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Flip Murray should not be attempting more FG than JJ!

bumpyphish1

By bumpyphish1
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bumpyphish1 Newbie

bumpyphish1

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Flip Murray was 4-14 from FG.

It really worries me to hear y'all talk about he is like our top FA priority next season. The guy has no conscience. A guy I would want to re-sign would know that when he is on the floor with JJ, he is not the number 1 option.

Yeah, he has been a bargain this season and a veteran presence and has helped some but he is NOT someone to build around. There's a reason Sund signed him to a 1 year deal.

God, I hope Sund has the vision to only sign him on another CHEAP contract or LET HIM WALK.

His FG % and A/T ratio is way too low for my tastes. Guy is a "me" player and is one of the least efficient players in the league.

Edited by bumpyphish1
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Duff_Man Newbie

Duff_Man

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Not sure what you were watching, but JJ hibernated. Flip played well. He passed well and came on late. I think JJ took a step down, and someone had to take up the slack. My big issue was: why did Marvin get yanked so often? He played great when he was in there. Is he that hurt?

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LOL_Hawks Newbie

LOL_Hawks

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Flip was AWFUL until late in the 3rd/early in the 4th. Other than that, he was BAD out there. If there was one person that was guilty of forcing the issue and trying to do too much tonight, it was definitely Flip. If your shots ain't falling, pass the damn ball!

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Joker Newbie

Joker

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As good of a volume scorer as Flip is, he has the tendency to play like a 12 year old in critical times.

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Blunt91 Community Regular

Blunt91

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Not sure what you were watching, but JJ hibernated. Flip played well. He passed well and came on late. I think JJ took a step down, and someone had to take up the slack. My big issue was: why did Marvin get yanked so often? He played great when he was in there. Is he that hurt?

Joe needs to demand the ball, A real superstar would have put this team on his back when we got back within 5pts in the 4th quarter. I am not sure I want Joe back after next season.

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atlien Newbie

atlien

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2 things:

1. Flip did force those layups near the end (without anyone around to crash the boards). We really should have Smoove, Marv or Joe finishing at the rim in traffic (and really, this is where we do miss Chilly quite a bit).

2. It's clear Marv is still dealing with that back issue (back injuries dont go away quickly). He actually is playing quite well when he's in, and I think he would be in late in the game, if he could.

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Peoriabird Grand Master

Peoriabird

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It's clear Marv is still dealing with that back issue (back injuries dont go away quickly). He actually is playing quite well when he's in, and I think he would be in late in the game, if he could.

I don't know Atlien, I saw Marvin standing and jumping around on the sideline the entire 4th quarter cheering the team on. Usually when players are experiencing back pain, they are on their backs working with trainers doing stretching exercises like Rick Mahorn use to do. I have a funny feeling that this is a Woodson strategy of playing veterans down the stretch in close ball games!

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Peoriabird Grand Master

Peoriabird

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Cheering is one thing, playing is another. Ive had back problems in my life.... if you overdo it, you're screwed. I think the training staff and doctors are being very careful with Marvin.

I hope that this is not Woody's call for basketball strategy reasons!

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thecampster Grand Master

thecampster

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Flip Murray was 4-14 from FG.

It really worries me to hear y'all talk about he is like our top FA priority next season. The guy has no conscience. A guy I would want to re-sign would know that when he is on the floor with JJ, he is not the number 1 option.

Yeah, he has been a bargain this season and a veteran presence and has helped some but he is NOT someone to build around. There's a reason Sund signed him to a 1 year deal.

God, I hope Sund has the vision to only sign him on another CHEAP contract or LET HIM WALK.

His FG % and A/T ratio is way too low for my tastes. Guy is a "me" player and is one of the least efficient players in the league.

you are tapping into something here that i don't think you want to go down that road. The board will fry you. So I'll do it.

Bibby - 6 of 12 (4-8 from 3) for 18 points.

Murray - 4 of 15 (1-5 from 3) for 15 points)

Johnson - 5 of 13 ( 1 of 2 from 3) for 16 points

Total - 15 of 40 ( 6 of 15 from 3) for 49 points. That's 37.5% shooting from our guards and 1.21 points per attempt.

Horford - 5 of 9 for 11 points

Smith - 8 of 14 (0-1 from 3) for 17 points

Williams - 4 of 9 (0-3 from 3) for 11 points.

Total - 17 of 32 for 39 points. That's a 53.1 shooting percentage and 1.22 points per attempt.

So as you can see, the bigs are at least as effective scoring even with only 4 3's between them compared to 15 by the guards. But the benefit to playing close to the basket and not jacking up 3's is that a missed 3 is very often a long rebound and leads to a break by the other team.

Also, the only person on the Hawks the other night with a positive +/- was Zaza. Just throwing that out there.

This isn't a one game thing either. In game one:

The 3 guards were 12 of 30 (40%) and scored 27 points. .9 per attempt

the 3 bigs were 17 of 29 (58.6%) and scored 47 points 1.62 per attempt.

When we let the bigs score we tend to win. When our guards...all 3 of them...get shot happy instead of moving the ball around and looking to go down low and wait for a kick out, we lose.

This has been going on all year.

For the year the 3 guards have averaged 17.8 of 40.7 (43.7%) 48.5 points a game or 1.19 per attempt

The bigs have averaged 15.5 of 31.4 (49.4%). 41 ppg or 1.31 per attempt.

Any offense where your point guard and shooting guard are 1 and 2 in attempts per game but are 8th and 9th in shooting percentage is not in good shape. Take out the scrubs and only use the rotation players, and only Mo Evans is shooting worse. JJ and Bibbs shoot the worst percentages of the starters but take the most shots.

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Diesel Grand Master

Diesel

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you are tapping into something here that i don't think you want to go down that road. The board will fry you. So I'll do it.

Bibby - 6 of 12 (4-8 from 3) for 18 points.

Murray - 4 of 15 (1-5 from 3) for 15 points)

Johnson - 5 of 13 ( 1 of 2 from 3) for 16 points

Total - 15 of 40 ( 6 of 15 from 3) for 49 points. That's 37.5% shooting from our guards and 1.21 points per attempt.

Horford - 5 of 9 for 11 points

Smith - 8 of 14 (0-1 from 3) for 17 points

Williams - 4 of 9 (0-3 from 3) for 11 points.

Total - 17 of 32 for 39 points. That's a 53.1 shooting percentage and 1.22 points per attempt.

So as you can see, the bigs are at least as effective scoring even with only 4 3's between them compared to 15 by the guards. But the benefit to playing close to the basket and not jacking up 3's is that a missed 3 is very often a long rebound and leads to a break by the other team.

Also, the only person on the Hawks the other night with a positive +/- was Zaza. Just throwing that out there.

This isn't a one game thing either. In game one:

The 3 guards were 12 of 30 (40%) and scored 27 points. .9 per attempt

the 3 bigs were 17 of 29 (58.6%) and scored 47 points 1.62 per attempt.

When we let the bigs score we tend to win. When our guards...all 3 of them...get shot happy instead of moving the ball around and looking to go down low and wait for a kick out, we lose.

This has been going on all year.

For the year the 3 guards have averaged 17.8 of 40.7 (43.7%) 48.5 points a game or 1.19 per attempt

The bigs have averaged 15.5 of 31.4 (49.4%). 41 ppg or 1.31 per attempt.

Any offense where your point guard and shooting guard are 1 and 2 in attempts per game but are 8th and 9th in shooting percentage is not in good shape. Take out the scrubs and only use the rotation players, and only Mo Evans is shooting worse. JJ and Bibbs shoot the worst percentages of the starters but take the most shots.

Even though I agree with you, you have worked yourself up into a statistical tizzy.

The problem is that our bigs score alot off of passes from our guards. It's penetration like Joe and Flip does that gives our bigs those wide open dunks that increase their field goal percentages. The truth is that neither of our bigs can create their own shot consistently. Josh is learning to... slowly... but it was kinda embarrassing watching the first year Beasley taking Josh to school. Sure Josh got a block on him... but there were more than a few occassions when Beasley put Josh on his hip and just took him lefty style. I found myself thinking... If Josh had those kind of moves to the rim, he'd be unstoppable.

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DJlaysitup Newbie

DJlaysitup

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Yeah, he has been a bargain this season and a veteran presence and has helped some but he is NOT someone to build around. There's a reason Sund signed him to a 1 year deal.

Yep bump....there is definitely a reason that he isn't on a longterm contract. Smoove deserves better.

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bumpyphish1 Newbie

bumpyphish1

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I don't know Atlien, I saw Marvin standing and jumping around on the sideline the entire 4th quarter cheering the team on. Usually when players are experiencing back pain, they are on their backs working with trainers doing stretching exercises like Rick Mahorn use to do. I have a funny feeling that this is a Woodson strategy of playing veterans down the stretch in close ball games!

I'm kind of thinking the same, Peoria. I think Woody is using the injury to go with his boy Flip. Woody seems to love him.

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