Has ferry made you regret the Johnson trade with the way the season is going?

[Diesel]

When a super hot woman calls you up out of the blue and says she wants to hook up with you, you don't go looking for an even hotter woman, you accept and say thank you ma'am may I have another!

I don't disagree.

However, when the Super Hot Woman says, you have to take me to the best restaurant in town and order the Lobster.... and at the end of the night, you won't even get a kiss... Are you telling me that even then, you don't try to negotiate?

You just accept her terms?

Because she's hot? Super Hot??

I'm not willing to believe that there was due diligence done because had Joe been shopped, there would have been some news about it... from other GMs. Moreover, had Joe been Shopped, he wouldn't have been Shocked!!!

What were your initial thoughts when you were traded to the Brooklyn Nets,?

JJ: To be honest, I had no clue. At the time, things were so up in the air. Deron [Williams] hadn’t signed because he was still undecided. I was really walking into a blind situation. I didn’t know what was going on.

JJ has an agent. Had JJ's name gone over the wire as being talked about in trades, his agent , Arn Tellem, who is one of the most powerful men in Sports would have known and would have told JJ.

[macdaddy]

I don't disagree.

However, when the Super Hot Woman says, you have to take me to the best restaurant in town and order the Lobster.... and at the end of the night, you won't even get a kiss... Are you telling me that even then, you don't try to negotiate?

You just accept her terms?

Because she's hot? Super Hot??

I'm not willing to believe that there was due diligence done because had Joe been shopped, there would have been some news about it... from other GMs. Moreover, had Joe been Shopped, he wouldn't have been Shocked!!!

JJ has an agent. Had JJ's name gone over the wire as being talked about in trades, his agent , Arn Tellem, who is one of the most powerful men in Sports would have known and would have told JJ.

Joe was shocked and had no clue that the fans hated seeing the team play like shiite and get waxed in the playoffs so I don't think him not seeing the trade coming means much.

It's hard to find any nba observer who doesn't think we got a helluva deal so i'm not sure what the debate is here.

[Diesel]

It's hard to find any nba observer who doesn't think we got a helluva deal so i'm not sure what the debate is here.

We got a helluva deal?? I think the words you meant were we got out of his contract.

First and foremost, the Nets add talent to their roster. They also didn't have much to get Johnson. They were able to avoid giving up MarShon Brooks and their own first-rounder in 2013. The Nets still have their $5 million mid-level exception (used on Bosnian stretch forward Mirza Teletovic) and their $1.95 million bi-annual exception. They also still have Bird rights on unrestricted free agent high-flyer Gerald Green.

.And if Williams leaves, the Nets have a superstar to market around heading into their first season at the $1 billion Barclays Center. They could always try and pair Johnson with unrestricted free agent Steve Nash in the event Williams bolts to Dallas.

http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/brooklyn-nets/post/_/id/5019/rapid-reaction-nets-agree-to-johnson-trade

In a world where your deal leads you to cap flexibility in the very next offseason... and big FAs are available, the end of the trade and what makes the trade a win or a loss is what did you do with your cap space?

AFTER losing Marvin's 8, Joe's 21, and Smove's 12 Million... The real question is not did we win the Joe Johnson trade, the question is what did we get from the Joe Johnson trade?

We're not in the playoffs. We're not in the lottery... We have an allstar who is not really making much of a difference in wins-losses.

And like always we have a fan base that has turned their venom on the next player in line.

~41 Million dollars in savings for Ferry but what did we get?

[Duff_Man]

~41 Million dollars in savings for Ferry but what did we get?

We got rid of Allan Houston part 2. But I guess when you can pay 30+ year old Joe Johnson more than Lebron James, you spent wisely.

[Admin]

We got a helluva deal?? I think the words you meant were we got out of his contract.

In a world where your deal leads you to cap flexibility in the very next offseason... and big FAs are available, the end of the trade and what makes the trade a win or a loss is what did you do with your cap space?

AFTER losing Marvin's 8, Joe's 21, and Smove's 12 Million... The real question is not did we win the Joe Johnson trade, the question is what did we get from the Joe Johnson trade?

We're not in the playoffs. We're not in the lottery... We have an allstar who is not really making much of a difference in wins-losses.

And like always we have a fan base that has turned their venom on the next player in line.

~41 Million dollars in savings for Ferry but what did we get?

That article is wrong we DID get their 2013 1st rounder. But your contention here is that you'd have been happy if we got Brooks (who's proven to be useless) or Green (journeyman player)?

In the end we have 20 million in extra cap space through 2016, we got Bebe and we got Muscala. I'll take all of those over having an aging JJ eating up a HUGE chunk of our payroll.

[Diesel]

We got rid of Allan Houston part 2. But I guess when you can pay 30+ year old Joe Johnson more than Lebron James, you spent wisely.

When I talk about us getting something, I'm talking about ON THE COURT.

For all this talk of cap flexibility, this summer, we will be able to offer that big name FA... 4 year 29.89 Million dollars. That's it.

Let's see... Everybody keeps saying Stephenson this and Lance that. Do you think he's coming here for 4 yrs, 29.89 Million dollars?

So yes, we got rid of Joe for Expiring contracts and 1 protected pick and 1 swap of picks. Clap Clap.

However, after Ferry has done all of his magic...

ON the Court.... What do we have? An 8th seed, first round out, treadmill team!! Welcome back to the starting line.

[Admin]

When I talk about us getting something, I'm talking about ON THE COURT.

For all this talk of cap flexibility, this summer, we will be able to offer that big name FA... 4 year 29.89 Million dollars. That's it.

Let's see... Everybody keeps saying Stephenson this and Lance that. Do you think he's coming here for 4 yrs, 29.89 Million dollars?

So yes, we got rid of Joe for Expiring contracts and 1 protected pick and 1 swap of picks. Clap Clap.

However, after Ferry has done all of his magic...

ON the Court.... What do we have? An 8th seed, first round out, treadmill team!! Welcome back to the starting line.

Your numbers for next year aren't accurate, see the salary thread. Plus we have 17.5 million in expiring contracts we can trade. We have a lot of flexibility.

[Guest]

That article is wrong we DID get their 2013 1st rounder. But your contention here is that you'd have been happy if we got Brooks (who's proven to be useless) or Green (journeyman player)?

In the end we have 20 million in extra cap space through 2016, we got Bebe and we got Muscala. I'll take all of those over having an aging JJ eating up a HUGE chunk of our payroll.

And don't forget the trade exception that got us Kyle Korver.

Ferry probably preferred the trade exception instead of taking on the salaries of Brooks and Green.

Edited March 13, 2014 by JayBirdHawk

[Admin]

And don't forget the trade exception that got us Kyle Korver.

Ferry probably preferred the trade exception instead of taking on the salaries of Brooks and Green.

Good point I forgot about that and yes I agree I'd much rather have Korver than either of those 2 guys. Although at the time I wanted Brooks based on the few games I'd see him play well. Looking back there's no doubt Ferry made the right move.

[Diesel]

Your numbers for next year aren't accurate, see the salary thread. Plus we have 17.5 million in expiring contracts we can trade. We have a lot of flexibility.

You right. They are contingent on us keeping Mack, Bebe, and Scott. I took the liberty of saying that those guys are guys we probably wanted to see more of. Unlike yourself, I don't think Teague has to be on the trade blocks for us to keep Mack. Simply because all rumors suggest that Bud isn't a big fan of Dennis and he likes Mack. The Playing Time ferry says the same thing.

And no... The cap number isn't set in stone, but based on the last 2 years, we seems to be settling to a figure around 58-59 million.

True. We can trade players... My guess is the ones to go will be DMC, Sapp, and Korver.. or Al. I don't see teams having any value in Lou Williams until around the deadline and even then, it will be for some albatross contract.

Maybe Ferry can slip Williams in with DMC and get good value back for both of them. Because we won't get back equal value for a solo trade of DMC.

[Admin]

You right. They are contingent on us keeping Mack, Bebe, and Scott. I took the liberty of saying that those guys are guys we probably wanted to see more of. Unlike yourself, I don't think Teague has to be on the trade blocks for us to keep Mack. Simply because all rumors suggest that Bud isn't a big fan of Dennis and he likes Mack. The Playing Time ferry says the same thing.

And no... The cap number isn't set in stone, but based on the last 2 years, we seems to be settling to a figure around 58-59 million.

True. We can trade players... My guess is the ones to go will be DMC, Sapp, and Korver.. or Al. I don't see teams having any value in Lou Williams until around the deadline and even then, it will be for some albatross contract.

Maybe Ferry can slip Williams in with DMC and get good value back for both of them. Because we won't get back equal value for a solo trade of DMC.

If there's a market for Lou it would probably be a team looking to unload a contract with at least 2 years remaining on it while we give them his expiring deal. Or more than likely he'd be a throw in along with someone more talented to allow us to take back a bigger contract. He's definitely going to have value next year even if it's not on the court.

[macdaddy]

There also seems to be an equating of Joe to the size of his contract in what we gave up. In my opinion we didn't give up much to get all those assets (picks, trade exception etc) Joe wasn't doing much for us at the point he was traded except taking up payroll. So to look at it as we gave up a max guy/all star simply to save money is just wrong. We gave up a guy who was not doing his job well enough.

[Diesel]

There also seems to be an equating of Joe to the size of his contract in what we gave up. In my opinion we didn't give up much to get all those assets (picks, trade exception etc) Joe wasn't doing much for us at the point he was traded except taking up payroll. So to look at it as we gave up a max guy/all star simply to save money is just wrong. We gave up a guy who was not doing his job well enough.

For Deron Williams, JJ was greater motivation to stay in Brooklyn than to go to Dallas and play before his home crowd with Dirk.

I promise you if Ferry would have cleared the books of Marvin and Josh, a star player would have been more willing to come to Atlanta to play with Joe/Horf than they are to come to Atlanta to play with Horf. Joe was at the CAA summit where it was decided that Lebron, Wade, and Bosh would team up. Joe had a chance to go to NY prior to BKLYN.. Instead of that, he choose to stay with us (for the max).

[macdaddy]

For Deron Williams, JJ was greater motivation to stay in Brooklyn than to go to Dallas and play before his home crowd with Dirk.

I promise you if Ferry would have cleared the books of Marvin and Josh, a star player would have been more willing to come to Atlanta to play with Joe/Horf than they are to come to Atlanta to play with Horf. Joe was at the CAA summit where it was decided that Lebron, Wade, and Bosh would team up. Joe had a chance to go to NY prior to BKLYN.. Instead of that, he choose to stay with us (for the max).

That's an interesting thought but you have to wonder now how many people there were who would have taken Josh without sending out a bad contract. And then who would that star player have been and what could we have offered with Joe/horford on the books. Its not so hypothetical that we can look at the possibilities. Our chance would have been last summer to get the star player but i don't see us having Joe and Horford enticing CP3 or Dwight. So who could we have gotten?

[NBASupes]

[Guest]

hahahahahahahahahaha - I did not expect that!

Edited March 13, 2014 by JayBirdHawk

[MaceCase]

For Deron Williams, JJ was greater motivation to stay in Brooklyn than to go to Dallas and play before his home crowd with Dirk.

I promise you if Ferry would have cleared the books of Marvin and Josh, a star player would have been more willing to come to Atlanta to play with Joe/Horf than they are to come to Atlanta to play with Horf. Joe was at the CAA summit where it was decided that Lebron, Wade, and Bosh would team up. Joe had a chance to go to NY prior to BKLYN.. Instead of that, he choose to stay with us (for the max).

Soooooo you mention money being a primary motivator for Joe staying in Atlanta but then you omit it as another reason Deron stayed in Brooklyn. Real interesting spin there.

[Sothron]

You can tell the season is kinda bad when we're having an eight page discussion about a trade that was over two years ago.

[Diesel]

That's an interesting thought but you have to wonder now how many people there were who would have taken Josh without sending out a bad contract. And then who would that star player have been and what could we have offered with Joe/horford on the books. Its not so hypothetical that we can look at the possibilities. Our chance would have been last summer to get the star player but i don't see us having Joe and Horford enticing CP3 or Dwight. So who could we have gotten?

Right after we signed Joe to the Max. We should have gotten Smoove and Marvin out the door. Let's be all the way honest here. The ASG signed Joe to the Max because they were on the cusp of selling the team and there was lots of big talk of Joe going to NY to be reunited with Amare, Melo, and D'Antoni. We were coming off of a playoffs where Joe was booed at home and there were more other teams fans than Hawks fans in the building... And Joe had give a two finger salute to the fans or something. However, after we signed Joe, it was time to get the menance out of the lockerroom. Smoove had plenty value. Hell, Smoove still had value when Ferry let him walk for nothing. But ending the project called Marvin and getting Smoove out of here would have been better for the franchise back when we resigned Joe. It would have given us room on the blueprint to build a team.. maybe one of these super teams. Maybe we could have gotten our C position finally fixed. However, that's neither here nor there now.

Who could we have gotten if we had dumped Josh + Marvin's 21 Million and Kept Joe...

Based on the figures at Peachtreehoops.

Going into last offseason, with Guaranteed contracts...including Joe....

We would have Joe, Al, Jenkins... and I'll throw in Mack and Scott... That equals: 32.83 Million.

That would have hypothetically left us with 25.7 Million to team build with.

I believe with JJ there, we could have signed Teague a lot quicker for a lot less... but let's say... we resigned Teague at the 8 Million here's getting. that takes us to 40.83 Million and we're working with only 17.7 Million to team build with. You actually could have gone with whoever you wanted to.

[Diesel]

Soooooo you mention money being a primary motivator for Joe staying in Atlanta but then you omit it as another reason Deron stayed in Brooklyn. Real interesting spin there.

No.. not at all. I followed Deron's lead...

"I am really excited to be able to officially say that Brooklyn is home," Williams said in a statement on Wednesday. "It is an incredible time to play in Brooklyn and to be a part of this organization, the first sports team to call Brooklyn home in over 50 years."

The 28-year-old told reporters in Vegas that he was leaning toward picking the Mavericks, but changed his mind when the Nets acquired Joe Johnson from the Atlanta Hawks .

"I actually thought that's where I was going to go," Williams said. "I had the meetings and it kind of changed my mind because once I got out of the meeting with Dallas and saw the way they were going and the team they were putting out there, and I saw that we just made a trade for Joe Johnson and I felt like that team for a longer time would be the better team."

Everybody believed that Deron was going to Dallas. IN fact, the first rendition of the Joe trade was conditional upon Deron resigning with the Nets (if I'm not mistaken). So without Joe, The Money didn't seem to have an effect on DW. Remember, DW just finished a HORRIBLE season with the Nets. Now maybe Deron is lying and it was all about the money for him... and that's possible... but ask yourself, how many superstar players want to take big money to play for a losing team who is not serious about winning?