Symbolism in the Hawks Current Situation and Comparsion with Indy

[PSSSHHHRRR87]

Had a thought occur to me while I was thinking about the Hawks last night... We are currently seeded 8th in the East and although most of us would love for us to tank out of the playoffs, it just doesn't look like it's going to happen. And even if the Knicks do catch us, our record will likely still be too good to get a top 10 pick anyway. But of the three teams chasing us - the Cavs, Pistons, and Knicks - all have ties to our past. I know that this will likely make me out to sound like a hippie pot smoker, but think about it, those teams do have ties to us in some way...

[*]Cleveland's ties is through Danny Ferry. It was the previous team that he was a GM for and it ended up with him being canned. [*]Detroit's ties is none other than Josh Smith. Our previous face of the franchise who the Hawks had a strong love/hate relationship with. The local kid with a screw loose... [*]New York's ties is the coach that started WLOC, ISO-Woody.

Our past head coach, our past face of the franchise, and Danny's past GM gig, all in our rear view. It's kinda saying that those guys are in the past, but with us being an 8th seed, it's also saying that the Hawks have a long way to go to being the alpha dog.

How DO that Hawks get there? Do we take the Indy route and build a team through drafting well, developing talent, and signing a key free agent or do we take the Miami route? Or maybe the Brooklyn route (trading for a bunch of has-been stars) although most would agree that $80 million in luxury tax would send our ownership to the morgue. Miami route is possible; however Dwight and CP3 put a chink in the Atlanta pipe dream for going that route. Indy route is most likely for the Hawks, but how DO we get there? Well, for starters...

1. Frank Vogel: We need a strong coaching staff. Bud and gang have shown promise this season. Active coach that players respect. He gets every ounce out of the roster, has an eye for talent, and knows how to develop talent. And not to leave out his Pop pedigree.

2. Roy Hibbert: We need a starting center. Enough is enough. Horford has now shown twice that the bigger guys BRUTALIZE him with two season-ending pectoral tears. No more of leaving Horford at a 5 to get abused for another two years. What are we trying to do - abuse him straight out of town? I'm surprised Hawks' fans haven't called the domestic abuse hotline on this organization. I understand that Dwight was really the only serious option in 2013, but this offseason, priority number one needs to be getting Horford to 4. Permanently. Possible answers at 5: Greg Monroe, Marcin Gortat (reasonable contract), trading for Omer Asik (and not giving Houston shit), or drafting WCS. I also believe that if we get said center, Horford will resign. PS - Indy traded for Hibbert.

3. Paul George: We need a leader on the floor and a go-to scorer. Teague will never develop this gene. Horford has no desire to be the leader; that's why he loved Osh. Presently, KKK (Killa Kyle Korver) is our most reliable scorer, followed by the peg-legged, toll-free defense, Lou Williams. lulz rain down all around the league on that fact. No disrespect meant to my main man Kyle, but we need a guy for this organization to latch onto. We need that locomotive player that can pull this team into the station. Who will that be? How will we attain this player? How much longer do Hawks' fans have to lie in agony for this savior to come to the promise land? 20 ppg, 4 asts, 4 rebs, and a PER of 22 is all I ask for... Possibilities: Drafting Rodney Hood, James Young, Bogdan Bogdanovic, or Dario Saric. I don't see any free agents being a fix outside of the 0.05% chance that LBJ or Melo signing here. Maybe Evan Turner or Luol Deng. Maybe.

4. David West: Who will be the Hawks key free agent pickup? You can't build your roster entirely through the draft. Even the Spurs-way crowd knows this. You got to get that one player to "buy-in" to what you are trying to accomplish. This is the toughest hurdle to hurdle for every business in the world. Is it Paul Millsap? Can't be if the goal is win a championship. I love your heart Paul and what you do for us, but this team is only big enough for one starting PF and with Horford's past with Atlanta, his consistent play, and the extra 2-inches of height gives him a tip of the cap, so who will be this player? Is he our Roy Hibbert or Paul George: a kill two birds with one stone scenario? Or is he some out in left field unknown.

5. Team Pine: We need a strong, reliable bench. I believe KK and DMC were signed to strengthen the bench. KK signed longer because he is proven while Demarre received a shorter deal because he wasn't (but now is). Schröder can be our backup PG and I believe Scott is great for the bench too. This ball is already rolling, but who will be our 10-13? Who will round this team off? Is Muscala and Bebe apart of this?


The most interesting factoid about the Pacers is that despite being the number team in the East, their attendance numbers rank only 15th. Attendance problems eh? Now that sounds awfully familiar, but for you jump to conclusions on Atlanta, don't forget that the city of Atlanta is a plus for us. We aren't like Sacramento, Milwaukee, Minneapolis, or other perennial lottery teams. We do have Hotlanta aka New York South aka Southern Capital of the World aka Black Hollywood aka the A working for us. Or for the family man player, one of the greatest cities in North America to raise a family. This is a city where players actually WANT to live.

We can also sell our new culture too (uhhhh... not THAT word again, right? HawksFanatić, grab your rumple and where's my whiskey? :sip sip chug:). Sure our record isn't currently indicative of a winning tradition, but when was the last time we had a coach like Bud? Lenny Wilkens? And if I recall correctly, past Atlanta GM's never took trips to Europe to personally scout players like Ferry has. No one on this board knows what a day is like for a GM or what Ferry is thinking. They say the best businesses in the world are great from the top down. Well, ownership is minding their business, our GM has done well (but imagine IF Josh actually accepted that 3-year extension... oh myyy), and our coaching staff is one that is top 5 in the league. Time to get the roster right which involves time and fans getting impatient and discouraged. The 15th pick and an 8th seed in the playoffs is better than the 13th pick and no playoffs. We didn't tank soon enough to get top 10. Sorry amigo.


Basically our current roster looks like this as it compares to Indy:

C - ???
PF - Horford ---> Our David West
SF - ???
SG - ???
PG - Teague ---> Our George Hill (same contract too)
6th - KK ---> Similar to Turner
7th - Schröder ---> Our backup PG
8th - DMC ---> Our poor man's Stephenson for the bench. Our "back bone".
9th - Scott ---> Similar to Scola
10th - ??? ---> Backup center
11th - ??? ---> The token swiss-army knife & "leader of the locker room"
12th - ??? ---> Third center
13th - ??? ---> Third PG (not Mack)

MAJOR holes to fill, but this roster is young. Ferry has time on his side, but there is no time to waste. Ferry must make every move count or we will lose Horford and miss our window.

[Diesel]

Welcome to the conversation.

I have a theory about us and FAs. Here it is.

Diesel's Theory on Atlanta Hawks FAcy. (DTHOAH)

Superstar/Star Free Agents won't be attracted to Atlanta because we don't have a good trackrecord with either winning or treating the players well. To the Superstar, we look like a team that Whore's out good vets until we don't need them any longer and then we don't respectfully move them, instead, we leave them out to dry. Unfortunately, Ferry has personified this in his short reign here. Therefore, we are left with middling players. These are players who could be stars/superstars, but they have some flaws to their game. And we will have to overpay middling players to come here.

For instance, we talk about how great Sapp was. The truth is that Sapp was 29, coming off his worst season and looking like he was on the down side of his career when we picked him up. That's why Sapp signed a 2 year deal. DMC wasn't even a middling player. He couldn't beat out Marvin for the starting spot in Utah.

Back in BK's time, there was Crawford. He was a player considered going nowhere because his defense was bad and he was considered a chucker.

What should we do about this? All we can do is embrace it. Realize that there's no point in going after a big name, we need to do right by the middling players we have.

[GrimeyKidd]

I love ur observation psh. But i think we could give the pacers a run for their money with a non biased officiating group

[NBASupes]

Man, Horf is 10x better than West and Indy is much better due to their drafting. We still need a Paul George talent and numerous other things. This is a bad franchise.

[PSSSHHHRRR87]

Man, Horf is 10x better than West and Indy is much better due to their drafting. We still need a Paul George talent and numerous other things. This is a bad franchise.

And that's the beauty of it. We are better in some spots. I'd take Horford and Teague over West and Hill. Because we do have Horford and Teague that can carry some of the burden on offense, we really only need a poor man's Paul George. 16 ppg, 5 rebs, few assists. 2 + 2 = 4, but 3+1 also equals 4. That's why I love Rodney Hood. I see that type of guy for us. We agreed that he is a taller Kendall Gill... Kendall Gill would work at 3 for us. Really, the most important thing about this team is getting Horford to 4. We can't even get to the ECF with Horford starting at 5 and we will ultimately lose Horford to FAncy if we don't get him where he belongs.

My offseason to-do list for Ferry:

[*]Bring in a legit 7'0", 260+ lbs center. Draft, free agency, trade, whatever. All we need from him is 8-10 ppg, 10+ rebs, and defense. Hawksquawk faves Gortat and Asik are fine. Not sold on WCS, but if there when we pick, he's worth the gamble. There are also potential gems in the second round to fill this need (see A.J. Hammons and Walter Tavares). A disgruntled Marc Gasol would be the jackpot.

[*]Make sure item number 1 is completed before moving on.

[*]As for the draft, draft BPA for SG, SF, or C. Then burn second round pick on either another center or a 3rd PG.

[*]Fill remaining holes with stopgaps til 2015. Leave Bebe in Spain for another year.

[Final_quest]

Has it been determined if our draft pick is based on our record or will teams with better records than us get a better pick because they didn't make the playoffs?

[Jody23]

Has it been determined if our draft pick is based on our record or will teams with better records than us get a better pick because they didn't make the playoffs?

Unless we win the lottery by drawing one of the top three picks, our pick will be based on record. And yes, the Western Conference teams with better records that don't make the playoffs will have a better pick than the Hawks if the Hawks are in the playoffs.

[NBASupes]

I like your ideas just don't think as highly about some of the players as you do. I don't think Hood will be as good as Gill, I see more Kittles than anything. No Hibbert or superstar like George is critical.

[Randy]

The OP's point 2 is a big part of the problem. The Hawks group of owners/GM's etc for years have all believed that you don't need at big starting center. ZaZa was the best of the bunch and they let him go and he was a career backup. They have refused to draft or sign anyone who was close to being a legit 7' starting center.

At present Moose is probably the closest we will come to that, and I hope he does well. I don't know if its that they believe the nonsense about Horford being an All Star center, or they are sold on "small ball" or what - but at best centers, particular NBA sized centers are at most an afterthought, or a llllllloooooooonnnnnnnnnggggggg term project like BeBe that may never turn out. I would not be surprised if he ends up having a Hawks career like Cink Akyol. (Or whatever his name was.) "Stashed overseas" till he was used to complete a trade designed to profit from luxury tax arbitrage. Bottom line - they simply don't want an NBA sized starting center.