Magic's advise to Cuban

[Jody23]

Some of you still believe in pipe dreams. Do any of you even watch the rest of the league and know who the players are? This is a PLOY by Magic to bring in MORE TALENT to the Lakers. NOT to help the Mavs and especially the Hawks From Jody: "This is the beginning of the mind games. Is Magic sincerely trying to help the Mavericks? Does he desire any one on the Maverick's roster in a trade? The answer to both questions is likely no" Jody, let me ask you this. If you're the Los Angeles Lakers, and your team is struggling big time WITH Dwight Howard. And your other post man in Pau Gasol has been relegated to secondary status. And Nash is still trying to get back to where he was last year, let alone at an All-Star level. And you have one of the worst benches in the league. Does keeping Dwight REALLY help the Lakers in the short term? Remember, this is a Laker franchise that is all about winning NOW, and they have that mentality every year. If they truly think that Dwight does not fit with the team ( although I think they need a legit coach that knows how to handle those players ), then they may look to pull the trigger on a trade that will bring them assets. See, what the rest of you do not understand, is that there is such of a thing as addition by subtraction, even if it means giving up a significant player. When Magic says that the Mavs should "give away the farm" to get Dwight, he's really saying ( give us 3 or 4 of your rotation players that D'Antoni can use, so that we can become a strong TEAM once again . . and YOU can have that pipe dream of signing Dwight ) It has nothing to do with Dwight and Atlanta. Magic simply threw out our name . . and Brooklyn's . . because those are the 2 teams that have been rumored to want to bring Dwight in. But keep in mind that Dwight has only said that he'd play for one of those teams . . . BROOKLYN . . . and not ATLANTA. And yes, if these trade rumors to Atlanta are to be taken seriously, he NEEDS to say that he is at least looking at us to come here. Until that day comes, you have to assume that he DOES NOT want to come here. And his silence would be just another instance in which the Hawks are used by a player to get what he wants from some other team. If the Mavs offered the Lakers Shawn Marion ( SF ), OJ Mayo ( G ), Chris Kaman ( C ), and Rodrigue Beaubois ( PG ) for Dwight Howard, I would almost bet the house that the Lakers . . a franchise who is ALWAYS in win now mode . . . would jump at that. Why? Because if the Lakers did that, this would be their team. PG - NashG - KobeF - World PeacePF - MarionC - Gasol 6th - Mayo7th - Kaman8th - Jamison9th - Beubois10th - Hill Why would they do this? Because these are the very type of players in which Mike D'Antoni can get the most out of. It's obvious that he doesn't have a clue as to what to do with Dwight Howard and Pau Gasol. So this trade opens everything up for him, and would get the Lakers right back on track by bringing in a bunch of decent players to solidify their depth. This has nothing to do with the Hawks folks. It's definitely mind games by Magic, to see if Cuban would be willing to send him legit talent to help the Lakers, in order for Cuban to get his big fish in Dwight. And Cuban's ego would make him believe that if he got Dwight, he could lure other talent to Dallas and help them get back in the mix in the West.

I usually agree with you North, but I can't here. The Lakers, an organization notorious for screwing over other organizations in trades, are not going to trade Dwight for piece mill players, let alone to the Mavericks, a team in their own conference. Not gonna happen. They'd demand far better offers than OJ Mayo and Chris Kaman. Magic knows that and the Lakers know that. Propose that trade to Laker fans and see what they say.Now, I don't think the Lakers will trade Dwight or even consider it unless things get obscenely bad or they can completely rip someone off. As far as Atlanta, sure we're a long shot. But do you think Ferry was foolish for trying to get him this summer, but couldn't simply because the Magic wanted him out of the division? Do you honestly think Ferry will be foolish for pursuing him AGAIN this summer? Well, call him a fool, because it looks like that's what he intends to do.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

I usually agree with you North, but I can't here. The Lakers, an organization notorious for screwing over other organizations in trades, are not going to trade Dwight for piece mill players, let alone to the Mavericks, a team in their own conference. Not gonna happen. They'd demand far better offers than OJ Mayo and Chris Kaman. Magic knows that and the Lakers know that. Propose that trade to Laker fans and see what they say.Now, I don't think the Lakers will trade Dwight or even consider it unless things get obscenely bad or they can completely rip someone off. As far as Atlanta, sure we're a long shot. But do you think Ferry was foolish for trying to get him this summer, but couldn't simply because the Magic wanted him out of the division? Do you honestly think Ferry will be foolish for pursuing him AGAIN this summer? Well, call him a fool, because it looks like that's what he intends to do.

If the Hawks were really serious about obtaining Dwight, they would've traded both Al Horford and Josh Smith for Dwight.

From what I saw last year, Ferry offered nothing more than a bunch of 1st round picks for Dwight. Trading Horford or Smith or both was never in the mix. So to me, that means that Ferry didn't seriously go after the guy.

It'll be easier for a team to get him this summer, because you're dealing directly with HIM, and not the Orlando Magic ( who had all of the control last year ).

Laker fans want Gasol traded. But no team is going to give them something significant for Gasol ( unless they're a playoff level team that needs a big man ). What they CAN get, are a bunch of decent players for Howard, still have their alpha dog in Kobe, and see if Gasol can get out of his funk ( which was caused by that idiot D'Antoni playing him on the outside instead of in the paint ).

To me, D'Antoni is the problem. His system is garbage. It was a total failure in New York, which is why he got canned. He had no idea how to use Melo and Amare. And D'Antoni does a lot like Drew, in which he asks soft and weak defensive players, to play "tougher" and better defense. So now D'Antoni is running Kobe into the ground, asking him to be the defensive stopper, as well as the offensive go-to guy. And now people wonder why Kobe's shooting has been off lately?

Phil Jackson is probably somewhere laughing his azz off. Jerry Buss ( Lakers owner ) let his ego get in the way, when Phil basically asked for the house, in order to coach the Lakers. They thought D'Antoni would be a better alternative. He isn't.

The Lakers were/will actually be better off with letting Bernie Bickerstaff finish the year.

[Kimsey]

Dwight had NO CONTROL over where he wanted to go. It was the Orlando Magic who didn't like the deal for Dwight. They weren't a believer in Lopez ( although they look stupid as hell now for not taking the Brooklyn deal ).

If Orlando wanted to, they could've traded him to the Bobcats last year. What Orlando TRIED to do, is not only get the best deal possible for themselves, but to trade Howard to a place where he wanted to go.

The Hawks have never been on that list, and Orlando was reportedly on record as saying that they would not trade Howard within the division.

Once again, Dwight techincally has NO CONTROL on where he wants to go as of right now. If a team wanted him just for a one year rental, and the Lakers were willing to deal with them, he could be traded to that team right now.

I'm guessing you forgot the Early Termination Option. He let the Orlando Brass brainwash him into doing something he didn't want to do and it cost him his back injury directly or indirectly. Again, the Nets acquired Dwill and enough room to accommodate him, the perfect scenario.

[AHawks89]

Like I've said all year, I'm betting that Smoove and Dwight will be both in Dallas next season.

[macdaddy]

Like I've said all year, I'm betting that Smoove and Dwight will be both in Dallas next season.

If that happens then i expect Rick Carlisle to be in the insane asylum by February 2014.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

I'm guessing you forgot the Early Termination Option. He let the Orlando Brass brainwash him into doing something he didn't want to do and it cost him his back injury directly or indirectly. Again, the Nets acquired Dwill and enough room to accommodate him, the perfect scenario.

I didn't forget that at all. He exercised that option in 2011. He didn't get traded until 2012. Once he exercised that option, he lost all control over where he could go. And even though Brooklyn did all of that, it was STILL up to Orlando to pull the trigger. And they didn't.

Dwight had no control over whether he could go to Brooklyn last summer.

If that happens then i expect Rick Carlisle to be in the insane asylum by February 2014.

Well if that's the case, what would happen to Drew if we acquired both Smith and Howard?

[Kimsey]

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7690664/dwight-howard-signed-waiver-opt-orlando-magic-contract

"The Magic center had the option of ending his five-year deal in July and entering the open market."

He could have left Orlando and sign freely with Brooklyn. The Magic couldn't do anything to stop him except some guilt trip. I'm through "debating" on this board, it's an utter waste of time.

[coachx]

Dwight had NO CONTROL over where he wanted to go. It was the Orlando Magic who didn't like the deal for Dwight. They weren't a believer in Lopez ( although they look stupid as hell now for not taking the Brooklyn deal ).

If Orlando wanted to, they could've traded him to the Bobcats last year. What Orlando TRIED to do, is not only get the best deal possible for themselves, but to trade Howard to a place where he wanted to go.

The Hawks have never been on that list, and Orlando was reportedly on record as saying that they would not trade Howard within the division.

Once again, Dwight techincally has NO CONTROL on where he wants to go as of right now. If a team wanted him just for a one year rental, and the Lakers were willing to deal with them, he could be traded to that team right now.

He had more control then your letting on.

By saying he only wanted to play for Brooklyn or LA its makes other teams scared to trade their best offer to Orlando in fear he leaves them in free agency. If he did not go public with his list of teams Orlando would have been flooded with more offers from more teams.

[coachx]

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7690664/dwight-howard-signed-waiver-opt-orlando-magic-contract

"The Magic center had the option of ending his five-year deal in July and entering the open market."

He could have left Orlando and sign freely with Brooklyn. The Magic couldn't do anything to stop him except some guilt trip. I'm through "debating" on this board, it's an utter waste of time.

That was a vialble option until he required back surgery. That back surgery was a game changer.

[Jody23]

If the Hawks were really serious about obtaining Dwight, they would've traded both Al Horford and Josh Smith for Dwight. From what I saw last year, Ferry offered nothing more than a bunch of 1st round picks for Dwight. Trading Horford or Smith or both was never in the mix. So to me, that means that Ferry didn't seriously go after the guy. It'll be easier for a team to get him this summer, because you're dealing directly with HIM, and not the Orlando Magic ( who had all of the control last year ). Laker fans want Gasol traded. But no team is going to give them something significant for Gasol ( unless they're a playoff level team that needs a big man ). What they CAN get, are a bunch of decent players for Howard, still have their alpha dog in Kobe, and see if Gasol can get out of his funk ( which was caused by that idiot D'Antoni playing him on the outside instead of in the paint ). To me, D'Antoni is the problem. His system is garbage. It was a total failure in New York, which is why he got canned. He had no idea how to use Melo and Amare. And D'Antoni does a lot like Drew, in which he asks soft and weak defensive players, to play "tougher" and better defense. So now D'Antoni is running Kobe into the ground, asking him to be the defensive stopper, as well as the offensive go-to guy. And now people wonder why Kobe's shooting has been off lately? Phil Jackson is probably somewhere laughing his azz off. Jerry Buss ( Lakers owner ) let his ego get in the way, when Phil basically asked for the house, in order to coach the Lakers. They thought D'Antoni would be a better alternative. He isn't. The Lakers were/will actually be better off with letting Bernie Bickerstaff finish the year.

Really? So was Ferry serious when he traded Joe for cap space knowing we would take a step back short term? Was he serious when he traded Marvin for cap space as well? You think Josh Smith thinks Ferry is serious? None of us knows what Ferry offered Orlando, but we do know Ferry wasn't hired nor did he take this job to play games. Nor did he take this job to keep the Hawks as the flag ship standard for mediocrity. He took this job to build a LEGIT winner. He may not be Jerry West, but he's trying to build a championship team. Just because he reportedly didn't offer BOTH Al and Josh for Howard doesn't mean he wasn't serious.And then there's Josh who's reportedly been trying to get out of mediocrity heaven for at least two years. He all of a sudden changes his tune even though Ferry turns the team into journeymen and cap space. You think Josh wants to stay because Ferry's going to go hard after more mediocrity? Moreover, taking Ferry out of it, you think Josh doesn't know what Howard's thinking? Again, sure Atlanta is a long shot, but I don't think he would be hoarding cap space with the clear intent to take another shot at Howard if he didn't think he had a shot.

[TheNorthCydeRises]

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/7690664/dwight-howard-signed-waiver-opt-orlando-magic-contract

"The Magic center had the option of ending his five-year deal in July and entering the open market."

He could have left Orlando and sign freely with Brooklyn. The Magic couldn't do anything to stop him except some guilt trip. I'm through "debating" on this board, it's an utter waste of time.

That's what I said though. Once he opted back in, he lost control of where he wanted to go. If he had become a UFA, he would've had a lot more control. Total control.

But last summer, he left his fate in the hands of Orlando management. They didn't like the Brooklyn deal, so they brokered that 4 team deal that involved Dwight.

[Brotha2ThaNite]

Some of you still believe in pipe dreams. Do any of you even watch the rest of the league and know who the players are?

This is a PLOY by Magic to bring in MORE TALENT to the Lakers. NOT to help the Mavs and especially the Hawks

From Jody:

"This is the beginning of the mind games. Is Magic sincerely trying to help the Mavericks? Does he desire any one on the Maverick's roster in a trade? The answer to both questions is likely no"

Jody, let me ask you this. If you're the Los Angeles Lakers, and your team is struggling big time WITH Dwight Howard. And your other post man in Pau Gasol has been relegated to secondary status. And Nash is still trying to get back to where he was last year, let alone at an All-Star level. And you have one of the worst benches in the league. Does keeping Dwight REALLY help the Lakers in the short term?

Remember, this is a Laker franchise that is all about winning NOW, and they have that mentality every year. If they truly think that Dwight does not fit with the team ( although I think they need a legit coach that knows how to handle those players ), then they may look to pull the trigger on a trade that will bring them assets.

See, what the rest of you do not understand, is that there is such of a thing as addition by subtraction, even if it means giving up a significant player. When Magic says that the Mavs should "give away the farm" to get Dwight, he's really saying ( give us 3 or 4 of your rotation players that D'Antoni can use, so that we can become a strong TEAM once again . . and YOU can have that pipe dream of signing Dwight )

It has nothing to do with Dwight and Atlanta. Magic simply threw out our name . . and Brooklyn's . . because those are the 2 teams that have been rumored to want to bring Dwight in. But keep in mind that Dwight has only said that he'd play for one of those teams . . . BROOKLYN . . . and not ATLANTA.

And yes, if these trade rumors to Atlanta are to be taken seriously, he NEEDS to say that he is at least looking at us to come here. Until that day comes, you have to assume that he DOES NOT want to come here. And his silence would be just another instance in which the Hawks are used by a player to get what he wants from some other team.

If the Mavs offered the Lakers Shawn Marion ( SF ), OJ Mayo ( G ), Chris Kaman ( C ), and Rodrigue Beaubois ( PG ) for Dwight Howard, I would almost bet the house that the Lakers . . a franchise who is ALWAYS in win now mode . . . would jump at that. Why? Because if the Lakers did that, this would be their team.

PG - Nash

G - Kobe

F - World Peace

PF - Marion

C - Gasol

6th - Mayo

7th - Kaman

8th - Jamison

9th - Beubois

10th - Hill

Why would they do this? Because these are the very type of players in which Mike D'Antoni can get the most out of. It's obvious that he doesn't have a clue as to what to do with Dwight Howard and Pau Gasol. So this trade opens everything up for him, and would get the Lakers right back on track by bringing in a bunch of decent players to solidify their depth.

This has nothing to do with the Hawks folks. It's definitely mind games by Magic, to see if Cuban would be willing to send him legit talent to help the Lakers, in order for Cuban to get his big fish in Dwight.

And Cuban's ego would make him believe that if he got Dwight, he could lure other talent to Dallas and help them get back in the mix in the West.

Northcyde why you throwing bows???

You are that same person who thought either Daron Williams or CP3 (I can't remember which one you keep trashing. I think it was CP3) wasn't worth the 2nd pick in the draft the year the Hawks had to #2 pick. lol

Edited January 22, 2013 by Brotha2ThaNite

[Brotha2ThaNite]

And then there is this... http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/225723/Source_Nets_Preparing_To_Pursue_Trade_For_Dwight Brotha, any thoughts?

It could happen but Dwight and D-Will aren't cool with each other.

Still we won't know anything until the end of the season. That's when D-Howard with go where he wants to.

[AHawks89]

Who were the posters who were SO AGAINST trading Joe Johnson? LOL

[Admin]

Automatic message This topic has been moved from "Atlanta Hawks Forums / HomeCourt" to "Atlanta Hawks Forums / Around The NBA".

[Guest]

Dolfan just wondering if Hawks are mentioned in an article it still doesnt belong in homecourt?