Would you really want Smoove and Howard on the same team?

[MaceCase]

Dwight Howard has a better career TS% than anyone currently on the Hawks, and probably better than anyone in Atlanta Hawks history. For reference, he blows the hell out of Bob Pettit's and Dominique Wilkins TS%. So I'm not sure how you can call Howard the most offensively flawed player in the NBA. Is that some sort of joke comment? The guy is putting up 33 points against us, if it weren't for him this Orlando team would have won 14 games, seriously. I understand he turns the ball over but you do understand that 33 points on an absolutely ridiculous out of this universe 70% TS% outweighs turnovers, yes? At least it merits him not being mentioned one of the most flawed offensive players in the league... we are talking about a dude who has freaking Hedo Turkoglu and Gilbert Arenas as teamates after all. Seriously, put one decent marginal star on that team along with Dwight and we have no shot at taking this team further than game 5. We have played one against five this whole series and have won only one game convincingly. Dwight and Josh Powell would be a deadly frontcourt for chrisakes. Implying that Josh Smith and Dwight wouldn't work is ridiculous. And yes, having two shotblockers is better than having one. Of course it is. Maybe it wouldn't be the best defensive frontcourt in the history of the NBA but it would be better than Josh + Horford.

Now see I'll stop you because you can't see the forest for the trees. Why is it all of a sudden that when the system that put Dwight and the Magic into the contendership stratosphere in the first place is now flawed because of his teammates? Which is it, I wonder? On the strength of his defense the Magic were a below 500 team but then they add the offensive players and a system to make life easier for Dwight and they launch into the second round, then Finals and Eastern Conference Finals but now that he's losing to us in the first round his teammates and system are hot garbage......Sorry, I'm just not following the logic.

You build a contender around a big man's flaw yet you want to tell me now the guy never had flaws in the first place.....Then why the f*** are you going through so much trouble and burning so much resources to mitigate his flaws? He's shooting phenomenally and scoring a lot of buckets and yet....his team is down 3-1. Do the points really count when he's not making his teammates better? He can manage 50 touches in a half but not even 2 assists in 4 games and barely above 1 for his entire career. Aren't superstars supposed to make their teammates better? You don't think a player is flawed when he is absolutely dominating personally yet it hasn't seemed to make anything easier for his team? You think LD is revolutionary with deciding to guard a bigman 1 on 1 and sticking with his teammates? A JV defense has skyrocketed the Hawks above Orlando yet you think Dwight has nothing to do with that? The guy is neither now nor has he ever been a complete bigman, his dominance has come at the hands of his physical attributes, ability to dominate a watered down position and his defense. He doesn't hold a candle to Shaq or Duncan because they would have eaten up this JV defense a long time ago. You see those guys could pass, extremely well actually and they didn't need 40 3ball shooters on their roster either to do it.

So in closing, you seem to know advanced stats well enough, go look at where Smoove ranks in ORTG, OWS, now look at the Magic roster from 07 onwards and tell me it's a joke to mention these guys as being offensively flawed. If you just don't get it then you just don't get it but aye, that TS sure has won them some games!

[Johnnybravo4]

Yeah a Dwight/Smoove frontcourt would be better than a Dwight.Horford front court. Dwight and Al would get in each other's way on the floor. Al is a PF that plays like a center. He's not all of a sudden going to become a Chris Bosh type of PF. Smoove on the other hand, would thrive in an offense that ran through dwight. He can become the slasher that we always wanted him to be.

Honestly I'd offer Horford and Marvin and see if Orlando will bite. Its a better deal that trading him for an injured Bynum.

[Joker]

I think these points are warranted. Smoove offensive game could work since Smith is a very good passer in the post and can play with Howard but defensively. They are redundant. They have the same strengths and weaknesses with Dwight being smarter, quicker, bigger, and better in everything by a mile. Smith would have to change his defensive style to play with Howard. Not the other way around. I think Horford is more redundant with Howard than Smith. Especially on offense. If Dwight is Bill Russell, Smith is Ben Wallace lite when in top shape.

LOL, saying Smith will be Pietrius, lol stop. He's much better than that. Smith is a hell of the defender. The only thing playing with Dwight will do is cut off his rebounding chances but he would have an easier time trying to score and his other numbers will go up in other areas. He would have to change his defense become more versatile which he's already doing but be real, he's still a hell of a defender.

Edited April 26, 2011 by nbasuperstar40

[Joker]

Well CTC, we all know Dwight not a good passer but he commands a double team. Well, you double him v. the Hawks who also have Joe and Jamal and your *ss will pay a hefty price. Josh Smith who can pass in the post and play any type of defense can as well. Orlando is a shooting team because of outside of Dwight, no one can create their own shot. The Hawks are but mainly a shooting team cause no one can score an easy basket or defenses can clue in on Joe or Jamal since Horford is a PnR PF and Smith is inconsistent on offense. The Hawks with Dwight is lethal because Joe is a Robin and Dwight is a legit batman. You will seriously have issues trying to score on both D12 and Smith. Joe is no slouch either. I worry about the Hawks PG if there is a trade, it will probably be Arenas since we would have to take one of their crap contracts. Hopefully Arenas takes a page out of Collins book and gets in shape. I wonder about SF and backup Center. Zaza will be traded as will Marvin for money reasons. That will hurt us a lot. I don't want Wilkins starting next year, no way.

Edited April 26, 2011 by nbasuperstar40

[Atlantaholic]

Now see I'll stop you because you can't see the forest for the trees. Why is it all of a sudden that when the system that put Dwight and the Magic into the contendership stratosphere in the first place is now flawed because of his teammates? Which is it, I wonder? On the strength of his defense the Magic were a below 500 team but then they add the offensive players and a system to make life easier for Dwight and they launch into the second round, then Finals and Eastern Conference Finals but now that he's losing to us in the first round his teammates and system are hot garbage......Sorry, I'm just not following the logic.

You build a contender around a big man's flaw yet you want to tell me now the guy never had flaws in the first place.....Then why the f*** are you going through so much trouble and burning so much resources to mitigate his flaws? He's shooting phenomenally and scoring a lot of buckets and yet....his team is down 3-1. Do the points really count when he's not making his teammates better? He can manage 50 touches in a half but not even 2 assists in 4 games and barely above 1 for his entire career. Aren't superstars supposed to make their teammates better? You don't think a player is flawed when he is absolutely dominating personally yet it hasn't seemed to make anything easier for his team? You think LD is revolutionary with deciding to guard a bigman 1 on 1 and sticking with his teammates? A JV defense has skyrocketed the Hawks above Orlando yet you think Dwight has nothing to do with that? The guy is neither now nor has he ever been a complete bigman, his dominance has come at the hands of his physical attributes, ability to dominate a watered down position and his defense. He doesn't hold a candle to Shaq or Duncan because they would have eaten up this JV defense a long time ago. You see those guys could pass, extremely well actually and they didn't need 40 3ball shooters on their roster either to do it.

So in closing, you seem to know advanced stats well enough, go look at where Smoove ranks in ORTG, OWS, now look at the Magic roster from 07 onwards and tell me it's a joke to mention these guys as being offensively flawed. If you just don't get it then you just don't get it but aye, that TS sure has won them some games!

You make no sense whatsoever. The Orlando Magic´s rise has everything to do with Howard turning 22 years old. You act like Howard was in his prime when Orlando was missing the playoffs but that is not the the case at all. Since Howard has become the player he is today the Magic have been flat out dominant (52, 59, 59, and 53 wins... a finals appearance and a conference finals appearance), and if it werent for him having the worst supporting cast in the history of playoff basketball they would be smoking us once again. You are blaming Howard for Turkoglu, Richardson, and Jameer shooting a combined 30% from the field? Really? We are daring Howard to beat us and by all intends and purposes he is doing exactly that .He has a ridiculous PER of 30 and we have barely eeked out two of our three wins against them. Howard took a team without anything even remotely resembling another star and he beat a 60 + win team that had destroyed us to make it to the finals. The next year he was the centerpiece on the team that set and ALL TIME NBA PLAYOFF record against us. Lay off the crack pipe. If you put Howard in our team for either Josh, Horford and we are a much better team. Howard leads the universe in Free throw attempts, TS% (among players that actually attempt a high volume of shots), and is the undisputed best defender in the NBA for three years running. On a bad week Howard is an improvement over Horford. I guess Lebron, Russel Westbrook, Derrick Rose, Wade, Steve Nash,Deron Williams etc are all fatally flawed offensive players since they have high turnover rates right? Get real.

Also, how many championships has Shaq won without a first ballot hall of fame all world teammate? Duncan had Ginobli, Parker, David Robinson etc. All players that have made multiple all star teams. The Magic have Jameer Nelson, and... an over the hill VC? Hedo "20% from the field" turgoklu, Grant "25 knee surgeries later" Hill, Rashard "worst contract in the history of professional sports" Lewis. Really, I mean, you are really off base on this one.

Edited April 26, 2011 by Atlantaholic

[Atlantaholic]

Yeah a Dwight/Smoove frontcourt would be better than a Dwight.Horford front court. Dwight and Al would get in each other's way on the floor. Al is a PF that plays like a center. He's not all of a sudden going to become a Chris Bosh type of PF. Smoove on the other hand, would thrive in an offense that ran through dwight. He can become the slasher that we always wanted him to be.

Honestly I'd offer Horford and Marvin and see if Orlando will bite. Its a better deal that trading him for an injured Bynum.

Horford is a perimeter PF. The dude gets to the line like 2 times a game for gods sakes, not to mention the only play we run for him are post ups (which end up in him taking face up jumpers or terrible hook shots) or pick and pops. Horford is not an "inside" offensive player. Howard and Horford would be amazing, better than Josh Howard. Either would assure us of at least 50 wins per season depending on supporting cast.

[Kimsey]

Such a depressing topic, we essentially chose joe over the possibility of paul, dwight, or deron.

Edited April 26, 2011 by Kimsey

[Diesel]

Here's how it would work:

Horf, Zaza, Hinrich, MW, and a first (2013) to Orlando.

Dwight (SNT), Jameer, and Hedo to ATL.

Orlando starts it's fire sale. They start by getting rid of the longer termed contracts that they can move. That's Jameer and Hedo. I think they are stuck with Agent 0. I wouldn't take Agent O.

They wouldn't try a Jrich Joe Swap because JRich is coming off the books.

We're left with:

Jameer, Joe, Hedo, Smoove, and Dwight.

This team is really good.

But you need a coach who will teach the team to play through Dwight. (that's the only way this works).

I say you call up Doc Rivers. No disrespect to LD but I think he's too motion oriented to consider Inside out play.

Orlando would have:

Horf, Bass, Qrich, Redick, and Hinrich for a short time. That team has lots of potential and you still have Orton to develop. SVG is definitely fired. They are also players in the Off season of 2012 knowing that Horf would be better at PF, they will probably either develop Orton or sign somebody in 2012.

[Atlantaholic]

Orlando is not trading Howard to us. That just isn't going to happen. Especially not after this series (antijinx antijinx antijinx). Unless their objective is to lose all fan support forever and move the team out of Florida, that ain't happening.

[niremetal]

If we can get Howard, sure. But as soon as we inked Dwight to a long-term deal, we probably would want to look at trading Smoove. I think having Dwight will make Smoove less of a positive influence in every sense - we wouldn't need his shot-blocking as much, spacing issues would force Josh even more to the perimeter since Dwight never leaves the post area, and having his best friend on the team would give Josh a built-in enabler for his remaining bad habits (namely thinking that he can be a guard).

[AHF]

"Would you really want Smoove and Howard on the same team?"

Yes. Absolutely yes.

If we were ever going to acquire Howard, I would assume that Josh Smith would be one of the reasons he would want to come here so I think that is very likely if you start with the assumption that Dwight decides to come home to Atlanta.

And do I want to see Josh and Dwight playing together in Hawks uniforms? Yes!

[capstone21]

It would be Smith and Howard because it would cost us Horford plus other parts to get Howard.

Smith's trade value is not as high as Al so if Orlando were willing to trade to us it would cost us Horford.

That being said...I would much rather pair Horford with Howard. That would be the best two front court players in the NBA.

[MaceCase]

You make no sense whatsoever. The Orlando Magic´s rise has everything to do with Howard turning 22 years old. You act like Howard was in his prime when Orlando was missing the playoffs but that is not the the case at all. Since Howard has become the player he is today the Magic have been flat out dominant (52, 59, 59, and 53 wins... a finals appearance and a conference finals appearance), and if it werent for him having the worst supporting cast in the history of playoff basketball they would be smoking us once again. You are blaming Howard for Turkoglu, Richardson, and Jameer shooting a combined 30% from the field? Really? We are daring Howard to beat us and by all intends and purposes he is doing exactly that .He has a ridiculous PER of 30 and we have barely eeked out two of our three wins against them. Howard took a team without anything even remotely resembling another star and he beat a 60 + win team that had destroyed us to make it to the finals. The next year he was the centerpiece on the team that set and ALL TIME NBA PLAYOFF record against us. Lay off the crack pipe. If you put Howard in our team for either Josh, Horford and we are a much better team. Howard leads the universe in Free throw attempts, TS% (among players that actually attempt a high volume of shots), and is the undisputed best defender in the NBA for three years running. On a bad week Howard is an improvement over Horford. I guess Lebron, Russel Westbrook, Derrick Rose, Wade, Steve Nash,Deron Williams etc are all fatally flawed offensive players since they have high turnover rates right? Get real.

Also, how many championships has Shaq won without a first ballot hall of fame all world teammate? Duncan had Ginobli, Parker, David Robinson etc. All players that have made multiple all star teams. The Magic have Jameer Nelson, and... an over the hill VC? Hedo "20% from the field" turgoklu, Grant "25 knee surgeries later" Hill, Rashard "worst contract in the history of professional sports" Lewis. Really, I mean, you are really off base on this one.

Holic, if it's your opinion that the Orlando Magic making a big jump from a 40 win team to a perennial 50 win team has no basis on Stan Van Gundy and Otis Smith implementing a system and building a team that maximized Howard's strengths on offense while minimizing his weaknesses then that's just it, your opinion and it has no, nay, zero basis on reality or the current construction of the Magic over that span. So I'll ask this again, why is it now that Howard is struggling to win a first round series that all of a sudden he has the worst supporting cast in history? He only was getting rave reviews and became a contender upon their arrival and how everyone talked about "they are a mismatch nightmare" and "you have to pick your poison with Orlando" but now that he is on the brink of elimination it's all revisionist history and short term memory. Ok, thank you for playing. Run down a list of every accomplishment he has and try to belittle every teammate he has had and I will still simply direct your attention to their past playoff runs and then to tonight's game and demonstrate to you that good teams know that Dwight is a blackhole that just so happens to be really good so you never notice much of his flaws when you are reading a boxscore but if you have any iota of intelligence you don't watch a team scout and spend good money building such a specific team without saying something is up.

Would he be a talent upgrade for the Hawks? Obviously, I've never argued that all I've said is that him and Smoove in the frontcourt WON"T WORK. seeing as that's the point of the thread, right? If it's your thought or thinking that Dwight and whoever = better team, okay that's your prerogative then but longterm and in terms of championship potential then you have to scrap that idea. I don't watch 7 years of a guy and notice him play his best ball next to a stretch 4 and say "you know what he really needs? A 4man that doesn't stretch the floor and operates in the same space he does!" I don't reach such silly conclusions like that and I don't try to excuse my observations by saying that someone with an obviously much lower defensive impact is going to drastically increase his somehow to make it worthwhile. Thus the Pietrus example, good to have, nice asset out there on the perimeter but you get rid of him and the D remains unchanged because Dwight was the one doing all of the heavy lifting regardless. Give Dwight a purer shooter like Kevin Love or explosive face up bigman like Amar'e that can't defend a paper bag and you still have a MUCH better balanced team because he's just that impactful on defense and really just needs help on O. It's not a matter of talent it's a matter of fit, you want to spout off all of Duncan's and Shaq's teammates as if that's the difference but you won't mention how they could and would still get theirs without having to have some ridiculous 1 in 4 out baby offense to do it. But I digress, perhaps I'm just seeing something that you're not, I always just thought that you coached and built your teams around your personnel......

[AHF]

If you replaced Howard with an average center, we would be winning every game by double digits easily and would no longer have the record for victims of the worst playoff sweep in NBA history. The guy is desperately carrying that team but they are just too big of an anchor for him to make any headway against us. I don't blame howard for Orlando's ills this series.

[Joker]

Holic, if it's your opinion that the Orlando Magic making a big jump from a 40 win team to a perennial 50 win team has no basis on Stan Van Gundy and Otis Smith implementing a system and building a team that maximized Howard's strengths on offense while minimizing his weaknesses then that's just it, your opinion and it has no, nay, zero basis on reality or the current construction of the Magic over that span. So I'll ask this again, why is it now that Howard is struggling to win a first round series that all of a sudden he has the worst supporting cast in history? He only was getting rave reviews and became a contender upon their arrival and how everyone talked about "they are a mismatch nightmare" and "you have to pick your poison with Orlando" but now that he is on the brink of elimination it's all revisionist history and short term memory. Ok, thank you for playing. Run down a list of every accomplishment he has and try to belittle every teammate he has had and I will still simply direct your attention to their past playoff runs and then to tonight's game and demonstrate to you that good teams know that Dwight is a blackhole that just so happens to be really good so you never notice much of his flaws when you are reading a boxscore but if you have any iota of intelligence you don't watch a team scout and spend good money building such a specific team without saying something is up.

Would he be a talent upgrade for the Hawks? Obviously, I've never argued that all I've said is that him and Smoove in the frontcourt WON"T WORK. seeing as that's the point of the thread, right? If it's your thought or thinking that Dwight and whoever = better team, okay that's your prerogative then but longterm and in terms of championship potential then you have to scrap that idea. I don't watch 7 years of a guy and notice him play his best ball next to a stretch 4 and say "you know what he really needs? A 4man that doesn't stretch the floor and operates in the same space he does!" I don't reach such silly conclusions like that and I don't try to excuse my observations by saying that someone with an obviously much lower defensive impact is going to drastically increase his somehow to make it worthwhile. Thus the Pietrus example, good to have, nice asset out there on the perimeter but you get rid of him and the D remains unchanged because Dwight was the one doing all of the heavy lifting regardless. Give Dwight a purer shooter like Kevin Love or explosive face up bigman like Amar'e that can't defend a paper bag and you still have a MUCH better balanced team because he's just that impactful on defense and really just needs help on O. It's not a matter of talent it's a matter of fit, you want to spout off all of Duncan's and Shaq's teammates as if that's the difference but you won't mention how they could and would still get theirs without having to have some ridiculous 1 in 4 out baby offense to do it. But I digress, perhaps I'm just seeing something that you're not, I always just thought that you coached and built your teams around your personnel......

I will be honest CTC, this isn't a good post. The Magic didn't put good fits around him, in fact their a terrible fit around D12. This isn't like the Cavs and Lebron. This team doesn't fit around D12. D12 either needs a CP3 or play with Joe Johnson who can create his own shot and create offense for Dwight. To be fair, Joe is the most important player if we can land Dwight, not Josh or Horford. D12 is going to be double no matter what, so space isn't an issue and Josh will have to adjust his game. You are acting like he can't, he just isn't smart and take what's he's given even when what he given isn't that good. It's a lot easier to score when you can get all the clear up points for D12. Something you can rarely do for Horford who is rarely in the post. Pietrus is an awful example, one I don't think anyone can make sense out of. Dwight doesn't have to do so much helf side work and Josh off ball defense is where he really is great at. His help side has actually gotten worst since his eating binge.

Dude, you lost your damn mind with some of this stuff. "Blackhole". You are talking like he's Eddy Curry. The problem they have is no one can create their shot, we have very good to elite defenders from 1-4 and Collins gives him issues where he has to think before he react which is what he used to do when he was younger. Smith and Howard will work much better than Horford and Howard and a thousand times better than Horford and Smith which really doesn't fit which is why everyone in here is looking at you with a wtf expression. Josh Smith is a valuable around 10-15ft as he is around the basket. He does most his scoring around 10-15ft which is what most PF's do their work in. His stats are best around the basket but that's due to tip-ins, dunks, back-cuts from screen with Bibby, and oops.

It seems like your saying Smith isn't ideal with Howard and Kevin Love or Amare would be. You are saying that Josh is defensive. Guess what, your right and wrong. Amare is ideal with Howard and Josh is more ideal than Love with Dwight. I don't even think you though about anything outside of offense and fit. Most of Kevin Love points are from clean up points. Josh points are usually from mid range more than not. Josh doesn't create his offense in the paint, he's usually assisted in the paint. Defensively, you make no sense. If you are talking about rebounds, that's one thing but the rest just sounds stupid. I am utterly clueless to be honest. Shaq and Samaki Walker had the same range too but Walker was at Josh Powell talent level. CTC, you need to really think this through.

My issues with this are two things. No leadership and how serious will Smith and Howard be together. Those are my issues and serious ones as well. But either way, if we can't get CP3, this trade is a must.

[Atlantaholic]

How can players that suck be a good fit??? I don't really understand this logic. The year they won 40 games Howard was 21, their second best player was posting a Per of over 16 and Darko Milicic was one of their most productive players... a god awful team that a young Howard was still able to take to the playoffs. This year's Orlando squad? The second highest Per on the team is Ryan Anderson who is an 8th - 9th man on that team and only played in 64 games. Nobody else on the team has a PER of over 16, no one. The vast majority have a PER of under 14 (league average is 15) and all the players they brought in have had absolutely dreadful seasons. This team wouldn't sniff 30 wins without Dwight, they probably would be battling out with Cleveland and Minnesota for league laughingstock honors. A total joke of a supporting crew, VERY comparable to the one that won 40 games in 2007.

Dwight Howards improvement from 2007 to now btw

2011

22 Pp36 mins

13.5 Rp36 mins

616% TS%

2.4 Bp36 mins

26 PER

2007

17 Pp36

12 Rp36

619% TS%

1.9 Bp36 mins

21 PER

The PERs of the top 5 (in minutes played) rotation players of each squad=

2007

Jameer - 13.9

Turk - 14.2

Grant Hill - 16.2

Darko Milicic - 13.9

Tony Battie - 9.8

Team Fg% 47 Team 3pt% 36

2011

Jameer - 15.4

Brandon Bass - 15.9

Jason Richardson - 13.2

Turkoglu - 13.5

JJ Redick - 12.8

Team Fg% 46 Team 3pth% 37

Obviously the difference isn't Howard becoming the best player in the NBA and the reigning NBA defensive player of the year three years running. It's the addition of J Rich and a bump of 1% in three point percentage.

Get real, man.

Edited April 26, 2011 by Atlantaholic

[thecampster]

Anyone who says no isn't thinking this through so let me do it for you.

Howard patrolling on defense, Smith weakside block threat = every Hawks opponent must jump shoot to win. There will be nothing going on in the lane with those 2 at the 4/5. I don't think many here understand the amount of covering for others' weaknesses Josh does.

Offense:

Howard drawing a double in the post means 3-5 dunks a game for Smith. Brandon Bass or Josh Smith at the 4....I think you take Smith all day long with a cup of coffee to relax and watch the show.

Would you take Hinrich, Crawford, Marvin, Smith, Howard as a starting 5 over what we have now...I'm pretty sure most coaches would drool over the league leading defense that would bring.

[MaceCase]

It's whatever, really. I guess you just can't talk bad about Dwight as it relates to Atlanta because the homers see zero flaws in his game and of course that will also extend to his crib buddy. Maybe I'm just to him what Skip Bayless is to Lebron..... Even dating back to the embarrassment last season where everyone was crying for a Dwight stopper I was saying f*** him, stop his teammates and he'll lose. Sound familiar? You know, it's only been what Boston and LA also did to eliminate him yet anyways can't be his fault because check out his stats maaaaaayn. Woj had an article couple days back about Carmelo and his 40 point game against the Celtics and how Melo felt that he can't be criticized or was immune to blame for the loss cuz he got his and how detestable that type of thinking was, well the Squawk applies the same mentality to Dwight. It's alright though, I have my opinion based on the strategies I see applied and you guys have yours based on the stats you wish to pick and choose to prove your points and what you envision to be ideal. In the end the final results are going to look the same as always so on to the next topic.

[atlbraves93]

The Hawks can't pass up on an opportunity to sign Dwight. I understand the reasons why you wouldn't want him (offensively inefficient, foul prone, turnover prone, complains a lot). But the positives to signing D12 simply outweigh the negatives. First, he has averaged 13 rebounds per game during his career. The Hawks finished 27th in rebounding this year. The boost he will provide in rebounds alone will translate to more wins. Second, he will get people excited about Hawks basketball. The Hawks have some good players, but nobody who puts more fans in the seats. Dwight will do that. Lastly, he is a huge upgrade over whoever the Hawks have at center. You can nitpick at Dwight's game, but it is a fact that he is far and away better than any current Hawks big man. Adding Dwight Howard will make the Hawks a title contender.

[Atlantaholic]

It's whatever, really. I guess you just can't talk bad about Dwight as it relates to Atlanta because the homers see zero flaws in his game and of course that will also extend to his crib buddy. Maybe I'm just to him what Skip Bayless is to Lebron..... Even dating back to the embarrassment last season where everyone was crying for a Dwight stopper I was saying f*** him, stop his teammates and he'll lose. Sound familiar? You know, it's only been what Boston and LA also did to eliminate him yet anyways can't be his fault because check out his stats maaaaaayn. Woj had an article couple days back about Carmelo and his 40 point game against the Celtics and how Melo felt that he can't be criticized or was immune to blame for the loss cuz he got his and how detestable that type of thinking was, well the Squawk applies the same mentality to Dwight. It's alright though, I have my opinion based on the strategies I see applied and you guys have yours based on the stats you wish to pick and choose to prove your points and what you envision to be ideal. In the end the final results are going to look the same as always so on to the next topic.

So basically you have an opinion (clearly extremely biased) based on nothing but your subjective qualitative analysis, and everyone else that follows the NBA gives you his Career stats, efficiency numbers, NBA All star apperances, All NBA first team selections, team performance history, playoff statistics etc. etc. etc. Hilarious that you call me out on "picking and choosing stats" when I'm giving you ALL the stats. What other stat do you want? what other non subjective measuring stick of his absolute dominance do you need? How about he is one of four players in NBA history to average 20 points and 13 + rebounds in the playoffs (Moses Malone, Bob Petitt, Wilt Chamberlain are the others).

And your main point is that "all you have to do to stop Dwight is stop his teamates???" Do you know how stupid that sounds? That's only true for every star player that has played professional basketball. And when you are saying that people are saying he has no flaws you are clearly also trying to put words in peoples mouths that they never said just to detract from the weakness of your arguments. Howard has flaws. They are, in order of importance.

-He shoots poorly from the line

-He can't pass

When you weigh it against what he can do.

-Rebound better than anyone in the NBA

-Block more than anyone in the NBA

-top 10 in scoring in the NBA

-Score more efficiently than anyone else in the top 40 in PPG

-Win the best defensive player of the year award for three straight years (one of three players in NBA history to do this)

-Lead a team to four straight 50 win seasons (When was the last time the Hawks have had four straight 50 win seasons... the 1950's??)

-Lead a team to the NBA finals

-Lead a team to five straight seasons of being in the top 6 in deffensive efficiency. ( a frontcourt of Rashard freaking Lewis and Dwight Howard finished first in defensive efficiency in back to back seasons and Josh Smith + Dwight wouldn't work... LMFAO

You are a Dwight hater... that is basically your only argument here.