Rick Sund is blowing smoke!

[Buzzard]

I dont think that we will find a guy at 24 thats better than Flip Murray, Tracy Mcgrady, Allen Iverson, Larry Hughes, Matt Barnes, Rashard Mcants,nate robinson, ect. but look at the free agent centers available?? Alot of squawkers are looking at our team like we are still rebuilding. We are in contention for a CHAMPIONSHIP.. THE FUTURE IS NOW!

I don't see picking BPA to play off our bench as rebuilding lol. I see it as strengthening our bench which is an obvious weakness for everyone but you. Does not matter to me if he is a rebounding post player, a good shooting wing, or another PG. We need it all on our bench and with only one pick, we can only draft one. Try and take the best "one" available or suffer the consequences of not getting any help.

[MaceCase]

I dont think that we will find a guy at 24 thats better than Flip Murray, Tracy Mcgrady, Allen Iverson, Larry Hughes, Matt Barnes, Rashard Mcants,nate robinson, ect. but look at the free agent centers available?? Alot of squawkers are looking at our team like we are still rebuilding. We are in contention for a CHAMPIONSHIP.. THE FUTURE IS NOW!

If the future is now then why the need to draft a player that is 3-4 years from consistently contributing in the league? You are not realizing that for a C (especially a true C) to fall that deep in the draft they must have some serious question marks about them. Their availability is more a curse than a blessing in disguise.

[Buzzard]

If the future is now then why the need to draft a player that is 3-4 years from consistently contributing in the league? You are not realizing that for a C (especially a true C) to fall that deep in the draft they must have some serious question marks about them. Their availability is more a curse than a blessing in disguise.

100% correct. There was one starting caliber big that fell that far last season and it was a injury plagued Blair. No other big made a impact starting or off the bench that was drafted after 20 last season. That is like one big out of ten or fifteen that was drafted that late.

[LastDon]

If the future is now then why the need to draft a player that is 3-4 years from consistently contributing in the league? You are not realizing that for a C (especially a true C) to fall that deep in the draft they must have some serious question marks about them. Their availability is more a curse than a blessing in disguise.

This is a PF/C draft with the true centers being Monroe, Cousins, Aldrich, Alabi, Whiteside, Sepherin, Jordan, and a host of other getting 1st round considerations. We would be very foolish not to take one because at least 4 or 5 of these guys will be starting centers in the league at some point.

[LastDon]

100% correct. There was one starting caliber big that fell that far last season and it was a injury plagued Blair. No other big made a impact starting or off the bench that was drafted after 20 last season. That is like one big out of ten or fifteen that was drafted that late.

How many guards after 20 made an impact?

[Plainview1981]

The numbers just do not back up the premise that Atlanta's biggest need is the center position.

Ask Orlando.

[LastDon]

100% correct. There was one starting caliber big that fell that far last season and it was a injury plagued Blair. No other big made a impact starting or off the bench that was drafted after 20 last season. That is like one big out of ten or fifteen that was drafted that late.

Only one center was taking after 20 in the 1st round in last years point guard draft and that was BJ Mullin. But look at how many centers are projected to go 1st round this year. I would rather search for a center in a center's draft than to look for a guard in one. But Im confident Sund is going to do the right thing. He has done a pretty good job so far as GM

[Buzzard]

This is a PF/C draft with the true centers being Monroe, Cousins, Aldrich, Alabi, Whiteside, Sepherin, Jordan, and a host of other getting 1st round considerations. We would be very foolish not to take one because at least 4 or 5 of these guys will be starting centers in the league at some point.

You say four or five will be starters at some point; but list seven named centers and a host of others? If every GM felt as you do those seven plus the host of others would be gone by pick 20. The 4 or 5 who may be starters at some point will be gone by pick 20. The others will be given a free ride on the pine for three years while trying to prove the other 20 GMs who passed on them they were wrong...

[Buzzard]

Only one center was taking after 20 in the 1st round in last years point guard draft and that was BJ Mullin. But look at how many centers are projected to go 1st round this year. I would rather search for a center in a center's draft than to look for a guard in one. But Im confident Sund is going to do the right thing. He has done a pretty good job so far as GM

It is not just about centers it is about bigs. Our BU PF is like 100 years old. Its always the same year in and year out. Teams reach for bigs throughout the draft and the further you get past the top 15 to 20 players, the bigger the reach is.

[LastDon]

Lets be serious folks in a draft where u have so many centers projected to go in the first round and a team in desperate need of a center only works out one?? IF thats not a smoke screen I dont know what is?? We just dont wanna tip our hand on which one we like. But we will take a look at the one that everyone projects us to have a opportunity to get. I like Rick Sund and I think he is going to do the right thing. You guys are going to like Jerome Jordan. Youtube him or look at that workout at Draftexpress. Thats the center I want but one thing IS FOR SURE WE WILL DRAFT A CENTER IN THE FIRST ROUND AND THAT IS SOMETHING TO BE EXCITED ABOUT!

[Buzzard]

How many guards after 20 made an impact?

Off the top of my head here is three wings taken in the second round who made an impact

Chase Budinger

Sam Young

Marcus Thorton

[LastDon]

It is not just about centers it is about bigs. Our BU PF is like 100 years old. Its always the same year in and year out. Teams reach for bigs throughout the draft and the further you get past the top 15 to 20 players, the bigger the reach is.

Drafting another 4 would be counterproductive. Joe Smith can check a 4 or we can bring back Othelo whats his face that we had the other year. WE NEED A CENTER A BIG ONE SOME ONE OVER 7 FEET WITH WEIGHT EVEN IF ITS JUS FOR 5 ADDITIONAL FOULS.AND A GUY THATS ABLE TO MOVE HIS FEET UNLIKE TWIN. THATS WHY IM NOT TOTALLY AGAINST DRAFTING THAT SEPHERIN KID BECAUSE HE IS MUSCULAR AND IS COMPARED TO MARK WEST OR MICHAEL CAGE. WE NEED INTERIOR DEFENSE!!

[LastDon]

Off the top of my head here is three wings taken in the second round who made an impact

Chase Budinger

Sam Young

Marcus Thorton

There will be guys in the second round this year like Manny Harris and Hobson who will make an impact if given the opportunity. that is why I hope Rick is looking at these guys. If we draft a wing in a centers draft in the first round I will be pissed..

[Buzzard]

Drafting another 4 would be counterproductive. Joe Smith can check a 4 or we can bring back Othelo whats his face that we had the other year. W

You are quite possibly the only poster here who thinks we do not need an upgrade to Joe Smith...

[sturt]

That's not necessarily true. Take a look at the article I posted by Ford today in the draft section where he talks about how the successful drafting teams employ a tier system, where players are ranked into tiers according to best player and then you rank them inside of those tiers based on team need. What you're referring to is the traditional system, one which BK employed, and led us to taking Marvin because we considered him to be the BPA. Had we ranked the top 4 guys into the top tier it would have had us ranking them Bogut,Williams, Paul and then Marvin. And that's the system that we need to look at for our pick is to find that 4th or 5th tier of players and then rank them in those tiers based on team need.

Dolf., if you think about it, the idea of "tiers" essentially is the same as saying, "these guys are all too alike in terms of projecting their future, so for all intents and purposes, they're tied."

Call it what you want... it's still, fundamentally, the same system.

You end up with the same thing as I'd described... a board where players are ranked, but with certain players considered to possess the same likelihood of success. Instead of 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 with one player at each slot, it's 1 with maybe 3 players, 2 with maybe 2 players, 3 with maybe 5 players... but a ranking nonetheless.

When Marvin came out, at least if you use the mock drafts as evidence, Bogut and Marvin were the top tier at first, but by draft day, Bogut entrenched himself as the definitive only player in the first tier, with Marvin the definitive only player in the second.

If you follow NFL drafts very much, you're aware of numerical grades, and that within certain numerical grade brackets, there is a certain predicted likelihood that the player will start, will make second-string, will make special teams, and that kind of thing. If you plot those, you'll find... logically so... that those routinely form a tiered pyramid, with few players at the top (ie, high likelihood of success) and increasingly more players as you graduate toward the bottom.

Now, given that point, here's where Don and I might find some room for agreement... that is, thinking in terms of tiers when you get to #24, it seems more likely that you'll have more players who grade-out at about the same tier than you would have at higher slots... which goes to the same as my original point that if you find a virtual tie among players and you have a low post player available, then it certainly makes sense to draft that guy.

But if that's not the case, don't make the decision based on need... make the pick based genuinely on the BPA basis.

Edited June 19, 2010 by sturt

[LastDon]

You say four or five will be starters at some point; but list seven named centers and a host of others? If every GM felt as you do those seven plus the host of others would be gone by pick 20. The 4 or 5 who may be starters at some point will be gone by pick 20. The others will be given a free ride on the pine for three years while trying to prove the other 20 GMs who passed on them they were wrong...

No some will fall to the second round. For instance draftexpress has a guy named Tibor Eibes a center from overseas expected to go in the first. Who knows which we will be successful but this year there is a pond full and we would be very foolish not to fish for one.

[Buzzard]

There will be guys in the second round this year like Manny Harris and Hobson who will make an impact if given the opportunity. that is why I hope Rick is looking at these guys. If we draft a wing in a centers draft in the first round I will be pissed..

Oh well I am sure Sund is losing sleep over you being pissed lol. All three of those guys I mentioned were gone by the time we picked in the 2nd round last season. My point is, and I hope you get this, there is a much higher chance of a good wing falling to us than a big. If we can grab a big great; but chances are much higher that it is a starting caliber wing that drops in our laps.

Complain all you want, but GMs put more value on bigs every season; and there are just not that many, if any at all, good ones left after pick 20. Sund aint fooling anyone. The bigs are still going to get drafted fast and early; whether he works them out or not.

Edited June 19, 2010 by Buzzard

[LastDon]

You are quite possibly the only poster here who thinks we do not need an upgrade to Joe Smith...

because im the only poster who realizes that he is a backup 4 and not a 5. Joe played pretty good in the limited minutes he played last season I would love to have him back.

[KB21]

THE LAKERS HAVE SHOWN THE VALUE OF QUALITY LENGTH.. IF THERE IS A GUY AVAILABLE THAT IS BETTER THAN TWIN, MORRIS, AND JOE SMITH WE HAVE TO TAKE THEM. IF NOT WE WILL BE THE SAME FLAWED TEAM WITH A WASTED PICK WHO WANT GET A CHANCE TO DEVELOP BECAUSE OF THE VETERANS WE ALREADY HAVE ON THE PERIMETER

So we take him. He plays 5, maybe 10 minutes a night behind Al and Zaza at center, and we still can't stop anyone on the perimeter because we ignored the most glaring weakness on this team - perimeter defense.

[LastDon]

Oh well I am sure Sund is losing sleep over you being pissed lol. All three of those guys I mentioned were gone by the time we picked in the 2nd round last season. My point is, and I hope you get this, there is a much higher chance of a good wing falling to us than a big. If we can grab a big great; but chances are much higher that it is a starting caliber wing that drops in our laps.

Complain all you want, but GMs put more value on bigs every season; and there are just not that many, if any at all, good ones left after pick 20. Sund aint fooling anyone. The bigs are still going to get drafted fast and early; whether he works them out or not.

A promising prospect on the wing for this current team=Acie Law. Im for drafting a wing if we loose Joe but I hope we keep him and add a center prospect. with Joe and possibly the return Chillz where are the minutes for this young wing with Marvin, Mo, Joe, Crawford, and possibly Chillz in tact