Cap space article.

[Peoriabird]

We need to pump our brakes on Memphis. What have they won?

A whole lot of games and are still in the playoffs. You championship or bust people are starting to get on my nerves. This is entertainment and the product that Drew put out there with Smith was just not very entertaining because it was just bad basketball. You Atlanta fans need to chill because expecting your team to be the best and you as fans are the worst is just plain retarded.

[Peoriabird]

I certainly get not wanting to build around Jefferson but there's also Bynum and Pekovic who could be legit pieces of a championship team.

Why do you continue to mention this guy's name knowing that he is a restricted free agent? Under what circumstances would Minnesota not match any offer from a rival team?

[Buzzard]

Why do you continue to mention this guy's name knowing that he is a restricted free agent? Under what circumstances would Minnesota not match any offer from a rival team?

Pekovic has only been in the NBA 3 full seasons and is only 11 months older than Hibbert ( five full seasons for Hibbert ). Don't sleep on this Euro player. Barring injury he is going to be a quality starting center for a very long time.

Edited May 16, 2013 by Buzzard

[MaceCase]

Pekovic has only been in the NBA 3 full seasons and is only 11 months older than Hibbert ( five full seasons for Hibbert ). Don't sleep on this Euro player. Barring injury he is going to be a quality starting center for a very long time.

You are still missing his point in that he is a RFA.........

[Admin]

I agree with AHF in that none of these secondary scenarios are championship caliber and worse, they are robbing the team of the flexibility to become championship caliber by both eating up necessary cap to swing a deal for true stars later either through future free agencies or trades and then not being bad enough to warrant a high enough draft pick.

Even with just Horford (come on now, stop the homerism) this is a team more likely to go the Indiana route where it's stuck in limbo for a few years at the 9th-10th seed in the East with talented prospects and no long term salary commitments. They waited to see if their young guys could make it to the playoffs first before deciding on adding high price veterans and still maintain cap flexibility to this day. Much rather go that route and tweak as need be than throwing out large dollar contracts this one summer and lock into mediocrity.

It's not homerism to think that Horford, Lou, Jenkins, probably Teague, Scott, 2 1st round picks and filler would make the playoffs in the East. Not that I'm hoping for that, but that's a team that's too good to really be able to tank.

[Admin]

Why do you continue to mention this guy's name knowing that he is a restricted free agent? Under what circumstances would Minnesota not match any offer from a rival team?

There are rumblings that Minnesota might not want to match a $12 million a year offer for him. I don't necessarily believe them, but it's possible. Not many thought that NY or Chicago would let Lin and Asik leave in RFA last year but it happened. So yeah, until the day comes that he's re-signed with the Wolves I will continue to mention his name as he's a great fit for this team.

[GameTime]

It's not homerism to think that Horford, Lou, Jenkins, probably Teague, Scott, 2 1st round picks and filler would make the playoffs in the East. Not that I'm hoping for that, but that's a team that's too good to really be able to tank.

Actually it is. Unless you think Al Horford is gonna average 30-12, this team screams below average. I see 9th at best; 13th at worse. Horford, Lou, Teague big 3. LOL

[MaceCase]

It's not homerism to think that Horford, Lou, Jenkins, probably Teague, Scott, 2 1st round picks and filler would make the playoffs in the East. Not that I'm hoping for that, but that's a team that's too good to really be able to tank.

How is that team much better than say the Sixers of this season or Pacers/Bucks of the past? In fact, each and every one of those rookies/sophomores are probably worse individually and as a unit than the Joshes, Marvins, Sheldens etc we trotted out in the past as a bottom dweller. Horford and a recovering from ACL Lou can't lift a team sporting 4 1st and 2nd year players into the playoffs as anything better than an 8th seed and even then, if you are sitting at the All Star break battling between the 8-10 seeds, why would you continue to fight given the importance of the next draft?

There are rumblings that Minnesota might not want to match a $12 million a year offer for him. I don't necessarily believe them, but it's possible. Not many thought that NY or Chicago would let Lin and Asik leave in RFA last year but it happened. So yeah, until the day comes that he's re-signed with the Wolves I will continue to mention his name as he's a great fit for this team.

NY and Chicago were in entirely different tax situations with two players that were largely considered to be bench players. Minnesota has the cap to retain a max offer for Pek and still not touch the tax.

[Buzzard]

You are still missing his point in that he is a RFA.........

That is really a fact not a point. Minny has 37.7 in guaranteed contracts going into FA. If they sign Nikola to something near max or max early in the FA process ( your 3 day rule ) they can toss out most of their FA money this season and next.

They may very well match but they will not like it. Especially if they have to do it early. Make your offer. He either jumps like a Boozer on sound advice from his agent or waits giving his team a chance to grab a FA.

[Admin]

Actually it is. Unless you think Al Horford is gonna average 30-12, this team screams below average. I see 9th at best; 13th at worse. Horford, Lou, Teague big 3. LOL

Well yes if we only had 3-4 players but you are forgetting that we're going to have another 9-10 players on the roster and we're not going to sign bottom of the barrel guys.

[Buzzard]

How is that team much better than say the Sixers of this season or Pacers/Bucks of the past? In fact, each and every one of those rookies/sophomores are probably worse individually and as a unit than the Joshes, Marvins, Sheldens etc we trotted out in the past as a bottom dweller. Horford and a recovering from ACL Lou can't lift a team sporting 4 1st and 2nd year players into the playoffs as anything better than an 8th seed and even then, if you are sitting at the All Star break battling between the 8-10 seeds, why would you continue to fight given the importance of the next draft?

NY and Chicago were in entirely different tax situations with two players that were largely considered to be bench players. Minnesota has the cap to retain a max offer for Pek and still not touch the tax.

No doubt but 12 mill plus 37 mill = 49 mill in guaranteed contracts. Exactly where you do not want to be if another piece is your goal this season.

[Admin]

How is that team much better than say the Sixers of this season or Pacers/Bucks of the past? In fact, each and every one of those rookies/sophomores are probably worse individually and as a unit than the Joshes, Marvins, Sheldens etc we trotted out in the past as a bottom dweller. Horford and a recovering from ACL Lou can't lift a team sporting 4 1st and 2nd year players into the playoffs as anything better than an 8th seed and even then, if you are sitting at the All Star break battling between the 8-10 seeds, why would you continue to fight given the importance of the next draft?

NY and Chicago were in entirely different tax situations with two players that were largely considered to be bench players. Minnesota has the cap to retain a max offer for Pek and still not touch the tax.

It depends on who else the other 9-10 players are on the roster. I suspect that we'll have guys like Korver, Devin, etc. who are productive vets to fill out the roster. You are right about Lou recovering from his ACL as that will slow him down most likely. I'm optimistic that the guys we get at 17-18 can come in and contribute in some form as well to at least be better than the end of the bench guys we had this year.

How would you suggest tanking then in that situation, just tell the players to quit trying? I can't see the guys doing that and to be honest until Horford proves that he can't be in the playoffs then I'm going to expect him to be in there. 2 straight national championships and now what 6 straight NBA playoff appearances it's been forever since he's been on a team who hasn't been at least a playoff team.

Yes NY and Chicago were in different positions with their cap but that still doesn't mean Minnesota will absolutely positively match a max offer to Pekovic. I'm disappointed that we can't offer more than $12 million but I'm hopeful that will be enough to get him.

[thecampster]

1st I have heard of this. Do you have a link on this Horford for Rondo trade or pure hope/speculation that we can trade Horford but not Josh for him?

Okay...the reason you can't do Josh for Rondo is because Josh is a F/A and Boston is in the LT. That's the whole point of my statement.

There is no "rumor" for Rondo other than Boston tried to move him (multiple times) before he got hurt. I was just using an example of a player with similar salary to Horford and yes I believe 90% of teams in the league would trade their 12 million dollar a year player for Horford's 12 million.

My point was that it will be easier in the offseason to sign A and B level talent without overpaying if you pair people with others they want to play with.

In the offseason we get to completely remake our roster. I want 3 things: rebounding, interior D and perimeter D. If you see me discussing players, they will fill at least 1 of these needs.

[Buzzard]

Yes NY and Chicago were in different positions with their cap but that still doesn't mean Minnesota will absolutely positively match a max offer to Pekovic. I'm disappointed that we can't offer more than $12 million but I'm hopeful that will be enough to get him.

They will not like paying him 12 mill plus raises. Love is already eating up almost 16 next season and their team did not made the playoffs. Now add in the fact that Rubio's recovery has been a lot slower than expected.

That ties up almost 28 million in two players on a non playoff team. Not a great situation IMO.

[MaceCase]

That is really a fact not a point. Minny has 37.7 in guaranteed contracts going into FA. If they sign Nikola to something near max or max early in the FA process ( your 3 day rule ) they can toss out most of their FA money this season and next.

They may very well match but they will not like it. Especially if they have to do it early. Make your offer. He either jumps like a Boozer on sound advice from his agent or waits giving his team a chance to grab a FA.

Uhm, when did Minnesota become this Free Agent hot spot? So Pekovic is practically the best free agent that Minnesota could hope to attain/retain in the offseason yet you think they'd let him walk to pursue.......who exactly?

It depends on who else the other 9-10 players are on the roster. I suspect that we'll have guys like Korver, Devin, etc. who are productive vets to fill out the roster. You are right about Lou recovering from his ACL as that will slow him down most likely. I'm optimistic that the guys we get at 17-18 can come in and contribute in some form as well to at least be better than the end of the bench guys we had this year.

How would you suggest tanking then in that situation, just tell the players to quit trying? I can't see the guys doing that and to be honest until Horford proves that he can't be in the playoffs then I'm going to expect him to be in there. 2 straight national championships and now what 6 straight NBA playoff appearances it's been forever since he's been on a team who hasn't been at least a playoff team.

Yes NY and Chicago were in different positions with their cap but that still doesn't mean Minnesota will absolutely positively match a max offer to Pekovic. I'm disappointed that we can't offer more than $12 million but I'm hopeful that will be enough to get him.

You wouldn't need to tell them to tank, that team simply isn't talented enough. The whole point AHF and I are making is not throwing money away on B list and C list free agents with the express goal of only making the Playoffs so you can't use that as a point against us. That shouldn't even be the goal any longer for this team after shipping off Marvin and Joe. Al and a bunch of mid first round 1st and 2nd year players has no hope at any meaningful accomplishment in the playoffs with slim hope of even getting there in the first place. It is not difficult at all to say "hey big guy, instead of playing 40 minutes a night trying to carry these kids I suggest you take a day or 5 off to heal your nagging injuries unless risking your career for a 1st round exit sounds more appealing to you."

[Buzzard]

Okay...the reason you can't do Josh for Rondo is because Josh is a F/A and Boston is in the LT. That's the whole point of my statement.

There is no "rumor" for Rondo other than Boston tried to move him (multiple times) before he got hurt. I was just using an example of a player with similar salary to Horford and yes I believe 90% of teams in the league would trade their 12 million dollar a year player for Horford's 12 million.

My point was that it will be easier in the offseason to sign A and B level talent without overpaying if you pair people with others they want to play with.

In the offseason we get to completely remake our roster. I want 3 things: rebounding, interior D and perimeter D. If you see me discussing players, they will fill at least 1 of these needs.

There is a reason 90% of those teams would do it. Its because our 12 million a year player is better than theirs. And you wanting better rebounding and interior D makes 100% sense, but you completely lost me when you started saying trading away our best rebounder and interior player is the best way to go about accomplishing that.

[thecampster]

A trio of Rondo/Dwight/Josh would never sniff a title so I would rather keep Horford and let Teague walk. Bring in some scrubs on 1 year deals and tank for a high pick in the starstudded 2014 draft. I don't see why people keep insisting on Rondo/Howard/Smith. How do you not realize that this is a terrible combo? This would be like the Nets. The cap would be maxed out and you wouldn't have a shot at a title. Terrible position to be in. I'm tired of being a treadmill team and I don't see how every one doesn't feel the same. I don't want any part of Jefferson or Mayo either.

and who says the Celtics would trade Rondo for Horford in the first place?

A trio of Rondo, Dwight, Josh will cost you 12/18/14 respectively. About 44 million a year. With Lou, Jenkins, Scott on the roster and 2 1st rounders you are at 53 million. You still have Teague as an asset and the 2 first rounders plus future firsts. My original point on this stated signing Reddick for about 7 million and using Teague and the 1st rounders in trades as well as sign and trades for our old talent. So picture this roster.

Rondo/Williams/Mack

Reddick/Jenkins/filler

Smith/Pick

Scott/johnson

Howard/Zaza/filler

Approximate cost - $68 million

Defensively that is probably one of the best teams the league has seen in years, is under the LT and can score from anywhere on the floor. The main problem is depth. Yes that team is a contender.

Now assume you keep Teague/Horford and lose Rondo/Johnson. You start out 3 million more in Salary. But next year you have to resign Teague and its at approximately 9-10 a year. You are in the LT.

[Guest]

The new CBA is so much better and smarter than the old one. A bad contract is only 4 years long vs 5 for the stealing team. 3 yrs out and it becomes a valuable expiring. And what I am suggesting is not like Detroit at all. They gave big money to tweeners like Charlie V, best season 6.7 rpg, as a power forward and Ben Gordon, 6'3" shooting guard who has never rebounded or passed very well.

Both Evans and Pekovic play their positions very well unlike Charlie and Gordon. Everyone talks about what Memphis and GSW are doing and its because of balance. Teague, Evans, SF?, Horford, Pekovic gives us balance. You will not steal players away by paying them a fair price. Not going to happen.

It may not take a max for Evans but centers who can play their position will not come cheap.

EXPIRINGS PEOPLE! EXPIRINGS!

Edited May 16, 2013 by hawksfanatic

[Buzzard]

Uhm, when did Minnesota become this Free Agent hot spot? So Pekovic is practically the best free agent that Minnesota could hope to attain/retain in the offseason yet you think they'd let him walk to pursue.......who exactly?

Minnesota is not a hot spot but they are not a playoff team either. With or without Pekovic. I am not saying them letting him walk is a lock. But not playing all your cards in FA is kind of slow minded.

We need a center, Howard says no. What exactly is the harm in making a solid offer to Nikola? Especially since it only ties up 12 million for three days and still leaves us plenty of cap money for other FAs.

You just need to get use to the fact that one 12 million dollar offer for three days is not the end of the world for us this season. Minnesota decides Pekovic and Love are worth a combined 28 million ( 50% of their total cap ) next season, so be it. But at least we made a run instead of just sitting around talking about what might have been.

[MaceCase]

They will not like paying him 12 mill plus raises. Love is already eating up almost 16 next season and their team did not made the playoffs. Now add in the fact that Rubio's recovery has been a lot slower than expected.

That ties up almost 28 million in two players on a non playoff team. Not a great situation IMO.

Here's the thing though. Love was the one injured all last season, Love has the greatest trade value, Love has a backup that they drafted 2nd overall, Love plays at a position where there is an overabundance of performers league-wide to find replacements from and Love has already publicly complained about management making him the next likely star diva to start his own "nightmare".

So given all this, why would they give up on a 27 year old CENTER that lead them in scoring and rebounds for no compensation when he can only sign for a more cap friendly deal from an opposing team? It doesn't make sense in the least and even if your point holds true in that they don't think that that is a playoff team you still don't rid your ability of being able to trade that valuable asset later for a decent return especially when it is not constricting your cap in the present or near future.