backup PG who played more like Bibby but that's just not the type of player that Acie is capable of being.

[Traceman]

I am beginning to think it is a rumor that has no legs to it. We had a couple of people claiming to have Tivoed the game but no uploaded video. One poster asked when the play was at and another poster gave a specific time. Still no video.

I agree. I am about to call BS on this. Acie turned the ball over on the same play that he injured his thigh. I have a hard time believing that Woody went up to him and said that is why I don't play you when the guy had to be assisted off the court by the training staff.

[Cwell]

I agree. I am about to call BS on this. Acie turned the ball over on the same play that he injured his thigh. I have a hard time believing that Woody went up to him and said that is why I don't play you when the guy had to be assisted off the court by the training staff.

um dude this is from the game before,not the Raptors game yesterday.

[Traceman]

um dude this is from the game before,not the Raptors game yesterday.

My bad! Thanks. Glad to hear that. I thought I was missing something. I only saw the 2nd half of the GS game so I have no idea about that one.

[Admin]

Surely somebody here has the game recorded and can clarify whether or not Woody actually said this, right?

[AHF]

AHF and ATLAS

Let me ask you a simple question. Let's say Acie met all your expectations at backup PG.

If he met my expectations, I would want him to be prepped to take over the backup pg minutes for next year at a minimum. I am waiting to see if he can be a starter one day - no expectations on that end but I think it would be very significant for our future (so I want to know one way or the other, the earlier the better).

Do you attribute our current record as negative influence of Flip's play?

Not at all.

Or let me phrase the question this way. Could I record be drastically affected if Woody treated the Acie situation differently?

No, I don't think it would be drastically affected.

[DrReality]

I would like to see "Woody chastised in public the way he did Acie. Told he doesn't know how to coach and get it on TV. Would serve him right.

[Dsinner]

Surely somebody here has the game recorded and can clarify whether or not Woody actually said this, right?

I believe several people, including myself, have verified this. So 3 or 4 people on this message board, a ton of people on the blog and you guys are still claiming it's BS? Woody said it, accept it and move on.

[bronnt]

I believe several people, including myself, have verified this. So 3 or 4 people on this message board, a ton of people on the blog and you guys are still claiming it's BS? Woody said it, accept it and move on.

*cough* video evidence *cough cough*

[AHF]

*cough* video evidence *cough cough*

If there is video evidence, dolfan wants to see a link to it or see it posted on youtube, etc.