Rick Sund on 680 the Fan/Rude Awakening

[tonegully]

"SNT Marvin, Mo, Acie, Capspace for Shaq. Then see if we can resign Bibs on the cheap, Flip, Zaza,... and maybe even Chillz. Draft Collison."

Diesel, you are officially freaking retarded! I would love to meet you just to find out what kind of idiot you really are. That's the kind of stuff you trade for Shaq in his prime, not after an aberration contract year when the guy has maybe two years left, tops.

Do you really take your own ideas seriously? Are you 14?

LMAO!!!

Bring Grandaddy Shaq to Atlanta!!!!....lol. Its like trading for Danny Manning. After he left we were left with nothing.

[Diesel]

Here is the Diesel scenario - trade Marvin + filler (Speedy, Mo, etc.).

Then in 2010 we are better because Marvin is gone and we have more cap space.

Not exactly.

I do expect us to be more competitive towards a championship. I'm watching Dwight Howard destroy Boston and I know that the way you win championships is with some form of control in the post. Honestly, our post game is very inconsistent. You guys who talk about shooters here and shooters there... a dominant post game is worth 4 shooters... and if we have a dominant post game and shooters like Joe and Flip, we can be very dangerous.

Then in 2010, when we have been competitive on the national level, have established our team as a perinneal playoff team with championship calibre players, we will be the focus of better allstar like players... And we will have the money to resign Joe and extend Horf. At this point... the way that Smoove plays... if he don't somehow find his defense, I'm not against trading him to bring in an allstar.

[Diesel]

Well, it's not really an argument. It's a reality.

If you want to trade using cap space, it would HAVE to be done before re-signing other players. If you want to re-sign players first, your trade suggestion wouldn't work under the CBA.

This is not true. In fact, it's the opposite of reality. You can't trade with cap space before signing your own players because they have a cap hold that's normally 1.5 times their previous salary. A lot of times, you see a team trade capspace during the season when they are under the cap OR have an exception.

If it is during the season, that means that all players are already signed. You even see this with our deal for Joe Johnson:

The Phoenix Suns today completed a sign-and-trade deal with the Atlanta Hawks that will send restricted free-agent guard Joe Johnson to Atlanta in exchange for guard/forward Boris Diaw (pronounced DEE-ow) and two future first-round draft picks. This trade also leaves Phoenix with a $6 million trade exception for their use in future dealings.

The 6 million dollars in trade exception is due to the fact that the deal was uneven so we made up for that by giving capspace (or an exception) to the Suns. This trade happened Late in the offseason and we had already signed all of our free agents.

[Diesel]

"SNT Marvin, Mo, Acie, Capspace for Shaq. Then see if we can resign Bibs on the cheap, Flip, Zaza,... and maybe even Chillz. Draft Collison."

Diesel, you are officially freaking retarded! I would love to meet you just to find out what kind of idiot you really are. That's the kind of stuff you trade for Shaq in his prime, not after an aberration contract year when the guy has maybe two years left, tops.

Do you really take your own ideas seriously? Are you 14?

Dude out of all the posters here, you have to be the dumbest!! If there's a wrong side of the argument, 100% of the time, you're on it. IN fact, you just helped verify that I'm right by opposing my position. Thanks. You are the official HawkSquawk argument resolver. We just wait to see what side of the argument you take and whatever side that is... it's the losing side. Can I call you Groundhog.

Fella's It's groundhog day and the Hawksquawk Groundhog has proclaimed that Diesel is right!

:newspaper:

[Diesel]

Dude out of all the posters here, you have to be the dumbest!! If there's a wrong side of the argument, 100% of the time, you're on it. IN fact, you just helped verify that I'm right by opposing my position. Thanks. You are the official HawkSquawk argument resolver. We just wait to see what side of the argument you take and whatever side that is... it's the losing side. Can I call you Groundhog.

Fella's It's groundhog day and the Hawksquawk Groundhog has proclaimed that Diesel is right!

:newspaper:

The groundhog at work...

here's the groundhog during a home playoff game against the celtics calling for our 3rd quarter collapse!!!

But wait.. .Here's the best part:

The groundhog speaks after finding out he was wrong again:

Hey, if it takes a reverse jinx to get this team going, I'm all for it.

That's classic!

Another revelation from the groundhog....

Honestly, I would rather have a new coach than have made the 8 seed of the playoffs as a team with a losing record.

Go ahead and tell me I'm a bad fan. You're wrong.

I guess we see how that turned out.

And what would the groundhog be without a salim shotout!

Yeah Groundhog, that Salim was some player. Losing him makes us incomplete!!

[mrhonline]

This is not true. In fact, it's the opposite of reality. You can't trade with cap space before signing your own players because they have a cap hold that's normally 1.5 times their previous salary. A lot of times, you see a team trade capspace during the season when they are under the cap OR have an exception.

LOL, Diesel. You're making my point, not yours.

What you're suggesting is that the Hawks would have to do is renounce the Bird rights to their FA's to complete the deal you've suggested -or- they would have to come up with a deal after signing their free agents that works under CBA rules (125% salary matching).

If you would re-read my original response, you would see that is exactly what I said...

Bottom line, a trade for Shaq would either glut the Hawks of their backcourt depth -or- not be feasible.

[Diesel]

LOL, Diesel. You're making my point, not yours.

What you're suggesting is that the Hawks would have to do is renounce the Bird rights to their FA's to complete the deal you've suggested -or- they would have to come up with a deal after signing their free agents that works under CBA rules (125% salary matching).

If you would re-read my original response, you would see that is exactly what I said...

Bottom line, a trade for Shaq would either glut the Hawks of their backcourt depth -or- not be feasible.

No, I said that they would have to resign their free agents (the cheap) ones then sign Shaq.

You said

If you want to trade using cap space, it would HAVE to be done before re-signing other players. If you want to re-sign players first, your trade suggestion wouldn't work under the CBA.

While I agree that to sign Shaq, you would have to renounce the rights of Chillz and possibly Bibby. You would still have enough to sign Flip, Zaza before time and that would allow us to trade for Shaq and give Phoenix a trade exception. BUT.. you can't do it with players on a cap hold... that's why you can't trade for Shaq before resigning other players.

[bumpyphish1]

Dude out of all the posters here, you have to be the dumbest!! If there's a wrong side of the argument, 100% of the time, you're on it. IN fact, you just helped verify that I'm right by opposing my position. Thanks. You are the official HawkSquawk argument resolver. We just wait to see what side of the argument you take and whatever side that is... it's the losing side. Can I call you Groundhog.

Fella's It's groundhog day and the Hawksquawk Groundhog has proclaimed that Diesel is right!

:newspaper:

I'm really not gonna get into a p*ssing contest with you, Diesel, cuz all the regulars know what kind of caricature you are. You are an absolute joke around here to anyone who is semi-informed, and I'd take complete solace in being in disagreement with you 100%, cuz 95% of the time you are in the wrong. The other 5%? Well, even a broken clock is right twice a day......

We should trade two young first rounders+ for Shaq? ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!

[Diesel]

I'm really not gonna get into a p*ssing contest with you, Diesel, cuz all the regulars know what kind of caricature you are. You are an absolute joke around here to anyone who is semi-informed, and I'd take complete solace in being in disagreement with you 100%, cuz 95% of the time you are in the wrong. The other 5%? Well, even a broken clock is right twice a day......

We should trade two young first rounders+ for Shaq? ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!

Semi-informed? You mean like your shenanigans about Salim being our best PG?

2 young first rounders? When did I say that? Is this the part where you try to make up something? Between Marvin, Mo, and Speedy.. there's no first rounder. Moreover, if we kept those same players, there's a possibility that we won't be able to resign Joe (if pressed in 2010).

I think instead of reaching for an insult, you need to reach for some information because your ignorance is killing this board.

[Peoriabird]

Between Marvin, Mo, and Speedy.. there's no first rounder. Moreover, if we kept those same players, there's a possibility that we won't be able to resign Joe (if pressed in 2010).

I hope you realize that Speedy will be off the books by 2010 and Mo makes like 2 million per year!

[benhillboy]

I'm diggin' Sund.

Why does everybody hate Diesel? Everyone here has respectable opinions and views, no matter how outlandish they may be in your eyes. Peoriabird needs a hug.

[EazyRoc]

Yeah, I think people go at Diesel a little bit too hard. However, I'm not feeling the trade idea either. If we got to trade a lot of assets for a player we're only going to have for a year, give me Bosh. Whether or not he's a back-to-the-basket player (which he isn't) means little to me. You can give him the ball, and 50% of the time he shoots it, it'll go in. I can dig that.

[Diesel]

Yeah, I think people go at Diesel a little bit too hard. However, I'm not feeling the trade idea either. If we got to trade a lot of assets for a player we're only going to have for a year, give me Bosh. Whether or not he's a back-to-the-basket player (which he isn't) means little to me. You can give him the ball, and 50% of the time he shoots it, it'll go in. I can dig that.

Bosh vs. Shaq is definitely debatable.. I just think that Shaq's one year will cost more but at the same time, the quality won't have to be the same. For example, I doubt that Toronto would look hard at a deal involving Speedy. I mean, if Speedy, Marvin, Mo could get us Bosh, let's do it today!!

The thing about Shaq is that he is a low post beast. Something we have never had. Closest was Shareef. Maybe Moses Malone. I guess it just depends on would we be able to afford Bosh, Smoove, and joe?

[buckeye242424]

Lets just put this in the never ending amazing Diesel archives that range from an infatuation with the likes of Stephon Marbury, Eddie Curry, Shelden Williams, to Jianlian Yi etc Now the apple of his eye is a near 40 year old broken down center who turned Phoenix, a porsche at the time into the same clunker that Dallas turned into after the Jason Kidd trade! Word of advise my brother, stick to what you do best which is getting drunk on Marvin haterade! And leave the general managing to the guys who have improved this team every year for the past 4 years!

I agree with Diesel that bringing in Shaq would do wonders for the organization as far as PR and the city itself. Not to mention what he would do on the court. Despite his age, he would bring a post presence to the Hawks that we haven't had since Deke. However, getting him to Atlanta would be the difficult part. In the past, even this year I remember in an SI column with Dan Patrick, Shaq made jokes about the Hawks organization. At this point in his career, I doubt he would play for the Hawks. He would want the opportunity at another ring. Unless we made a deep run in the playoffs, probably the ECF at bare minimum, Shaq would need proof that he could get us over the "hump". He would need a similar situation to what he saw with Miami. He knew with Wade, they could get it done. And they did...

[Diesel]

I agree with Diesel that bringing in Shaq would do wonders for the organization as far as PR and the city itself. Not to mention what he would do on the court. Despite his age, he would bring a post presence to the Hawks that we haven't had since Deke. However, getting him to Atlanta would be the difficult part. In the past, even this year I remember in an SI column with Dan Patrick, Shaq made jokes about the Hawks organization. At this point in his career, I doubt he would play for the Hawks. He would want the opportunity at another ring. Unless we made a deep run in the playoffs, probably the ECF at bare minimum, Shaq would need proof that he could get us over the "hump". He would need a similar situation to what he saw with Miami. He knew with Wade, they could get it done. And they did...

My thought is that Joe, Horf, Smoove, and Shaq could win a championship. I don't know though. I would only do it if we had the money to get Flip and Zaza on the bench though. Honestly, if we could make the trade.... and maybe sign and trade Childress instead of capspace... I think we could sign all of them and even Bibby if ownership was willing to go over the LT.

[Peoriabird]

My thought is that Joe, Horf, Smoove, and Shaq could win a championship.

So those 3 are better than a 6 time all star time 3 time all nba, 2 time Mvp in Steve Nash, 4 time all star in Amare Stoudemire, most improved player in the nba in Boris Diaw, sixth man of the year in Leandro Barbosa, all defensive team 2006-08 in Raja Bell, 7 time all star and 5 time all nba in Grant Hill?

That Pheonix team got knocked out in the 1st round last year with Shaq but the Hawk could win a championship with him 3 years older with no bench? :thumbsupsmileyanim:

[Joker]

Here are highlights from Rick Sund's interview on 680:

1) He kept Woody for continuity and believe he made the right choice (ugh)

2) He still believes the team has a lot of growing within (Horford, Smith and Marvin still improving)

3) Joe said this is the happiest he's ever been playing basketball

4) Bibby/Flip/Mo coming to Hawks have been good for Hawks...also, it's been good for their career

5) Josh/Woody deal blown out of proportion. He said blow ups happen, but they have to learn to keep it in house

6) His projection for the team at this stage was to have a winning record at home and win 15-17 games on the road. He's happy where we are, but wants to reach the 17 game goal. He said the elite teams win 20+ on the road. Solid playoff teams win 15-17. He believes we are in that playoff bracket.

7) Said tough decisions in Free Agency are ahead. He said due to the economy, the salary cap will be down and the luxury tax will too. He said he can't go into specifics, but they have to "slice the pie" in a way where they can have depth. He also said (in general terms) you may be better off letting talent go to get a superstar. He said this team has good chemistry.

8) Said he shouldn't get the bulk of the credit for what the Hawks are doing. He said the pieces were in place. However the Hawks specifically got him, so he could "connect the dots" on the team. He also acknowledged he was not the first choice of the Hawks.

9) Talked about understanding opposing teams will get calls on their home court. However, he is concerned when refs gives calls to opposing players in Phillips Arena (mentioned Lebron's game at Phillip's where we lost by a point for an example.)

10) He didn't know if our magic number is 1 or 2 games. He says you have to take into consideration tie breakers, etc. He said it wasn't an exact science.

May our offseason start now

[DrReality]

I was struck by this statement:

He said Acie was the team's best on ball defender at the point and does know he belongs in the league.

If that is true and Woody didn't use him in that capacity isn't that a mark against the Woodster?

[frosgrim]

I was struck by this statement:

He said Acie was the team's best on ball defender at the point and does know he belongs in the league.

If that is true and Woody didn't use him in that capacity isn't that a mark against the Woodster?

It seems like Woodson's two GMs have both assessed that Acie is a NBA caliber player, yet Woodson has refused to play him.

It seems to me that if Woodson is going to get fired its going to be over his use of players, not necessarily his offense.

I have said it before, and it bears repeating: if the Hawks are going to keep Woodson then give him a long-term contract. If they aren't going to extend him, then fire him. This temp coach thing is killing player development and partially the cause of Woodson coaching each game like his last, and that is not a good thing when the NBA season is 82 games plus up to 28 post-season games.