JJ Drops 30

[Peoriabird]

See I think Pippen is one of the most overrated players in the history of the NBA. We saw how far the bulls went with him as a #1. He couldn't handle the pressure. It was a sham he was chosen over Nique in that list.

Now this I agree with!

[Peoriabird]

AI is probably the best OG to have played this game. The year he won the MVP, he took his team to the NBA Championships against Shaq and Kobe. At the time, he was one of the top defensive players in the game and top scorers in the game.

We first of all in that series, whatever he did he did it against T. Lue! That in it of itself diminishes whatever accomplishment he achieved! Secondly, in that series he shot 40.1% from the field and 28.2% from the 3 point line. He average 3.8 assist and 2.4 turnovers per game. In fact, during that season he averaged 31.4 point per game but shot 42 % from the field and 32 % from the 3 point line. He averaged 4.6 assist and 3.3 turnovers per game! If those are MVP numbers then you are right, a lot of players in this league deserve MVP consideration

[Peoriabird]

So given your requirements for "greatness" please tell me who, in your world, is considered "great". Must be a short list.

Yes it is a short list! Now there are a few exceptions to the rule of having to win a championship to be considered great. My list would include:

1) Charles Barkley

2) Karl Malone

3) John Stockton

4) Gary Payton

5) ?Patrick Ewing

[AtLaS]

We first of all in that series, whatever he did he did it against T. Lue! That in it of itself diminishes whatever accomplishment he achieved! Secondly, in that series he shot 40.1% from the field and 28.2% from the 3 point line. He average 3.8 assist and 2.4 turnovers per game. In fact, during that season he averaged 31.4 point per game but shot 42 % from the field and 32 % from the 3 point line. He averaged 4.6 assist and 3.3 turnovers per game! If those are MVP numbers then you are right, a lot of players in this league deserve MVP consideration

So, what happened to Kobe or LeBron versus Boston last year? The fact is, you really know nothing about basketball and there's no way you followed basketball during that time.

As for the series, only 7 of Iverson's points were scored on Lue. The rest of the game he was dominating every player on their team from Brian Shaw to Kobe. The entire Lakers defense was geared to stop him and he destroyed them. There is absolutely no way you watched that game or series. He only put Lue on Iverson to face guard him in the 4th and deny him the ball, and he was holding the entire time.

Just stop being an idiot please. It's like you're just trying to get attention. If you feel Chris Paul is subpar how about starting a thread on a general NBA forum like RealGM or Insidehooops (RealGM has almost zero Hornets or Hawk fans so it would be completely unbiased) and show us the results after you post your thoughts.

Edited March 11, 2009 by AtLaS

[Peoriabird]

If you feel Chris Paul is subpar

please copy a quote supporting the above statement.

Edited March 11, 2009 by Peoriabird

[AtLaS]

please copy a quote supporting the above statement.

LOL. You're entire argument is owned so you resort to this.

You know what I'm saying, no reason to beat around the bush. If you think Paul isn't as good as we Hawks fans (according to you) seem to make him out to be or think he is, than make the post on an active general NBA board like the ones I stated above.

[hawkman]

See I think Pippen is one of the most overrated players in the history of the NBA. We saw how far the bulls went with him as a #1. He couldn't handle the pressure. It was a sham he was chosen over Nique in that list.

Nooooooooooooo!!! Stop this basketball blasphemy!!! Pippen was one of the greatest all around players to play this game. He had stifling defense and potent offense. He could slash and shoot it from the outside. He could handle it and pass it with the best of them. He was a great rebounder as well. Now I can agree with you about Nique getting screwed, but Pip was NOT overrated. The guy was so versatile out there that it wasn't funny. I thought he actually did pretty good for the supporting cast he had around him after MJ left. The East was pretty darn tough in the early to mid 90's and he kept the Bulls competitive by doing whatever it took to scratch out wins.

[AHF]

This may be true... But what's the need for trying to down CP3? It is a very settle villification of CP3 here and it's because he's not a Hawk. Dude turns in a 24, 3, and 10 performance and guys are saying he played like trash? I never did like him? This is backlash and there's only one reason for it...

You are preaching to the choir on this one.

[tonegully]

Watch that video that D posted. Go to the end when they asked AI about Ty Lue guarding him and watch his expression. I was laughing so hard when i seen that.

I love A.I. because im from the Hampton Roads area.

I personally like CP3 but i get tired of hearing him when they talk about Marvin. It makes me dislike him. People act like he is a basketball great or something. He is a good player but not all that to me.

[Peoriabird]

I personally like CP3 but i get tired of hearing him when they talk about Marvin. It makes me dislike him. People act like he is a basketball great or something. He is a good player but not all that to me.

Careful Tonegully you might upset the Hornet fans uh I mean Hawks fans around these parts! You know that they are still upset that their beloved Chris Paul led Hornets team lost!

Edited March 11, 2009 by Peoriabird

[AtLaS]

Careful Tonegully you might upset the Hornet fans uh I mean Hawks fans around these parts! You know that they are still upset that their beloved Chris Paul led Hornets team lost!

This isn't even worth responding.

I didn't think you'd take up my challenge.

[Diesel]

We first of all in that series, whatever he did he did it against T. Lue! That in it of itself diminishes whatever accomplishment he achieved! Secondly, in that series he shot 40.1% from the field and 28.2% from the 3 point line. He average 3.8 assist and 2.4 turnovers per game. In fact, during that season he averaged 31.4 point per game but shot 42 % from the field and 32 % from the 3 point line. He averaged 4.6 assist and 3.3 turnovers per game! If those are MVP numbers then you are right, a lot of players in this league deserve MVP consideration

MVPs since 1991.

2007-08 Kobe Bryant Los Angeles Lakers

2006-07 Dirk Nowitzki Dallas

2005-06 Steve Nash Phoenix

2004-05 Steve Nash Phoenix

2003-04 Kevin Garnett Minnesota

2002-03 Tim Duncan San Antonio

2001-02 Tim Duncan San Antonio

2000-01 Allen Iverson Philadelphia

1999-00 Shaquille O'Neal Los Angeles Lakers

1998-99 Karl Malone Utah

1997-98 Michael Jordan Chicago

1996-97 Karl Malone Utah

1995-96 Michael Jordan Chicago

1994-95 David Robinson San Antonio

1993-94 Hakeem Olajuwon Houston

1992-93 Charles Barkley Phoenix

1991-92 Michael Jordan Chicago

1. Of all the players listed Only Jordan and Kobe can match or beat Iverson's 2000-2001 average.
   
2. Nobody on the list made it to the finals without a second offensive star in the year that they were made All-star except Hakeem and Dirk.
   
3. Kobe is the only player on the list who didn't have a second star period when he became an MVP (and Kobe stats mirror Iverson's).
   
4. Jordan had Pippen.
   

Perioa, you're just arguing to be argumentative.

Let's give you a flavor for the MVP race that year... Shall we?

Let's start with the people who didn't win. Namely the commentary about Shaq...

Here's the interesting part... Shaq is crying about being third in voting but check this out:

" "This should be more firepower for Shaq," Rick Fox said to reporters with a grin. "Play it up for us, will ya?"

The problem isn't that O'Neal didn't win the award again. There was no question he was not the MVP this year. He knows it. His coach knows it. His teammates know it.

Even broadcaster Fred Hickman, voting for Iverson for a second consecutive year, finally got it right.

O'Neal began the year too slow, too distracted, too constricted by nagging injuries. There were times he pouted. There were times he didn't play hard.

Iverson was honored by the league Tuesday after leading the Philadelphia 76ers to the best record in the East and their best season in 16 years.

"It's special because of everything I went through last summer," Iverson said. "I had to look in the mirror and see things I didn't do right as a person or a player. I promised myself when I look in the mirror after this season, I'll know I did everything right."

Iverson got 1,121 points to beat out San Antonio's Tim Duncan (706 points) and the Lakers' Shaquille O'Neal, last year's winner, who had 578 points from the panel of sportswriters and broadcasters in the United States and Canada.

Now Perioa.. You can keep arguing. History shows that Iverson was well deserving of the award and historically not many could do what he did. Offensively he was the team. Defensively, he did a great job. You're worried about 3 pt percentages...of a guy who only attempted 306 3pters. Thats' ridiculous. Right now today, with 20 games left to play, Mike Bibby has attempt 342 and Joe Johnson 337. In other words, Iverson is not nor has he ever been a three point shooter. Why not argue about his rebounding? Moreover, he is not a PG. He's an OG.. so why are we concerned about A/TO ratios? His is still above 1.

[Peoriabird]

Now Perioa.. You can keep arguing. History shows that Iverson was well deserving of the award and historically not many could do what he did. Offensively he was the team. Defensively, he did a great job. You're worried about 3 pt percentages...of a guy who only attempted 306 3pters. Thats' ridiculous. Right now today, with 20 games left to play, Mike Bibby has attempt 342 and Joe Johnson 337. In other words, Iverson is not nor has he ever been a three point shooter. Why not argue about his rebounding? Moreover, he is not a PG. He's an OG.. so why are we concerned about A/TO ratios? His is still above 1.

I guess there are people that love one category players and scoring is all that matters to some! So tell me how many all defensive team honors did Iverson receive? Would that be none? You say that Iverson had nothing else on his team but I beg to differ. He played with an all star center. In fact, that year Mutombo was second team all NBA. Of course since Mutombo didn't average 20 ppg, he wasn't an all star in your world. You also stated that Iverson was Philadelphia's offense and you are correct which fit his game quite well. The strange thing is that you are probably one of the many that complains Woodson Iso offense but yet you cheer the Allen Iverson Iso offense. But anyway, this just represents a difference in opinion

[Diesel]

I guess there are people that love one category players and scoring is all that matters to some! So tell me how many all defensive team honors did Iverson receive? Would that be none? You say that Iverson had nothing else on his team but I beg to differ. He played with an all star center. In fact, that year Mutombo was second team all NBA. Of course since Mutombo didn't average 20 ppg, he wasn't an all star in your world. You also stated that Iverson was Philadelphia's offense and you are correct which fit his game quite well. The strange thing is that you are probably one of the many that complains Woodson Iso offense but yet you cheer the Allen Iverson Iso offense. But anyway, this just represents a difference in opinion

So the guy leads his team in steals and is the engine of their offense and pushes them to the finals is one category?

Bird, you need to learn about this great game of basketball. If he were just a 1 category guy, they would have made it nowhere. Moreover, they had the best record in the East... This with a deadline day trade of their starting and BU Center and Kukoc... Also, Matt Geiger gets hurt before the playoffs. Also, Mckie and Snow were not 100% during the playoffs.

No one man team has ever gone through that much difficulty and made it to the finals.

[Peoriabird]

So the guy leads his team in steals and is the engine of their offense and pushes them to the finals is one category?

Since you are the only person that recognizes AI as a great defender we can count his defensive prowess as something he excelled at. So what else other than scoring did he excel at?

[Peoriabird]

No one man team has ever gone through that much difficulty and made it to the finals.

I don't know what you mean by one man team but there was another all star on that team!

[frankthetank966]

Oh hot damn, this is my jam....