Another Hopeful about Marvin Article.

[Diesel]

Atlanta Hawks: What about Marvin?

7:20 pm September 26, 2010, by Michael Cunningham

Hawks want Marvin to do this and increase his offensive production.

Hawks want Marvin to do this and produce on offense.

So I was contemplating the five questions for training camp I have to come up with for Tuesday’s newspaper, going down the usual list of suspects, when it occurred to me I hadn’t spent a lot of time thinking about one key question:

What about Marvin?

I know my blog people haven’t forgotten him since you’ve included his name in every possible dream trade scenario all summer. I’ve seen him criticized for seemingly not spending enough time developing his game over the summer (the dude is a gym rat by all accounts) and too much time developing as a human (he can’t spend every minute in the gym, can he?)

That’s not to say I don’t understand the frustration. Fans are selfish by nature, and what you want to know is now what did Marvin do to become a better person but how can he help the Hawks be better. Does it provide any solace to hear that Marvin knows he needs to be better, too?

The Hawks are pinning much of their hopes for Marvin’s improvement on L.D.’s new offense. Marvin is, too.

“That always sounds good to a player,” Marvin said. “You always want to be involved. Last year my production went down. Hopefully with this new offense guys will get looks on a more consistent basis and they will be better looks.

“Some nights, for me I could have 20 [points] or I could have 4. For our team to be a good team, I personally can’t have nights like that. So hopefully with this new offense, I will know where the shots are coming from each night and be able to knock them down.”

Actually, Marvin only had four nights of at least 20 points during the regular season and one in 11 playoff games. Even considering how Williams often got lost in the iso-shuffle, that’s not good enough for a player with his physical attributes and talent.

It’s true that perhaps no Hawks player has to put in more double-duty than Marvin. Checking NBA small forwards night after night isn’t easy. Doing so and then also being expected to make consistent offensive contributions, even as a guy who plays off teammates, is even harder.

But Marvin is entering his sixth season, he’s set to make more than $22 million over the next three years, the Hawks need him to produce and so here we are.

“You spend so much energy on the defensive end [but] at the same time you’ve got to make your opponent guard,” he said. “It’s hard enough to guard them but you can’t let them come down and catch a blow on defense. With this new offense and everybody moving hopefully [defenders] will have some more to think about.”

Marvin took some time to think this summer. He went back to Chapel Hill and continued work on his African-American Studies degree (”Probably three more summers to go,” he said). He recently played host to a local bowling event for Special Olympics, an organization he’s volunteered with since he was a sophomore in high school.

Before that, Marvin went to Dakar, Senegal, with the NBA’s Basketball Without Borders program.

“The people were great,” he said. “The people were so nice. They made something out of literally nothing. Those guys are out there playing on dirt courts. It was 120 degrees, it felt like. Super humid. They are out there exercising, working on their game.”

The NBA contingent helped with the effort to put up bed netting in villages in the region with the hope of eradicating malaria.

“I think that was the most special thing for me was to be able to help out,” he said. “Just a little bit.”

So it’s not exactly back to reality for Marvin. More like back from that harsh reality to his job, which figures to be tougher as expectations for his performance rise (again).

“Coach just wanted me to come back ready,” he said. “I just continue to do the things I’ve been doing: shooting the ball, try to get quicker guarding the ball, trying to handle the ball. Just try to stay consistent. I’ve got to work on being consistent this year. I think that is my biggest thing.”

What this article tells me is that Marvin will come back out of shape (as usual). I really doubt that Marvin is a gym rat. Gym rats have much better physical conditioning. Maybe Marvin shows up at the gym regularly, but being there and doing something are two different things.

Suffice it to say, the theme of the article is hoping that LD will make a difference for Marvin.

To that I say......

[macdaddy]

I'm not sure why you think he'll be out of shape but maybe he'll find a good role. The thing that i think MC and a lot of folks are missing with Marvin is there is still this belief that he has some kind of amazing untapped talent. Its just not true. He seems like a great guy and he's a good ball player but we've seen what he can do. He isn't going to come in all of a sudden and be a 20 point scorer. Every guy in the nba could score 20 once in a blue moon.

[Wretch]

Marvin...

What to say about Marvin... We've seen him put up some big numbers fairly effortlessly. He has the skill, size, and quickness to be an outstanding offensive player, but he lacks the fire that all the great ones have and it's what's holding him back. If he would come out one day with the attitude that he's going to step on some toes...I think my head would explode.

Marvin has no fire. Dude is a muscle car with your grandma at the wheel...on her way to bingo, on a Sunday afternoon, in a residential zone, with kids running in the street.

Edited September 27, 2010 by Wretch

[gsuteke]

if he doesn't get it this year under drew who hopefully will run some plays for him it's probably time to give up on the guy.

[Yeti]

if he doesn't get it this year under drew who hopefully will run some plays for him it's probably time to give up on the guy.

I've been a Marvin fan since day one, but I agree. It's time to show up.

[DJlaysitup]

if he doesn't get it this year under drew who hopefully will run some plays for him it's probably time to give up on the guy.

Marvin Williams...the player who came out of the University of North Carolina (sixth man) to the pros in what would have been only his sophomore year in college has worked (mostly as a starter) to excel as an NBA player.

He still demonstrates exceptional promise since he would only be an assistant professor (with a Masters degree) in college at this age. Many think that by the time Marvin reaches the age of a full tenured professor he may be a top level Small Forward in the league.

Edited September 28, 2010 by DJlaysitup

[JTB]

I've been a Marvin fan since day one, but I agree. It's time to show up.

LOL. im a marvin supporter and all but i def agree its really time to step up!!!! This year!!!!!

[Diesel]

LOL. im a marvin supporter and all but i def agree its really time to step up!!!! This year!!!!!

This is the same cry that goes out every year!

"It's Marvin's 4th year it's time for Marvin to step up!".

" Chillz is gone, it's time for Marvin to step up!"

"He has a new contract, it's time for Marvin to Step up!"

" He should know the system by now, it's time for Marvin to Step up!"

Every year, weather Sekou or MC or Micheal Lee.. same story... "Marvin knows he has to step up. Blah blah blah... great pressure from fans... blah blah Chris Paul... blah, 2nd overall."

The point is that all this excuse making is down right embarrassing and is a slap in the face to the real fans. Yet, every year, the real fans fall into the same sinkhole of thinking that some change will benefit Marvin and he will have a "break out year". The truth is that Marvin doesn't have the innards to be even a good player. He's a pampered basketcase who gets on the floor and shows no passion and doesn't seem to care weather we win or lose. He's a loser.

[macdaddy]

This is the same cry that goes out every year!

"It's Marvin's 4th year it's time for Marvin to step up!".

" Chillz is gone, it's time for Marvin to step up!"

"He has a new contract, it's time for Marvin to Step up!"

" He should know the system by now, it's time for Marvin to Step up!"

Every year, weather Sekou or MC or Micheal Lee.. same story... "Marvin knows he has to step up. Blah blah blah... great pressure from fans... blah blah Chris Paul... blah, 2nd overall."

The point is that all this excuse making is down right embarrassing and is a slap in the face to the real fans. Yet, every year, the real fans fall into the same sinkhole of thinking that some change will benefit Marvin and he will have a "break out year". The truth is that Marvin doesn't have the innards to be even a good player. He's a pampered basketcase who gets on the floor and shows no passion and doesn't seem to care weather we win or lose. He's a loser.

Diesel, I used to be completely in your camp about Marvin. But I think you've actually been converted to the Marvin supporter side in a way. To say that he is a loser and shows no passion and that's why he's not a star is just going along with the proposition that he SHOULD be a superstar.

The real story is what you and many of us had been saying a couple years ago. His problem is not passion or effort or fitness. His problem is our heightened expectation. This is who Marvin is. He's a pretty good nba player but the truth is that he doesn't have the skills and talent to be a superstar. Why? Because he's been in the league 5 years and he's not exceptional at ball handling, rebounding, driving, and despite that 'pretty' shooting form he's not an exceptional shooter. Its not because he's lazy or doesn't want to be good. Its because this is how good he is. He's a step above Mo Evans, a step below Richard Jefferson. We are the ones who need to get over it.

I expect him to score more this year and be a great asset on the team. And I'll be happy with that.

[Duff_Man]

Left this site for a long time. Decided to check in this morning and see what was going on. Looks like not much has changed.

[Wretch]

This is the same cry that goes out every year!

"It's Marvin's 4th year it's time for Marvin to step up!".

" Chillz is gone, it's time for Marvin to step up!"

"He has a new contract, it's time for Marvin to Step up!"

" He should know the system by now, it's time for Marvin to Step up!"

Every year, weather Sekou or MC or Micheal Lee.. same story... "Marvin knows he has to step up. Blah blah blah... great pressure from fans... blah blah Chris Paul... blah, 2nd overall."

The point is that all this excuse making is down right embarrassing and is a slap in the face to the real fans. Yet, every year, the real fans fall into the same sinkhole of thinking that some change will benefit Marvin and he will have a "break out year". The truth is that Marvin doesn't have the innards to be even a good player. He's a pampered basketcase who gets on the floor and shows no passion and doesn't seem to care weather we win or lose. He's a loser.

You're right dude. I mean, seriously... You have dropped some hardcore Marvin hate for a long time, but I'm 90% in agreement with you here. I just don't know about the not caring part. He may just...not be the kind of guy that CAN step up and take control.

What's really funny is people have fought with you for years about Marvin, but you dropped that bomb a LONG time ago. You called it. I remember reading your first discouraging opinion on Marvin thinking, "OMG...I hope he's not right about that." Looking back, I'm forced to hold out hope that you were wrong. Still, after all these years...lol. It's all we GOT Diesel!

HOPE!

lol

....but as others have said, I think this is the year I write him off too. I'm tired of waiting on our #2 pick to show up.

Edited September 28, 2010 by Wretch

[drzachary]

Hopeful about Marvin, complaining about Marvin: both of these accomplish exactly the same thing. One of them makes me want to stab myself repeatedly in the eyes.

[niremetal]

Hopeful about Marvin, complaining about Marvin: both of these accomplish exactly the same thing. One of them makes me want to stab myself repeatedly in the eyes.

Quick, someone say something hopeful or complaining about Marvin! :snowballfight:

[Popeye]

My nick used to be MW24.... :cant believe:

[Diesel]

Diesel, I used to be completely in your camp about Marvin. But I think you've actually been converted to the Marvin supporter side in a way. To say that he is a loser and shows no passion and that's why he's not a star is just going along with the proposition that he SHOULD be a superstar.

The real story is what you and many of us had been saying a couple years ago. His problem is not passion or effort or fitness. His problem is our heightened expectation. This is who Marvin is. He's a pretty good nba player but the truth is that he doesn't have the skills and talent to be a superstar. Why? Because he's been in the league 5 years and he's not exceptional at ball handling, rebounding, driving, and despite that 'pretty' shooting form he's not an exceptional shooter. Its not because he's lazy or doesn't want to be good. Its because this is how good he is. He's a step above Mo Evans, a step below Richard Jefferson. We are the ones who need to get over it.

I expect him to score more this year and be a great asset on the team. And I'll be happy with that.

MD,

I dare you to watch Marvin play over some sustain period of time. It's not heightened expectation that's out there winded. It's not heightened expectation that is out there wasting possessions It's not hieghtened expectations that's getting burned on defense and playing defense with his hands. It's not heightened expectations that bowling into the lane like a bowling ball and falling clumsily until he hits something. It's not heightened expectancy that is just stinking the game up but yet still starts. What it is is Marvin. If Marvin played for another team, nobody on this board would care about him. He has Hawks birthrights since we drafted him and resigned him and now we act as though he should always get the benefit of the doubt. He's not so good. We have wasted player after player waiting for him to .... STEP UP. It's not going to happened... there's your expectation. I don't expect him to step up and probably deep down in every Hawks fan heart, neither do they.

[High5]

If Larry Drew is the competent offensive mind that he seems to be then Marvin will be very productive this season.

[macdaddy]

MD,

I dare you to watch Marvin play over some sustain period of time. It's not heightened expectation that's out there winded. It's not heightened expectation that is out there wasting possessions It's not hieghtened expectations that's getting burned on defense and playing defense with his hands. It's not heightened expectations that bowling into the lane like a bowling ball and falling clumsily until he hits something. It's not heightened expectancy that is just stinking the game up but yet still starts. What it is is Marvin. If Marvin played for another team, nobody on this board would care about him. He has Hawks birthrights since we drafted him and resigned him and now we act as though he should always get the benefit of the doubt. He's not so good. We have wasted player after player waiting for him to .... STEP UP. It's not going to happened... there's your expectation. I don't expect him to step up and probably deep down in every Hawks fan heart, neither do they.

That's exactly my point. "He's not so good". Its not a character flaw or underachieving. This is his talent level. But why do we make a thread about him being an average player? Because of the 'birthright' as you say which to me is saying that there is still an expectation of him being a goto guy, but for no reason. My point is that Marvin isn't failing to reach his potential. This is it. We don't make threads about why Zaza isn't a top center in this league because we don't expect that from him.

[Diesel]

That's exactly my point. "He's not so good". Its not a character flaw or underachieving. This is his talent level. But why do we make a thread about him being an average player? Because of the 'birthright' as you say which to me is saying that there is still an expectation of him being a goto guy, but for no reason. My point is that Marvin isn't failing to reach his potential. This is it. We don't make threads about why Zaza isn't a top center in this league because we don't expect that from him.

My point is why is he still starting? Why are we not playing our best lineup (Joe at 3, Jamal at 2)? Why are we so quick to believe that changing coaches will change him?

Marvin is not so good. Agreed. Why then are we hoping for a change of coaches to make him a better player?

It's the same thing that we see every year... something changes in this team:

Al Harrington Moved, Chillz Moved, New Contract, Flip gone.. and we start believing that these things will make Marvin finally play better... This is the madness I see in Hawksfans year after year. I would have thought that we got it by now, but truth is that we haven't.

[macdaddy]

My point is why is he still starting? Why are we not playing our best lineup (Joe at 3, Jamal at 2)? Why are we so quick to believe that changing coaches will change him?

Marvin is not so good. Agreed. Why then are we hoping for a change of coaches to make him a better player?

It's the same thing that we see every year... something changes in this team:

Al Harrington Moved, Chillz Moved, New Contract, Flip gone.. and we start believing that these things will make Marvin finally play better... This is the madness I see in Hawksfans year after year. I would have thought that we got it by now, but truth is that we haven't.

Yes. I agree with this. I'll be surprised if he starts every game this year.

[jy23]

Every year, weather Sekou or MC or Micheal Lee.. same story... "Marvin knows he has to step up. Blah blah blah... great pressure from fans... blah blah Chris Paul... blah, 2nd overall."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :thumbsupsmileyanim: :laughing5: :lol6:

Dude you are funny, this has made me want to start reading and posting again.....thanks D for bringing me back lol