Houston will pursue Josh Smith if they fail to get Dwight Howard

[Joker]

I would stop watching the Hawks if they do something this stupid. Martin is a 6th man and not even that good for Josh Smith even as throw in. A mid first is what. Tyler Zeller? If it's Kendall Marshall I would be less mad so maybe it's not all bad.

Edited June 26, 2012 by Joker

[Admin]

I've been one of those who said Martin and one of those mid-teen picks would be good for Josh IMO. I don't think it's equal talent for equal talent per se; however I do feel Martin could easily replace the scoring that Josh provided and we'd be more willing to pursue a true center and move Al to PF making our team more dynamic.I love what Josh brings, but some of the things he brings are a detriment to this team. His untimely long range shots, his reluctancy to give the ball up on the break, his constant arguing with the refs, all these things I feel hurt our team in the long run.Martin gives you very little on defense and is injury prone, so that hurts you. He's also in a contract year meaning he'll be giving it everything he has to get that next payday, whether it's in Atlanta or somewhere else. Our teams needs better rebounding, better man defense in the paint, getting to the charity stripe more often, better halfcourt offense and more consistency. Martin certainly doesn't offer an answer to all those, but he can help with a few of them. That #14 or #16 pick could help address some of the other issues.

100% agreed! Martin would be my 2nd choice from Houston, well behind Lowry, but I'd damn sure rather have him and mid-1st round pick than lose Josh for nothing.

[ag82]

When did he request to be traded? I heard him say he wants to stay and retire a Hawk. Unless we get a great OFFER, I agree, he should retire a Hawk.Martin will be a bench in a month. Jamal Crawford part 2.

I can't link from phone, just google: josh smith trade request

[Joker]

I thought we were trying to win deals now. This is a loss. We got Jamal for Acie and scrubs. We got Bibby for Shelden and scrubs. You mean to tell me you want Josh Smith trade for a mid first and Kevin Martin? You do realize that Marcus Morris was a mid first. So was Pat Patterson. Those two are scrubs right now. K-Mart is Jamal Crawford like.

Edited June 26, 2012 by Joker

[Joker]

If we do this deal, I will drop this team. Ferry would be another line of stupidity. I will be gone. I can't do stupidity and mediocrity any longer. Trading top talents for bench players equals titles when your team isn't even that great.

[Watchman]

I thought we were trying to win deals now. This is a loss. We got Jamal for Acie and scrubs. We got Bibby for Shelden and scrubs. You mean to tell me you want Josh Smith trade for a mid first and Kevin Martin? You do realize that Marcus Morris was a mid first. So was Pat Patterson. Those two are scrubs right now. K-Mart is Jamal Crawford like.

Josh Smith was a mid first. Your point is? Edited June 26, 2012 by Watchman

[Admin]

I thought we were trying to win deals now. This is a loss. We got Jamal for Acie and scrubs. We got Bibby for Shelden and scrubs. You mean to tell me you want Josh Smith trade for a mid first and Kevin Martin? You do realize that Marcus Morris was a mid first. So was Pat Patterson. Those two are scrubs right now. K-Mart is Jamal Crawford like.

The biggest way we lose is if Josh Smith walks and we get nothing in return.We have hired a GM that we have to trust will make a good pick with whatever picks he has to work with. Give him a proven NBA starter and that pick and that's about as good of a value as you're going to get for a player regarded as a malconent who's on an expiring contract.

[Joker]

Kevin Martin. That s-curl Jamal Crawford no defense player. Man, this would turn the Hawks in the treadmill of the year team.

[Admin]

Kevin Martin. That s-curl Jamal Crawford no defense player. Man, this would turn the Hawks in the treadmill of the year team.

And the ghost of Josh Smith after he leaves the team would turn the Hawks into what, a defensive juggernaut?

[AHF]

however I do feel Martin could easily replace the scoring that Josh provided and we'd be more willing to pursue a true center and move Al to PF making our team more dynamic.

Martin could replace Josh's scoring in much the same way that Tyson Chandler could replace Joe Johnson's rebounding.The problem comes with losing Josh's impact on the other side of the floor and the lack of financial flexibility to pursue a true center. Doing this trade does absolutely nothing to make it any easier for us to acquire a true center unless you are using the pick we acquire to draft one.

[Jody23]

I thought we were trying to win deals now. This is a loss. We got Jamal for Acie and scrubs. We got Bibby for Shelden and scrubs. You mean to tell me you want Josh Smith trade for a mid first and Kevin Martin? You do realize that Marcus Morris was a mid first. So was Pat Patterson. Those two are scrubs right now. K-Mart is Jamal Crawford like.

Josh Smith was a mid first also at 17. I'm not endorsing a deal with Houston necessarily, but the Hawks will have to trade Josh and because they've waited until this point, the offers aren't going to be the fairy tale deals they desire.

[Joker]

And the ghost of Josh Smith after he leaves the team would turn the Hawks into what, a defensive juggernaut?

I just hate the idea of another Jamal Crawford with even worse defense. I was so happy to see him go but according to some fans now we can have another one.

[Watchman]

Josh Smith was a mid first also at 17. I'm not endorsing a deal with Houston necessarily, but the Hawks will have to trade Josh and because they've waited until this point, the offers aren't going to be the fairy tale deals they desire.

I agree. I am not particularly interested in dealing with Houston. I'm not interested in Martin or Scola.

[Admin]

I just hate the idea of another Jamal Crawford with even worse defense. I was so happy to see him go but according to some fans now we can have another one.

You're completely missing our point. Once more, we're ONLY interested in this as an ALTERNATIVE to losing Josh Smith for NOTHING. Of course we'd like to find better deals, but we can only make deals that are actually out there, in the real NBA.

[AHF]

I just hate the idea of another Jamal Crawford with even worse defense. I was so happy to see him go but according to some fans now we can have another one.

.595 ts% >> .525 ts%Not sure why these guys would be compared on offense. They are in completely different levels. Crawford and Martin are both weak on defense but they aren't substitutes for eachother.I don't like the idea of a Martin/14 for Josh, but don't want to mischaracterize it either. Edited June 26, 2012 by AHF

[Admin]

.595 ts% >> .525 ts%Not sure why these guys would be compared on offense. They are in completely different levels. Crawford and Martin are both weak on defense but they aren't substitutes for eachother.

Agreed, I thought that was pretty silly. Actually I posted a comparison not long ago of Joe vs Martin and Martin beats Joe in almost every meaningful category. Defense is the only area where he's sub-par.

[Joker]

Martin would be replacing Jamal's scoring which we never gained back. Without Smith, you would have to play defense like Miami in the playoffs without a rim protector and we still need a playmaking PG, true center, and now a rim protector. This is a really bad deal. We can just sign Jamal in FA if we want Jamal back. No way could Kevin start without killing our defense to an epic degree. Worse than even Jamal since we would lose Josh. This is dumb. Two mid 1st or Ferry is a terrible GM period.

[Joker]

.595 ts% >> .525 ts%Not sure why these guys would be compared on offense. They are in completely different levels. Crawford and Martin are both weak on defense but they aren't substitutes for eachother.I don't like the idea of a Martin/14 for Josh, but don't want to mischaracterize it either.

That's because he's not stupid on offense like Jamal but Jamal can actually play man D but his team D terrible. Martin is terrible on all aspect of defense. Jamal takes a lot of stupid shots. Jamal has low BBIQ, Martin is good BBIQ. Edited June 26, 2012 by Joker

[AHF]

Martin would be replacing Jamal's scoring which we never gained back.

Martin would do much more than simply replace Jamal's scoring. I think we can do better than this deal but if it were to happen then JJ becomes our second option on offense and we are significantly more dangerous than we were with Jamal in terms of our backcourt offense. Edited June 26, 2012 by AHF

[Joker]

Martin would do much more than simply replace Jamal's scoring. I think we can do better than this deal but if it were to happen then JJ becomes our second option on offense and we are significantly more dangerous than we were with Jamal in terms of our backcourt offense.

Martin is not a 1st option. Teams don't respect his game like that. I watched a lot of Kings/Rockets games. He is more like Jamal than Joe. Joe would still be a #1 option. He has no playmaking skills. He can be selfish and he plays no defense. He is basically a scorer. That's his only true skill. He would replace Jamal. His usage rate is amazingly high. Nothing about this says he is any good for us as a team. Edited June 26, 2012 by Joker